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I think he is. But different people do it different ways. Some are really saying Top 10 career of all timeOriginally Posted by Pelicanidae
I literally mean player. At his peak. So, like Shaq is a top 10 player of all time to me. But did not have a top 10
Career of all time
@mcnamara247
So let’s say HYPOTHETICALLY the specific trade was Zion, Hayes, Kira, Graham, Temple, and our 2025 pick for KD
Then, Lady Benson also agreed to use the taxpayer MLE and you could get another good player and a few more better than normal min guys who wanna join KD. You basically just took last years team that pushed Phoenix and subtracted Hayes and Graham, added KD, Daniels, EJ, and some solid FAs. That wouldn’t be appealing?
I see.
Personally, I disagree on both counts - I have him as a top 20 player of all time. Maybe even top 15, I'd have to sit down and really think it out, but my top 10 is fairly firm and Durant isn't in it: career or player.
Basketball.
Why do we need to include a draft pick? Zion and filler for KD straight would hands down be the best deal for the Nets on the market.
No, not really. I don't want drama queen 34 year old who barely plays Durant on the roster. Don't want his drama, don't want his bandwagon fans, don't want any of it. The only reason I can see for doing it is if you think that it guarantees you a championship, and I don't think it does.
Plus, I think it would torch the team's reputation if you announced that you were signing Zion to a massive extension only to immediately trade him straight after, presumably without his consent. It would be - rightfully - seen as a kind of underhanded move.
Durant is impossible to ignore as far as winning is concerned. And we all know in the back of our minds Zion staying long term is far from a guarantee. The question i keep asking as a fan is if I would have more total enjoyment with Durant on the team than the current makeup. Mainly Zion.
I had to double-check that long list of players to make sure Herb wasn't on there. So, Pels have my permission to "go for the cheese". But, I've only been around since last year's summer league...so I'm pretty sure I'm not entitled to a vote...on a matter this important.
Contributor
Honestly I’ve kind of come to peace with my opinion that this franchise would probably never win a title, and in a weird way I think I would prefer to just stay the course with this current roster, even if acquiring KD guaranteed you a title. Say both KD and CJ become washed in two, maybe three seasons and you’re back to what? BI and a bunch of good to really good role players?
This is what my perspective is.
I would rather go ahead with what we have, and potentially have 5-8 seasons of 50 win teams that make playoff runs, and maybe there's the chance for a chip in there if everything falls right, than burn it all down for 1 or 2 years of Durant before his legs give in and a 50/50 shot at a ring.
And I don't even think Durant is a 50/50 shot at a ring at this point in his career. I think it's a much smaller chance than that.
I think he is the most skilled scorer of all time, in his prime. One game, tomorrow, everyone in the midst of their prime, only guys I am definitely taking over him are MJ, Kareem, Lebron, 99-2002 Shaq. Everyone else is up for debate. Bird got him in terms of playmaking but prime KD gives me more length on close outs and better rim protection.
KD, if we are only talking peak years, is in my top 10. But we wanna go 15 or 20, whatever. Minor details. Point remains that you don’t get a guy like that to come to your market for four years often. And if all you gotta do is trade a guy who has barely played for you and whose camp hasn’t been the most fun to deal with, you do your due diligence
Okay, but flip it. Durant is somehow already here and you got him locked in happy for four years with these guys. Nets call with a guy who has played less than 90 games in three years and is about to get a max. You think you would be on this message board saying, “we gotta trade our guy for him!!”
Like I said yesterday - BI is a non starter for me because he bought all the way into this franchise and lives and breathes their culture. Zion? I’d listen
Contributor
I am with the entire Pelicans universe in hoping Durant stays far away from the Pels. As a new season ticket holder, I would be seriously bummed and seek to unload my tickets ASAP. That's not hyperbole. We have something going here... and this would squash it all like a bug. HARD PASS.
Jonas
KD
BI
Herb
CJ
---
Nance
Jose
Trey
Daniels
EJ
and more..
So how does Zion's contract + extension factor in to a potential KD trade? Would he be able to extend with the Nets immediately after the trade? Or would they have to wait further into the season?
I get the argument you're trying to make, even though I think the scenario you've outlined isn't really functional because of a bunch of reasons (Durant would have had to sign here as FA since this is his first trade request, therefore the cost of acquiring him would have been completely different than it is, therefore you're thinking of trading him is going from a net zero only to a positive whereas in reality it's going from a positive to a negative, in terms of assets, for example).
But also, you're making the assumption that Durant would be healthy and happy here. When in reality I have zero reasons to think Durant is any more healthy than Zion is! In fact, Zion and Durant have played a fairly comparable number of games over the last 3 years. Both have played fewer than half of the games available in that time. What reason do I have to assume Durant will be any healthier going forward than Zion will be? You can point to the fact that Zion's body has structural problems due to his height/weight, but Durant's leg came as close to exploding as a leg can come without a land-mine being involved so it doesn't exactly give him the firmest infrastructure going forward either, does it? That's before getting into the fact that Durant is 34 already, which again, makes it likely that he's on the decline: something we've already seen in his game, whereas Zion is at least theoretically expected to improve.
