If they fire their Head Coach pray he does not come down hereOriginally Posted by Taker597
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If they fire their Head Coach pray he does not come down here
Advanced stats for anyone who wants them, now that the NBA site has updated fully.
At least 15 minutes played.
Highest ORTG: Nicolo Melli, 130.2
Lowest DRTG: Jrue Holiday, 71.6 (this is truly absurd, worth noting all 5 starters had DRtgs under 100 which is great)
Highest Net RTG: Jrue Holiday, +18.9
Worst Net RTG: JJ Redick, +0.5
Highest TS%: Josh Hart, 102.5%
Lowest TS%: Derrick Favors, 20.5%
Highest REB%: Derrick Favors, 17.6%
Highest AST%: Tie between Zion and Ingram, at 38.5% each.
Most Screen Assists: Derrick Favors with 3, then Zion with 2
Most Points off Screen Assists: Derrick Favors with 7, then Zion with 6
Most Deflections: Jrue and Lonzo tied at 5, Zion and Ingram tied for second place with 2 each
Most Overall Shot Contests: Derrick Favors, 16. Hart with 13, Jrue with 10, Zion with 8.
Most 2pt Shot Contests: Derrick Favors with 13
Most 3pt Shot Contests: Zion and Jrue tied at 6 each
Most Box Outs: Derrick Favors with 12, Melli in second with 6, nobody else had more than 1
It's so absurd how great Favors is at all the miscellaneous stuff. I just wish wish wish he could provide a little more offense. Doesn't have to be like 20 points a night, but so far this season he's averaging 9 points a game, his worst since 2011-12, while also posting a career worst FT%. If he could just be a slightly more impactful offensive player, maybe if he was a threat to shoot a 15 footer even, he would improve so much. Or even if he just rolled harder, to draw more defense in.
Basketball.
Lakers secured the top seed. So any game that helps the Pelicans, they'll sit fric and frac and feature Kuzma and Waiters.
Which is nuts because he was alot more assertive on offense when he was in Utah. I'm sure Alvin didn't neuter him in the offense and relegated him to strictly being a screener... IDK man. He would make the offense much better if he just gets more aggressive and make defense at least respect him.
I know this has been mentioned before, but it really does look like he's lost a step athletically. I don't know whether it's due to age or injury, but without being even an average athlete for a big man he will keep getting exposed. I hope he can return to form, but if this is permanent he doesn't seem to be worth much more than the minimum.
He's insanely quick on offense around the bucket
Thankfully they only play the Kings
I think that Alvin's offense might move faster than Favors is comfortable with.
The perfect center in this offense is someone who can rebound, block shots, play good post defense, and be a reliable shooter from the three point line. Surely Griff shouldn't have any trouble finding someone that can fit all of those needs.
I don't think he's capable of anything else at this point. His jumper is clearly nonexistent, and every time he tries to get aggressive he either gets rejected by a player or by the rim.
If the center can't space the floor from a jump shot perspective, then he has to be able to space the floor vertically. If you guys haven't noticed, Favors is completely vertically challenged at this point in his career. Sure he's 29, but he truly has the body of a 35 year old.
The reason the offense looks so much more fluid when Jax is in is because they have to play the lob at all times. I think this may be unpopular on this board, but Jax should be the starting center for this team next year, and they should go after another big who can play next to Zion, Jax, or Melli. Go overpay for Ibaka or Paul Millsap for a year. Favors raises the floor, but he caps the ceiling, especially if he's closing ball games. And it sucks because I like the guy and was excited about what he could bring, but no one could have foreseen this much athletic regression.
Lets please not ignore what Favors was able to do boxing out Valenciunus on the boards. When Favors was out, JV was having a field day.
Jax should not be starting until he puts on at least 25 - 30 more lbs. He's just too skinny right now. Opposing bigs can just pluck him out of bounds.
They just need to find 1 or 2 girthy bigs that can play at/above the rim, defend, and rebound. At least until Jax is ready in 2 -3 years. Easier said than done but I have faith Langdon can find them.
With all due respect, JAX is not the answer anytime soon. He is, at present, a defensive liability (and I'm being kind), In support, just last night he had 3 fouls and 3 turnovers in 2:33 seconds he played in first half against middle-of-the-road center. I'll agree, his ceiling is high but he lacks body mass and his basketball IQ is off the charts (in the wrong direction). He'll make the 'oooh' and 'aaah' plays from time to time, but fail miserably on the routine and mundane. I would love to see us get a wide body who could shoot from distance. If he opts out, I would be all over Kelly Olynyk. We need to stretch the floor to let ZW, BI, and JH, among others, operate in the paint (opening up the middle will be invaluable in NAW's development too).
But the thing is, it really doesn't matter. We know we're not contending next year so you let Jax play through the lumps. The main way to grow a player's IQ is by actually playing meaningful minutes. He has an obvious foul problem, but that's why you need depth behind him. He's started to figure it out on that end. He had a rough stretch in the grizzlies game, sure, but he had a combined 4 fouls in 41 minutes prior to that in the bubble (a combined +12 take it with a grain of salt).
Sure Favors was able to box out JV, but who cares, honestly. JV should not even be on the floor in the final 5 minutes of a "playoff" basketball game. The Pels with Zion, BI, Lonzo, Jrue, JJ, Melli, Hart... At what point do we stop matching up to the opposing team and start forcing them to match up with us. There's not many better opponents to play Zion at the 5 against than the Grizzlies, with JJJ's just complete ineptitude in grabbing rebounds.
