Originally Posted by Butters
Nah
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Nah
Not even remotely interested in Wall
Basketball.
I dont think we would even think of going after wall. The fake simmons trade would be more probable than john wall.
Contributor
Even if we wanted to there’s no way we could make that salary work without giving up someone significant.
John Wall may very well be the elusive "untradable" contract in professional basketball. He's due 47mil next season after being paid 44mil this season. That's incredibly difficult to move just on sheer volume. You add in his decline in production and health issues I can only see a buy out getting John moved to another team.
Contributor
John Wall or Ben Simmons. You have to take one. Which one?
It's not a difficult choice. Ben Simmons is a better player on less yearly money with no massive injury history and is significantly younger.
I don't think either is a guy for this team, and I think Simmons has huge flaws that make it very difficult for him to be The Guy on championship level team, but just in a vacuum he's clearly better than Wall.
He was already traded, on the same contract, at a time when there were even more health concerns.
He's a year older, due more money, and has yet another injury to add to the list. These are all things that make him an even greater negative then he was say 12 months ago. Then there are other factors that I didn't mention. Houston is a young rebuilding team looking to acquire assets not give them up. Wall does not want to be on a rebuilding team. It would be viturally impossible for any "good" teams to give up any salary that will match while keeping it's core together. The only teams with cap space are other bad teams that will take John on for future assets. Why would the Rockets use assets to trade Wall to a team that will just take on his salary for future picks? Not a real question. Either way the circumstances going into this season has IMO as much if not more to do with Wall bring untradable. In fairness to you I didn't mention that in my 1st post.
He's due more money per year but he's due ~$40MM less overall...that's not insignificant. All these guys (CP3, Westbrook, going back to dozens of others)...their contract is untradeable until it's traded. Maybe Wall will be the first to be stuck, maybe there will be some sort of buyout, who knows.
Word out of the Pelicans pre-camp workouts is that Jaxson Hayes looks incredible and is hitting jumpers from everywhere
— Shamit Dua (@FearTheBrown) September 17, 2021
There won't be a buyout. It's a monstrous amount of money and Fertitta is a cheapskate. I'd be stunned if Wall got bought out, he'd have to give up *so much* money.
I agree that the idea of an untradeable contract is a little overblown, but at the same time, as da THRONE outlines, who would both want Wall and have the assets to get him? It doesn't work out. With CP3 there's an impetus to giving up stuff for him because he's proven that he can boost a team into playoff contention time and time again. Westbrook is a little harder to justify but then, he got traded for Wall so really it's just swapping awful deals back and forth, and at least Westbrook can give you gaudy box-score numbers on the regular.
I know my point is it's the money per year that has to be match via any trades. That makes a trade far more difficult than just the overall contract.
Personally I never viewed Paul or Westbrook as untradeable. They were due a lot but still had positive impact on their teams.
https://youtu.be/I4IknsVFD8I
Pels are going to be really good.
New coach A+
Added Devonte Graham, Jonas V, Tomas Satoransky, Garrett Temple B+
Rookies Murphy and Herb A+
We will win so many games. I really think people are underestimating how much better we will be. I think we will have a better defense. Our shooting will be way better. We have more depth and players with experience. Also, NAW, Kira, and Hayes will all be better players I have no doubt.
Devonte will be incredible at PG. just watch. He?s got so many weapons and he can shoot lights out. Chemistry and defense will lead this team to 52 wins. We will go deep in the playoffs.
We are contenders. Just wait. I?m pumped because we added so much shooting. It?s going to completely change the team.
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I agree up to a point and then diverge.
I agree that NAW, Kira, and Hayes should take a step forward this year - that's expected of them. If they don't (particular NAW and Hayes, who are more experience) then their time on the Pels starts coming under review. I believe in them still, for sure, so I'm expecting it. I also agree that Devonte will be a good fit for the team and I think his shooting, half-court passing, and defense will all be positive upgrades from Bledsoe last year. Jonas is an upgrade from Adams, and I think Murphy will be pretty good (for a rookie) even if he goes through some rough patches here and there. I
But I don't really think we can pencil the new coach in for a positive yet - I like the signs, but we've yet to see him coach a game so it's a bit presumptuous. He was good in Summer League and all of the back-stage stuff we've heard has been nice, so I'm hopeful, but I don't know if we can just confirm it as an absolute already.
Besides that, we won 31 games last year. I think we improved, but do I think we got 21 games better? 52 wins last season was the Jazz's record and that was league best.
I'm comfortable saying we'll be better than last year, and I think expecting us to be a 40 win team, potentially 45 if things break right, isn't absurd. But 50+? I'm a bit more sceptical about that. I don't see us as a title contender this year, and that's title contender territory most of the time.
Jax got the memo that we need a stretch 5 lmao. I know people want Jax to focus more on the big man side of his game, but I like that he is taking the initiative and looking to be better than the average big. He went out of his way to work on his handles and jump shot during the COVID break and it wouldn?t surprise me if he heavily invested on those aspects again this offseason. He wants to be great just like BI and Zion and I can dig it.
We lack the starting PG.....unless NAW really steps up....but otherwise I agree. I've never made a sports bet before but that's changing this year. The odds for us mkaing the playoffs are way too low.
Where does one bet on NBA playoffs? Lol
Last edited by msusousaphone; 09-19-2021 at 02:17 AM.
BI, Zion, and CJ had a net rating of +3 when on the court together. BI and Zion had a +13.4, BI and CJ had a +13.2, Zion and CJ was just +5.4.
BI and Zion worked. BI and CJ worked. It was CJ and Zion and all three together that didn't work.
Don't forget, we're also PLAYING 10 more games this season.
I don't think that makes much of a difference with regards to us being a 52 win team. At our win rate last season (.431) an 82 game season would only have resulted in 35 wins. We'd still have to improve by at least 17 wins this year to hit 52 wins based on that rate, which is a very significant single season jump. Not unheard of, of course, but still, I think it's a lot to project based on what we've done this off-season.
I like the way you think. I also see us as much improved just not that much. I'm going with 47 WINS AND A 6TH SEED.
I saw online yesterday Vegas has us at o/u 38.5 or 39.5 depending on the place. The over looks like a tempting bet to me.
I think somewhere between 43 and 48 wins (.524 to .585 win percentage) would be a good goal to aim for. Somewhere in that ball-park. It's clear improvement, it's a playoff berth, but it's not setting yourself up for failure by expecting 55 wins or something like that. Last season we played at a 35 win pace, so 43 wins is only an 8 game improvement. Clearly better, but not like expecting us to go from bad to championship contention in one year.
I will say, 14 blown leads cause we were inept on so many places on the floor. With these new added pieces & coaches, I think we mesh much better than last year (depending if things go right). So in all, its not out of the ballpark to win 50+ games. However I'm placing my bets on a 45 win season.
I mean, it wouldn't be impossible for sure and if everything clicks right it could happen, for sure. I just think that would be a top tier outcome for the year, rather than something we should go into the year placing our hopes into. As you say, much more confident in something around the 45 win mark than the 52 win mark.
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