Pelicans finalizing trade for Asik

[kclaboy504]

Why just the final 4, Because it proves your point? What about the past 5 champions? What about the last years playoff teams?

exactly lol

[Eman5805]

Indeed. Throne was one of most well known critics of Davis predraft.

Gotta hand it to him. He's been consistent.

[da ThRONe]

Why just the final 4, Because it proves your point? What about the past 5 champions? What about the last years playoff teams?

Because as a GM that is my goal. To be a title contender not just a playoff team.

[RaisingTheBar]

Let's look at the champions. I'll bold which one's fit the drafted core model:

Spurs
Heat
Heat
Mavs
Lakers
Lakers
Celtics
Spurs

The past decade very few teams were able to be successful via the OKC/Spurs model with all the stars wanting to join up.

[da ThRONe]

please explain why you don't.

I miss interpreted what he was saying and edited my comment already.

[NMThreeMVP]

I think anybody that is familiar with my post the last 3 years or so will tell you I'm equally as opinionate before. I have laid out at each stage what it is I would have done differently starting with the Eric Gordon situation. If you truly interested you can go back and check if you really think I'm using the power of hindsight. I even made a thread assuming the role of GM last offseason. Dig it up if you like.

I'm more so interested in which teams in similar situations as the Pelicans in 2012, you feel are further along?

I guess my point is, we started with pretty much a RFA Eric Gordon, Pick #1, and Pick #10 in 2012. Now we have a team two years later that will be competing for a playoff spot while being one of the youngest teams in the league.

Would you trade our roster and situation for any non playoff teams that's currently in the lottery? What about playoff teams... Would you trade our roster for Hornets, Mavs, Grizzlies, Hawks, Nets, or Wizards?

Point being, we're in year 3 of a complete rebuild. What Dell has accomplished, especially considering he screwed up by matching Gordon, is very impressive.

[da ThRONe]

I'm more so interested in which teams in similar situations as the Pelicans in 2012, you feel are further along?

I guess my point is, we started with pretty much a RFA Eric Gordon, Pick #1, and Pick #10 in 2012. Now we have a team two years later that will be competing for a playoff spot while being one of the youngest teams in the league.

Would you trade our roster and situation for any non playoff teams that's currently in the lottery? What about playoff teams... Would you trade our roster for Hornets, Mavs, Grizzlies, Hawks, Nets, or Wizards?

Point being, we're in year 3 of a complete rebuild. What Dell has accomplished, especially considering he screwed up by matching Gordon, is very impressive.

Here's my problem I don't think this roster is sustainable and it still isn't a guaranteed playoff team let alone a title contender. If you think we can afford to re-sign all of Asik/Anderson/Holiday/Evans all in the next 1-3 years while adding necessary depth and doing it without having a deep playoff run then I can see why people are more on the positive side. I on the other hand see this as a tiny chance of happening.

[Trell]

Same as I've told MVP if you are really interested into my take on things they are well documented here.

edit: Also I don't see Davis as the best player on a title team so there's that.

So I could understand more that you never previously answered. What does Davis have to do to prove that he's on pace to be a number one option in a championship team? He's ahead of his time and getting better yearly, donyounreally think he wont? Do you fell Drummond will be a number one option on a championship.

[bradael]

Because as a GM that is my goal. To be a title contender not just a playoff team.

Two of those four have the two best players in the league. Another has one of the best players of all time.

If Davis becomes one of the 2 or 3 best players in the league, it doesn't matter how the rest of the team was built around him as long as there are some good players... they'll still make the conference finals worst case scenario at some point.

[da ThRONe]

So I could understand more that you never previously answered. What does Davis have to do to prove that he's on pace to be a number one option in a championship team? He's ahead of his time and getting better yearly, donyounreally think he wont? Do you fell Drummond will be a number one option on a championship.

Davis isn't really that go to guy. The majority of his production is in PNR and as a cutter. He has to be able to dominate with the ball. When he does that consistently I'll think he could be the best player on a championship team.

[UptownFuz504]

Two of those four have the two best players in the league. Another has one of the best players of all time.