Edit: One more point on Jax. If you don't think he's the answer any time soon, then you have to move him. It's simple as that. The longer he stays on this roster playing spot minutes, the more his value decreases on the trade market. If you think he's still a year or two away from making a real impact, then you have to move him now from a team building perspective. Zion and BI are you good already that you don't have the luxury of waiting out the 7th overall pick at a position of need. You can wait out NAW because he was the 17th pick, so theres not really any sunk costs.
Last edited by pelafanatic; 08-04-2020 at 11:10 AM.
While I respect your opinion, I can't agree with it. We need to be contending next year (not to be would be a year of regression). Despite a terrible first three months we are still in the mix (albeit barely). Plus, if we maintain this 'take our lumps' mentality (a perpetual thing for this franchise), we'll never be able to attract the pieces we need to excel.
BTW: JV fouled out with about three and half minutes left in the game. Additionally his 15 points (55%) / 11 rebounds a game in way less than 30:00 per game is not too shabby.
@Pelicanidae I only ask this because I know you will enjoy it.
Can you give us numbers on the Zion/Meli/JJ/Zo/Hart lineup from last night? That one started the 2nd quarter and blew the lid off Mephis, and then AL went back to it in the 4th to stop their run. Both times it looked like that lineup suffocated them and I really liked the flow. Is this a lineup that can consistently work, or was this just because of Memphis's specific holes?
I just want to be clear that you can be a good player but also be unplayable at the end of games, which is how I feel about JV. He gives great effort and is a terror on the glass for the first 3 quarters, but at the end of games when the Rockets are running out Covington, the Warriors with Green, the Clippers with Harrell, the Lakers with AD, Mavs with Porzingis... you get my point. A plodding center is not the answer anymore. They still have a place in the league, but not in the important minutes.
That’s why the Pels can’t pay Favors. You can’t give a guy 15 mil a year to either sit at the end of games or feel forced to play him because of the contract you gave him. You can potentially get Dragic and someone like Taj Gibson for the same price as you’d pay Favors
Sure.
The Zo/JJ/Hart/Melli/Zion lineup played a total of 10 minutes, together. They had a frankly boggling ORtg of 142.9, but their defensive rating was equally terrible at 140, so the overall net rating was only +2.9. For comparison, our starting lineup of Jrue/Lonzo/Ingram/Zion/Favors had a net rating of +25.2 in the same game; the net rating was a comparatively miserable 93.9, but the defensive rating was a stellar 68.9; a large part of this can be attributed to Jrue being on the floor, since Jrue had the team's best DRtg and he also locked Morant down absurdly well.
As for whether or not that lineup can consistently work, I think it depends. On perimeter oriented teams or lineups that don't really present a major threat in the paint, I think it could be a really good lineup to create tons of space for Zion to operate, but as soon as a team has a paint threat there's a huge issue because this lineup cannot defend the paint at all. Perhaps that will change over time as Zion gets back into proper shape and hopefully recovers some of his Duke defense because imagining this lineup with Duke Zion on defense is pretty special; he was a very good rim protector there, and a very sharp post defender.
This is a great time to say ''I wish Favors could shoot a little'' or ''I wish Kenrich could shoot a little''. Cause if either of them could even be a reasonable three point shooter, you could replace Melli with them and add a ton of defense and maybe make it a more flexible lineup.
Of course, it's also easy to imagine Jax adding some range to his game (we've seen him do it! rarely but we have!) and filling that spot well as a perfect stretch 5 on offense and a paint protector on D.
Depends what you mean by contending. Should we be a comfortable playoff team next year, rather than scraping for it? Yeah, I think so. Should we be a contender for a championship? I think that's rushing it a bit. Obviously I would love it if we were, but it's not a failure if we aren't.
When I say contending, I mean contending for a championship, which should not be the goal for the Pels next year. That's entirely unreasonable for a team this young.
More in line to this thread, I'd like to admit I was completely wrong about Brandon Clarke. I think the 3 point shooting itself is super unsustainable based on his low attempts and his lack of collegiate success, but his athleticism has translated so much better than I thought. I didnt really think he had functional athleticism, as I thought he was purely a leaper, but I was clearly wrong. He'll be a very good defender.
I'm surprised to see that unit was THAT bad defensively because it felt like we pulled away both times they were on the floor.
I hope they get Zion to a good playing weight this offeseason because be looks really bad on D right now. Everyone is blowing by him.
I guess the other part of it was Meli trying to guard JV down low, which clearly was not going to happen.
Not really worried about Zion’s defense right now. With the combination of the injury, weight, conditioning, limited playing time, and being a rookie is stunting his ability to play defense. I’d only worry if he comes out next season in tip top shape and conditioning and looks like the Zion from Duke and shows no improvement on defense. I feel Defense will come on strong in year 2 for the kid. People gotta lighten up about his defense this year.
This is about as far away from good team building as you can be. Jax is a 20 year old underweight ROOKIE. If your franchise has to depend on multiple 20 year olds to get into the playoffs and contend, then you are doing it all wrong.
There is no need whatsoever to rush Jax out there to get rag dolled nightly. It will not help his growth. He will develop bad habits hard to break, and he will most likely get injured horribly.
He will be where he needs to be in 2 - 3 more years in you simply develop him correctly. And it will be well worth the wait.
Sometimes people forget Hayes is a project. For him to even be playing quality minutes in his rookie year is promising as hell.
I actually think Zions defense last game was overall pretty good. Just saying
Also next year, I assume they'll bring Didi up. He is another type this team needs. A 6'6" defender with range as a shooter who already has good size. I'm hoping he can be our Matisse Thybulle.
He'll obviously also need time to develop, but thats another box already checked.
Last edited by luckyman; 08-04-2020 at 01:56 PM.
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