Tyreke struggles

[Mythrol]

Look, I actually agree with you from time to time, but you are using per 36 completely wrong and it takes away from your arguments. Your underlying point in your previous post actually seems pretty valid, but constantly throwing per 36 around is making some not even want to respond to you. Which is not what anyone wants.

I don't think there's anything wrong with what Guru did in the case of Evans. For his career coming into this season he averaged 35mpg with two years him playing 37mpg or more. Using PER36 to see what his numbers would be like if he played his usual minutes is perfectly valid in this case. Evans is not some scrub bench player that Guru is taking 10mpg and multiplying. People don't want to respond because they have already formed an opinion of Evans in their mind and want to be right. Any stats thrown out would be met with the same criticism because they don't want to believe they are wrong about Evans being terrible.

Anyone that looks at his stats fairly see that he is greatly struggling with jumpers but every other facet of his game is great. The numbers he is putting up with this ragtag thrown together team are solid in his limited minutes. The perception that he needs to be surrounded by great players to be good is just silly. I think the reason per36 is so valid in this argument is look at the numbers he would be averaging with regular minutes with this group. Of course people don't want to listen to that argument, it makes them look silly.

[speedyG]

I don't think there's anything wrong with what Guru did in the case of Evans. For his career coming into this season he averaged 35mpg with two years him playing 37mpg or more. Using PER36 to see what his numbers would be like if he played his usual minutes is perfectly valid in this case. Evans is not some scrub bench player that Guru is taking 10mpg and multiplying. People don't want to respond because they have already formed an opinion of Evans in their mind and want to be right. Any stats thrown out would be met with the same criticism because they don't want to believe they are wrong about Evans being terrible.

Anyone that looks at his stats fairly see that he is greatly struggling with jumpers but every other facet of his game is great. The numbers he is putting up with this ragtag thrown together team are solid in his limited minutes. The perception that he needs to be surrounded by great players to be good is just silly. I think the reason per36 is so valid in this argument is look at the numbers he would be averaging with regular minutes with this group. Of course people don't want to listen to that argument, it makes them look silly.

I think its the other way around. People are constantly making up excuses for Evans, even in this post. "Oh but he could be good if he played with this guy in this system, under this coach in this role, with this lineup, the ragtag team is holding him back.." "he cant make a jumper but he scored 20 ppg in his first season"

No one said he had to be surrounded by great players, by shooters. Otherwise you have spacing issues

Evans put up ok numbers on an awful team where he had freedom to be the man running the team, and you aren't going to win much with Evans as "the man" (plus his numbers have declined every year) Some of you guys cant get over that

Remember when jarrett Jack had the freedom to run our garbage team? He put up similar numbers to what Tyreke did last year. Those stats dont tell the whole story

[HornetGuru]

I don't think there's anything wrong with what Guru did in the case of Evans. For his career coming into this season he averaged 35mpg with two years him playing 37mpg or more. Using PER36 to see what his numbers would be like if he played his usual minutes is perfectly valid in this case. Evans is not some scrub bench player that Guru is taking 10mpg and multiplying. People don't want to respond because they have already formed an opinion of Evans in their mind and want to be right. Any stats thrown out would be met with the same criticism because they don't want to believe they are wrong about Evans being terrible.

Anyone that looks at his stats fairly see that he is greatly struggling with jumpers but every other facet of his game is great. The numbers he is putting up with this ragtag thrown together team are solid in his limited minutes. The perception that he needs to be surrounded by great players to be good is just silly. I think the reason per36 is so valid in this argument is look at the numbers he would be averaging with regular minutes with this group. Of course people don't want to listen to that argument, it makes them look silly.

Thank you, some people dont understand that, im not taking a guy who plays 3.7 minutes a game and putting up his per 36 stats showing he can average 52 points and 22 rebounds a game, if u look at tyreke's numbers throughout his career he averages around 35, this year he has upped his rebounding and assists, if tyreke evans was a starter and played 36 mins this year he WOULD in fact give u around 18 - 6.5 - 6.5 a game

[HornetGuru]

Look, I actually agree with you from time to time, but you are using per 36 completely wrong and it takes away from your arguments. Your underlying point in your previous post actually seems pretty valid, but constantly throwing per 36 around is making some not even want to respond to you. Which is not what anyone wants.

disagree, in the case of tyreke evans i couldn't be using per 36 in more of a correct fashion.