Secondly, your hypothetical ignores the fact that I outlined earlier which is that we've already, supposedly, granted Zion the contract. It's been extended, he's accepted, and what's being worked out is details. It's all fun media spin to talk about how far the reputation of the Pels has come that Durant would even consider it: good luck maintaining that reputation when you take a player you just extended in good faith and ship him off to Brooklyn using his newly signed contract as a selling point without his consent. Hell, with CJ as a VP of the NBAPA I can't imagine he'd be best pleased with it either.
But neworleanshoo, what if I told you there was a miraculous guaranteed ring in it for us? Ignore the fact that KD got swept in the first round of the East this year and that we'd have to either gut our roster, or future, or both to get him. Do not look at the man behind the curtain.
And every one of those players would be as great or greater...in today's game...EXCEPT for Shaq. And yes, that includes Jabbar. Some players need "help" to be great...and some don't. The NBA quickly realized Shaq would need a great deal of help offensively...to be a "superstar". Getting pretty deep in the weeds here...BUT...bottom line...the NBA made the decision to totally change how the game was allowed to be played down low on the block...JUST FOR SHAQ. And, I don't blame them in the least for doing so. They, of course, reverted back to "normal"...once they had gotten all they could out of Shaq, with a bit of hangover for Dwight Howard. Shaq would obviously suffer quite a bit...in today's game, especially since I see no way they could go back to allowing the style of play Shaq was allowed down on the low block. Once again...I don't blame them in the least for doing this...I woulda done the same thing under the circumstances.
Like, this is what annoys me about most of the pro-Durant trade arguments.
Kevin Durant is unreal. Stop playing https://t.co/N5cog7hsUk
— Shamit Dua (@FearTheBrown) July 2, 2022
''Kevin Durant is unreal. Stop playing.''
I'm pretty certain that nobody who is against the Durant trade has taken that stance because they think Durant is bad at basketball. He's not. He's excellent. He's a top 10 player every year, has been for about a decade now - other than the year he missed due to injury, of course. Why claim that people who disagree with you are ''playing'', instead of having a legitimate disagreement about the team and its future?
Contributor
You have to seriously consider that one, expecting Zion to have a long Healthy career is probably fools gold.
The Pels would be instant contenders and a destination for FAs.
I understand the desire of keeping this team together and I understand the value of a trade like this.
Either way, it is a great time to be a Pels fan.
It's that the Hornets unashamedly quit so quickly in Game 4 after fans in New Orleans showed up this season with greater regularity than the team could have ever dreamed, shaming misinformed know-it-alls like me who kept telling you that local residents couldn't possibly invest their time and money into something as trivial as rooting for the local basketball team while still recovering from the devastation of Hurricane Katrina. - Mark Stien ESPN
I posed this question to a friend of mine who is a huge fan of the Denver Broncos:
You have been exceptionally fortunate as a Broncos fan to experience championships won by 2 different methods.
Which did you enjoy more— the long path with Elway or the shortcut with hired mercenary Peyton Manning?
His response: “The Elway way was my favorite. Had to endure 3 Super Bowl losses before our first win. At least GSW won their first the old-fashioned way without KD. I much prefer that to building a super team.”
Let this Pels team grow up together. Don’t gut it in the pursuit of the almighty ring. The journey is most of the fun.
Contributor
I completely agree. I just bought season tickets. I want to actually like the team I'm watching and rooting for. There is no doubt in my mind that KD would be a mercenary for a year or two and then seek to get the hell of out here (in the meantime, destroying all the team chemistry we've built). I will be seriously PO'd if this team deals BI. Less so Zion, but still PO'd. Let's ride this train.
Listening to you guys...& since I'm new around here...I hereby withdraw my "go for the cheese" vote. This Pels team seems to have a lot going for it as is...but since I've never actually seen Zion play an entire game, and I usually expect "superstars" to NOT be quite as great as everybody says they are...I just can't vote AGAINST Durantula...so I'll just "abstain" on this one...and be happy whichever way it ends up going.
Last edited by The Dud; 07-01-2022 at 10:42 PM.
Here's a question I'd be curious to hear the answer to, from those who are in favour of trading for Durant.
If Lebron came out tomorrow on national television and said he is requesting a trade from the Lakers and would be open to going to XYZ teams, and named the Pelicans, do you make that trade assuming it costs a value roughly equivalent to the deals we've seen bandied about for Durant?
Edit: also assume he said he'd be willing to sign an extension, so the years value would be roughly the same as with Durants.
This board is funny.
I remember when most of the people on this board didn't want to trade AD to the Lakers because they wanted absolutely nothing to do with Lonzo or BI.
I don't even live in New Orleans anymore, but if anyone wants to sell me their season tickets at face value if the Pelicans trade for Durant I'd be happy to take them off your hands.
No. I wouldn't do that to BI, and like MM, I think BI is a nonstarter in just about any trade.
Nor do I think Griff would sign up for that AGAIN.
KD and LeBron are very different people. Willie coached KD. There's an existing relationship that I think makes bringing KD onboard and into our team easier than you might expect.
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