If Davis becomes one of the 2 or 3 best players in the league, it doesn't matter how the rest of the team was built around him as long as there are some good players... they'll still make the conference finals worst case scenario at some point.

I don't agree with Davis not being a cornerstone but I also don't buy into just add good players around AD and we'll be champions either. There needs to be at least one other game changing type player on this team. We have reached our quota on specialists and role players. It's time to get a dynamic player on this roster to help out AD. We can do this if we select the right SF.

[Sujaguar00]

Here's my problem I don't think this roster is sustainable and it still isn't a guaranteed playoff team let alone a title contender. If you think we can afford to re-sign all of Asik/Anderson/Holiday/Evans all in the next 1-3 years while adding necessary depth and doing it without having a deep playoff run then I can see why people are more on the positive side. I on the other hand see this as a tiny chance of happening.

Those are legit concerns, but 3 yrs is a long time in the NBA. Our roster from 2011 to now is drastically different.

Duncan/Ginobili/Parker is becoming the exception, not the rule. The NBA is changing and waiting for teams to develop into contenders takes time and patience that GM's and coaches simply don't have. Injuries, bad luck, poor coaching, misses in the draft all lead to major changes and starting from scratch.

I understand the "build through the draft" approach, I just don't know how viable it is today when free agents wanting to team up and the short leash teams have.

[Schmide234]

You need more then one cornerstone to be competitive. Dallas is a rare example where they only had one legit superstar and even then Chandler was playing like the best defensive player in the league those playoffs and the rest of them team had career games at key times, all led by a top 5 coach.

This isn't to say our method won't be successful but giving away draft picks like candy can be disastrous. Go look at that Bill Simmons article revisiting the previous drafts. Lots of great talent is found in the draft outside of the top ten and even into the second round. A pick is an asset. For instance look at the pick we gave up for Jerryd Bayless. It turned into number 18 in that draft. At 18 guys like Kenneth Faried and Chandler Parsons were still on the board. The later of which we talk about on here constantly as being the perfect SF for our team. We gave that opportunity up for a temporary rental.

Don't just try and arrogantly dismiss others who put a value on draft picks and other means of building their roster, because there is good reasoning behind a lot of what people are saying. The spurs wouldn't be where they are today if they dumped their draft picks for role players to put around Duncan instead of taking a risk on guys like Parker, Leonard and Ginoboli.

I get what you are trying to say, but hindsight is 20/20. Of course those guys were on the board at 18, but what is the likelihood that you actually pick that guy? You GM and coach have to be truly brilliant to pick a guy late in the draft, or you have to get lucky.

[MichaelMcNamara]

I don't agree with Davis not being a cornerstone but I also don't buy into just add good players around AD and we'll be champions either. There needs to be at least one other game changing type player on this team. We have reached our quota on specialists and role players. It's time to get a dynamic player on this roster to help out AD. We can do this if we select the right SF.

Arent Jrue and Tyreke better than anyone LBJ ever had in Cleveland? Possible to argue Ryno and Asik are as good as anyone he ever had?

Jrue/Tyreke/Asik/Anderson or the next four guys after Durant in OKC?

Multiple ways to skin a cat. If Davis becomes that good, this team has more than enough talent around him. The question is: Will he become THAT good? I bet on yes.

[daybreaker]

Not only are the Spurs the only Champion in the past decade to have a drafted core Big 3/Big 4, but you cant even really count Ginobli. He's a Marques Colston level stroke of luck - he didnt even play in the US for the next 3 years after being drafted 58th. And you wouldnt tell teams "You cant win the Superbowl unless you turn your 7th rounder into a starter".

[UptownFuz504]

Arent Jrue and Tyreke better than anyone LBJ ever had in Cleveland? Possible to argue Ryno and Asik are as good as anyone he ever had?

Jrue/Tyreke/Asik/Anderson or the next four guys after Durant in OKC?

Multiple ways to skin a cat. If Davis becomes that good, this team has more than enough talent around him. The question is: Will he become THAT good? I bet on yes.

Point taken but none of those teams won anything which was my point.