[HornetGuru]

imagine a team with tyreke running the point through the SG position with jrue, gordon hayward, ryan anderson and anthony davis spreading the floor. would be beautiful

[Mythrol]

I think its the other way around. People are constantly making up excuses for Evans, even in this post. "Oh but he could be good if he played with this guy in this system, under this coach in this role, with this lineup, the ragtag team is holding him back.." "he cant make a jumper but he scored 20 ppg in his first season"

No one said he had to be surrounded by great players, by shooters. Otherwise you have spacing issues

Evans put up ok numbers on an awful team where he had freedom to be the man running the team, and you aren't going to win much with Evans as "the man" (plus his numbers have declined every year) Some of you guys cant get over that

Remember when jarrett Jack had the freedom to run our garbage team? He put up similar numbers to what Tyreke did last year. Those stats dont tell the whole story

The fact that you say his numbers have declined every year shows that you aren't interested in examining Evans as a player and want to just blindly hate him. You have your opinion and it's clear you aren't interested in actually discussing him. There's nothing more to be said than we will have to wait and see.

[BallSoHard]

imagine a team with tyreke running the point through the SG position with jrue, gordon hayward, ryan anderson and anthony davis spreading the floor. would be beautiful

Not really. I prefer Jrue have the ball in his hands as a playmaker. Having reke off the bench as the teams secondary ball handler works though.

[speedyG]

The fact that you say his numbers have declined every year shows that you aren't interested in examining Evans as a player and want to just blindly hate him. You have your opinion and it's clear you aren't interested in actually discussing him. There's nothing more to be said than we will have to wait and see.

oh so its ok for you to use his old stats, but when they don't support your argument and I use them, it means I'm blindly hating

[Mythrol]

oh so its ok for you to use his old stats, but when they don't support your argument and I use them, it means I'm blindly hating

I think you misunderstand. It's not about using old stats. It's about being wrong. His stats haven't declined every year.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...evansty01.html

But because you are so blindly hating him you make the story fit your perception, even though it's untrue.

[speedyG]

I think you misunderstand. It's not about using old stats. It's about being wrong. His stats haven't declined every year.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...evansty01.html

But because you are so blindly hating him you make the story fit your perception, even though it's untrue.

Minutes, Points down every year, assists go down 4 years straight. I think you have trouble reading. Minutes are a stat, he lost playing time for a reason and hasn't improved or even matched what he did in his rookie year

[Mythrol]

Minutes, Points down every year, assists go down 4 years straight. I think you have trouble reading. Minutes are a stat, he lost playing time for a reason and hasn't improved or even matched what he did in his rookie year

LOL. Ok buddy.

[speedyG]

And that wasnt even the basis of my argument, the fact that out of all that you nitpick something I put in parentheses shows how much your grasping at straws

[kclaboy504]

I don't think there's anything wrong with what Guru did in the case of Evans. For his career coming into this season he averaged 35mpg with two years him playing 37mpg or more. Using PER36 to see what his numbers would be like if he played his usual minutes is perfectly valid in this case. Evans is not some scrub bench player that Guru is taking 10mpg and multiplying. People don't want to respond because they have already formed an opinion of Evans in their mind and want to be right. Any stats thrown out would be met with the same criticism because they don't want to believe they are wrong about Evans being terrible.

Anyone that looks at his stats fairly see that he is greatly struggling with jumpers but every other facet of his game is great. The numbers he is putting up with this ragtag thrown together team are solid in his limited minutes. The perception that he needs to be surrounded by great players to be good is just silly. I think the reason per36 is so valid in this argument is look at the numbers he would be averaging with regular minutes with this group. Of course people don't want to listen to that argument, it makes them look silly.

The word GREAT is thrown around too loosely on this board. There is nothing about tyreke Evans that is great. Sorry there just isn't. Only 1 person on this team that great can correlate with and I think we know who that is. Great should be reserved for the ones who are truly great. That is not tyreke Evans.

[Inner_GI]

The word GREAT is thrown around too loosely on this board. There is nothing about tyreke Evans that is great. Sorry there just isn't. Only 1 person on this team that great can correlate with and I think we know who that is. Great should be reserved for the ones who are truly great. That is not tyreke Evans.

Tyreke is GREAT at making jumpers after the whistle blows. I honestly don't remember a miss.... just sayin. lol

[kclaboy504]

Tyreke is GREAT at making jumpers after the whistle blows. I honestly don't remember a miss.... just sayin. lol

I literally just laughed out loud n got slapped for almost waking the baby up. Thanks man appreciate it.

[Inner_GI]

I literally just laughed out loud n got slapped for almost waking the baby up. Thanks man appreciate it.

She was probably beyond happy to slap you. I'm sure she had plenty of reasons. They all do.

[RaisingTheBar]

I don't think there's anything wrong with what Guru did in the case of Evans. For his career coming into this season he averaged 35mpg with two years him playing 37mpg or more. Using PER36 to see what his numbers would be like if he played his usual minutes is perfectly valid in this case. Evans is not some scrub bench player that Guru is taking 10mpg and multiplying. People don't want to respond because they have already formed an opinion of Evans in their mind and want to be right. Any stats thrown out would be met with the same criticism because they don't want to believe they are wrong about Evans being terrible.

Anyone that looks at his stats fairly see that he is greatly struggling with jumpers but every other facet of his game is great. The numbers he is putting up with this ragtag thrown together team are solid in his limited minutes. The perception that he needs to be surrounded by great players to be good is just silly. I think the reason per36 is so valid in this argument is look at the numbers he would be averaging with regular minutes with this group. Of course people don't want to listen to that argument, it makes them look silly.

The dude said and I quote "Tyreke is still averaging 18 points 6.5 rebounds 6.5 assists per 36" That is a dumb way of justifing his poor play. The guy is shooting 40% from the field and 15% from 3 (that's not a typo), that is GARBAGE. Per36 doesn't take into account things that actually matter like i don't know fatigue/injury/personnel. He's averaged 36mpg in SACRAMENTO, which is a completely different team; he's never done that in NEW ORLEANS.

disagree, in the case of tyreke evans i couldn't be using per 36 in more of a correct fashion.

No you still overuse way to much, which was the point of my post. Wasn't doing it to be an *** was just trying to be helpful but whatevs idc.

[HornetGuru]

The dude said and I quote "Tyreke is still averaging 18 points 6.5 rebounds 6.5 assists per 36" That is a dumb way of justifing his poor play. The guy is shooting 40% from the field and 15% from 3 (that's not a typo), that is GARBAGE. Per36 doesn't take into account things that actually matter like i don't know fatigue/injury/personnel. He's averaged 36mpg in SACRAMENTO, which is a completely different team; he's never done that in NEW ORLEANS.



No you still overuse way to much, which was the point of my post. Wasn't doing it to be an *** was just trying to be helpful but whatevs idc.

i know u werent being an *** and i know i use it too much, but with THIS point, it was correct and used correctly. Give credit where credits due

[Mythrol]

The dude said and I quote "Tyreke is still averaging 18 points 6.5 rebounds 6.5 assists per 36" That is a dumb way of justifing his poor play. The guy is shooting 40% from the field and 15% from 3 (that's not a typo), that is GARBAGE. Per36 doesn't take into account things that actually matter like i don't know fatigue/injury/personnel. He's averaged 36mpg in SACRAMENTO, which is a completely different team; he's never done that in NEW ORLEANS.

Why are you only harping on his shooting? I've said multiple times he has been awful this year with jump shooting. I've never debated that. You and everyone else hang onto his shooting % for dear life to try and justify this undue hatred of him as if those are the only stats that matter at all and then ridicule/mock people who post other stats that support the belief that Reke is better than people are giving him credit.

He's averaging 10 minutes less per game than he averaged in Sacremento. The ONLY way to fairly assess this year versus previous years with Tyreke is through equalized stats. You can't say all his numbers are down and not account for him playing 33% less minutes per game this year. Ignoring the equalized stats, he is stilling having his highest AST% and TRB% of his career this year and is posting his lowest DRtg of his career. His TOV rate while up from last year is still lower than his career average, as is his FTr. Ironically enough Tyreke is shooting a career high % from 3-10ft. The problem Tyreke is having is this year he is finishing well lower than his career average from around the rim 0-3ft. He is down 14% this year from last year and 10% from his career average. I know people are hating on his jump shot and it definitely is bad, but he's taking 75% of his shots within 10ft of the basket. I'm not sure it's as big of an issue as people make it out to be. If he averages his career average from around the rim, what exactly can people complain about?