Also, I stand firmly in the Reke is vastly overrated by everyone on PelsReport bucket. He's a shooting guard that needs to play point but not actually good enough to play point. Not that appealing to me personally.

[MichaelMcNamara]

Point taken but none of those teams won anything which was my point.

Also, I stand firmly in the Reke is vastly overrated by everyone on PelsReport bucket. He's a shooting guard that needs to play point but not actually good enough to play point. Not that appealing to me personally.

They didnt win ANYTHING?

If the goal is title or bust, and everything else is a failure, odds say prepare to be disappointed. Best you can do is make yourself a contender and put yourself in position to have a chance. Those teams did that with inferior supporting casts.

[Bee-Fense]

Isn't next year's draft supposed to be pretty bad anyways? Looks that way based on current mocks

[UNO Gracias]

Which goes back to the Memphis team people say needs to be deconstructed. If they can move Prince and net Salmons, and a 2nd rounder...they wont need to take it apart, they will just need to figure out to do with all the extra cash once they wave Salmons. Go grab a few extra pieces, allow Q-Pon to come back healthy, locked and loaded for another WCF run.

[NMThreeMVP]

Here's my problem I don't think this roster is sustainable and it still isn't a guaranteed playoff team let alone a title contender. If you think we can afford to re-sign all of Asik/Anderson/Holiday/Evans all in the next 1-3 years while adding necessary depth and doing it without having a deep playoff run then I can see why people are more on the positive side. I on the other hand see this as a tiny chance of happening.

But dude, we're entering year 3 of a complete gut job and rebuild. Again, who in the bottom 20 of the league would you trade circumstances with? You're comparing what we've done to a perfect scenario of what we could have done in your view, and that's not really all that fair. Given the circumstances, Dell has done a hell of a job. No one in this city, from fans to ownership, would be happy (except for maybe you) if we were pursuing the Magic/76ers/Bucks/Bobcats/Jazz model. That arena would be empty and AD would be counting the days til he can bounce.

Whether or not this team is sustainable, without having any idea where the cap will be in 2 or 3 years, is a conversation for another day. But it's the same conversation you eventually have if you're successful whether you're the Celtics/Heat or Spurs/Thunder.

[UNO Gracias]

Isn't next year's draft supposed to be pretty bad anyways? Looks that way based on current mocks

Amen. This is why I don't get why people are flipping out about this trade. The only problem is, next year we will be in the sellers spot unless we can move Gordon, meaning we will be moving heaven and earth to unload that contract if we want to stay competitive with the rest of the market in terms of slashing salary.

[Tomdda]

LOL @ some folks in here... this is supposed to be the deepest draft in years and you see damm near every team in the top 10 trying to trade the pick.

Next year's draft won't be half as good as this one and people are whining about giving up a pick for a guy that just might put us over the top (and get us in the playoffs). Asik is one of the better defensive bigs in the league that rebounds like crazy.

But nah we don't need him let's keep our draft pick that we might want to trade anyway lol!

I love this trade. Him and AD are gonna be sick on our front line, and we FINALLY get a big that can board. Good job Dell.

That's some fantastic posting right there ladies and gentlemen!

[da ThRONe]

I think again I'm being blamed for having a differing opinion and expressing it. Therefore a lot of people here are asking what I would do differently than proceed to attack me because my way isn't fool proof.

People are making the assumption that I'm saying we can't do it Demps ' way. I would never say things as definitive because I can't predict the future. However I see the problems with his way and think another way is better. If you agree cool, if you want me to explain cool, if you disagree cool, but stop making it seem like I'm trying to steal Christmas because I don't think it's the best way for us to compete for titles.

[Blackout]

What is the best way to compete for rings da ThRONe

[UptownFuz504]

They didnt win ANYTHING?

If the goal is title or bust, and everything else is a failure, odds say prepare to be disappointed. Best you can do is make yourself a contender and put yourself in position to have a chance. Those teams did that with inferior supporting casts.

My bad. I thought we were discussing championships. I agree that a superior player and a decent/good supporting cast can get you close to where you're trying to go.