My biggest issue is people act like the only thing that matters is shooting and ignore all the other ways Tyreke impacts the game. I'm fine with people not liking Tyreke but they should at least be even when trying to assess a player and look at all stats instead of ignoring the ones that would change their opinion of him.

[PolishFan]

it would be great if the pelicans shooting coaches could teach tyreke and aminu to shoot..

[SilkySlim]

Evans put up ok numbers on an awful team where he had freedom to be the man running the team, and you aren't going to win much with Evans as "the man" (plus his numbers have declined every year) Some of you guys cant get over that

This is how dumb this argument is though. Know how easy it is to turn it around on you?

AD is only putting up good numbers on a crap team where he's the only decent big who plays within 10ft of the rim. Therefor, you aren't going to win much with AD as "the man". Same goes for that guy they call Uncle Drew. All he does is put up good numbers because he has freedom, but his team isn't winning, therefor you'll never win with Kyrie being "the man".

Still agree? I mean, I'm just going by your logic.

[speedyG]

This is how dumb this argument is though. Know how easy it is to turn it around on you?

AD is only putting up good numbers on a crap team where he's the only decent big who plays within 10ft of the rim. Therefor, you aren't going to win much with AD as "the man". Same goes for that guy they call Uncle Drew. All he does is put up good numbers because he has freedom, but his team isn't winning, therefor you'll never win with Kyrie being "the man".

Still agree? I mean, I'm just going by your logic.

AD doesn't even need to be "the man" to get his points or produce at an incredible level. And AD isn't a guy who doesn't fit on the floor with certain players, not to mention he does everything you want out of a PF and has almost no flaw.

Until Evans proves he can produce on a winning team where he isn't the star, its fair to be skeptical of him. He isn't good enough to be the star player on a winning team

Kyrie hasn't declined, never shot 40% for a season, and again he is a guy that can play with just about anyone. You dont have to worry about spacing being an issue because of Kyrie. And he can score in just about any way, as opposed to Tyreke who can do nothing but take it to the hole and finish fast breaks. Horrible comparison

you want other examples look at Evan Turner, Demar Derozan, guys who absolutely need the ball in their hands to have any value

[HornetGuru]

AD doesn't even need to be "the man" to get his points. And AD isn't a guy who doesn't fit on the floor with certain players, not to mention he does everything you want out of a PF and has almost no flaw.

Until Evans proves he can produce on a winning team where he isn't the star, its fair to be skeptical of him. He isn't good enough to be the star player on a winning team

Kyrie hasn't declined, never shot 40% for a season, and again he is a guy that can play with just about anyone. You dont have to worry about spacing being an issue because of Kyrie. And he can score in just about any way, as opposed to Tyreke who can do nothing but take it to the hole and finish fast breaks. Horrible comparison

you want other examples look at Evan Turner, Demar Derozan, guys who absolutely need the ball in their hands to have any value

agreed, i been saying evan turner is just like tyreke

[Mythrol]

AD doesn't even need to be "the man" to get his points. And AD isn't a guy who doesn't fit on the floor with certain players, not to mention he does everything you want out of a PF and has almost no flaw.

Until Evans proves he can produce on a winning team where he isn't the star, its fair to be skeptical of him. He isn't good enough to be the star player on a winning team

Kyrie hasn't declined, never shot 40% for a season, and again he is a guy that can play with just about anyone. You dont have to worry about spacing being an issue because of Kyrie. And he can score in just about any way, as opposed to Tyreke who can do nothing but take it to the hole and finish fast breaks. Horrible comparison

you want other examples look at Evan Turner, Demar Derozan, guys who absolutely need the ball in their hands to have any value

Actually, Kyrie has declined from his rookie year. He's shooting a worse FG% than his rookie year, worse TS%, worse eFG%, worse 3pt %, worse Rebounds, worse Blocks, worse FT%, worse TRB%, worse AST%, worse USAGE %.

I just want you to see how silly your argument is when used against Evans.

[speedyG]

Actually, Kyrie has declined from his rookie year. He's shooting a worse FG% than his rookie year, worse TS%, worse eFG%, worse 3pt %, worse Rebounds, worse Blocks, worse FT%, worse TRB%, worse AST%, worse USAGE %.

I just want you to see how silly your argument is when used against Evans.

His numbers haven't really changed much. And regardless Kyrie can knock down an open shot, and score in more ways along with being able to set up his teammates. He isn't nearly as limited as Evans, they aren't comparable