Playing GM... Keep Zion out and Tank

[pelicanchamp]

Let’s face it. Our team isn’t going to win many games. So what should we do? What is the best plan long term? We need to make trades and blow this thing up if we don’t get close to .500

I find it very tempting to do what Dell did... he tried to do a relatively fast rebuild. It didn’t workout. Injuries didn’t help though.

What if we did a very patient rebuild? Similar to Atlanta and Memphis. What would that look like?

The team shouldn’t be this bad. 1-7!!!! I hope we can turn it around but I’m not optimistic. If Zion had been playing what do y’all think our record would be??? I would say maybe 3-5. Maybe.... we have to adjust to having so many new players. We need chemistry and consistency....

A lot of our losses seem to be on Gentry. IDK any other way to look at it. Jrue and Favors have been disappointing. Lonzo, my favorite player in the trade, is disappointing to me. Ingram is ballin. I’m happy about that. I think he’s a good teammate and has a lot of potential.

But Seriously.... how do we build this team? Here’s my take. (IF we look like we are seriously tanking)

We trade Moore at deadline. We gotta move him if we can. Send him to Philly if possible. They need shooting. Trade Favors if he isn’t performing well enough to justify resigning him. Package them together if possible. Try to get a 2020 or 2021 1st
round pick... maybe trade Jrue.... that’s a big maybe. We have too many guards.

Wait for draft night.

Draft night: get the best PG and/or Center possible. Period. IF we have the CAVS pick package it to move up to get the best player possible. Cole Anthony, MAYBE Lamelo Ball or Wiseman should be targets if they are available.

We need to figure out PG, SG, and C.

Lonzo has fallen short and I think we need a backup plan. I’m not sold on NAW yet for a starting PG.... Fill the PG position with the best PG possible and if Lonzo can’t prove he is the best PG our team has then we move him....


We should only commit to Zion and Ingram. That’s it.



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[pelicanchamp]

Ohhhh.... and I hate to say it but fire Gentry...... after season is over.


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[Fedupfan]

Ohhhh.... and I hate to say it but fire Gentry...... after season is over.


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Can you imagine watching this for 74 more games? Sheesh

[Pelicanidae]

There so much in your post that just strikes me as really wild takes.

Sit Zion all season? Why?

If we're tanking, we're already likely to have a top 5 pick, why would you trade the Cavs pick UP to get someone like Lamelo when you're already in that position with your own pick?

Why would anyone consider Wiseman the top C prospect in this class and worthy of a top 5-8 pick?

Why is Cole Anthony being considered anything less than a top 3 pick candidate?

[13 - 3]

There so much in your post that just strikes me as really wild takes.

Sit Zion all season? Why?

If we're tanking, we're already likely to have a top 5 pick, why would you trade the Cavs pick UP to get someone like Lamelo when you're already in that position with your own pick?

Why would anyone consider Wiseman the top C prospect in this class and worthy of a top 5-8 pick?

Why is Cole Anthony being considered anything less than a top 3 pick candidate?

Bench him for season? See Ben Simmons?

[As I See It]

We should only commit to Zion and Ingram. That’s it.



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We need to hold on to Hayes and (I know I am going to take grief) Williams. "Kenny Hustle" is innately the best player on the team; he sees the play two seconds before it happens. It would take a lot for me to let him go.

[Pelicanidae]

Bench him for season? See Ben Simmons?

Simmons wasn't benched, he was medically unable to play

[Fedupfan]

Don’t worry! Josh Gray is here to help the defense. Maybe a lineup of Him, Frank, NAW, Moore, and Kenny should do the trick.

[donato]

I think you bring Zion back but are very conservative. Let’s say Christmas or January.

Gentry gotta go after the year yes.

I wanted to trade Jrue before the season, I definitely want to trade him before the deadline now.

All vets on trade block when eligible to be moved.

PG should be a priority draft pick if there’s reasonable value where we pick- agree not sold on Lonzo but we still have this year and next to evaluate him if we don’t trade him.

Isn’t JaxH the C of the future? Not sure why Center would be a priority, but I guess general big options and depth...maybe ok.

Couldn’t be happier with Ingram compared to my expectations coming into the year.

[Pelicanidae]

Isn’t JaxH the C of the future? Not sure why Center would be a priority, but I guess general big options and depth...maybe ok.

I assume it's cause in OP's eyes, Favors probably isn't likely to play well enough to be retained. That would leave our C rotation at Hayes and Okafor, and Okafor isn't fantastic, so getting a second C who is likely to be good enough for big minutes is something we should look into.

[13 - 3]

Simmons wasn't benched, he was medically unable to play

Isn’t that the same situation we are in now?

[Pelicanidae]

Isn’t that the same situation we are in now?

No, because Zion will be perfectly ready and capable of playing by January at the latest, whereas Simmons was medically unable to play for a whole year.

Sitting Zion out the entire season when he's completely ready to go is a pointless absurdity that does nothing but delay his development, will tick off more of the fans that have paid season ticket money to see him play and are already wavering in interest, and doesn't even guarantee us a higher pick in the draft because
1) We suck so bad that even adding Zion is unlikely to make us a playoff calibre team unless he's a top 15 player immediately
and
2) Draft pick odds are flattened out so being the number 1 worst team in the NBA doesn't actually give you that much of an advantage in the draft anyway; see the Knicks picking 3rd this year for example and the Cavs picking 5th.

[PolishFan]

Griffin was wrong to assume Jrue would be the leader of this team. He just doesnt have it. He could be a very solid player on a contending team but he would have to be the third or fourth option. Lonzo Ball is just bad at basketball and it's not because of his shooting. He is not a point guard to me. When he has the ball he immediately passes it to someone else which is fine when it leads to a fast break but he does it always regardless if there is an opportunity for a fast break or not. He also cant drive to the rim. Pelicanidae - it's time to admit you were wrong about Ingram. He has been great but it seems you are trying to find any reason to downplay what he is doing. Gentry seems to be clueless and is playing 13 guys because Miller is hurt. Otherwise he would be playing 14 and still would have no idea. Hart looks like a solid high character player. I hope the Pels keep him. Even though this season looks really bad I am very optimistic about the future. Zion and Ingram are very nice players to build the team around.

[JJackisangry]

He needs NBA experience. This team needs him. Play the boy

[Pelicanidae]

Pelicanidae - it's time to admit you were wrong about Ingram.

I've literally said about 20 times now in the last few days that Ive been generally impressed by Ingram's play so far this season, that he's taken several large steps in key areas, that he's been playing good enough that even if he regresses he'll still be good, and that he's been far better than Ball who I originally had been more optimistic about.

I've made absolutely no bones about that. It's not my fault if you haven't seen it.

[As I See It]

Pelicanidae - it's time to admit you were wrong about Ingram

While you are at it (but to a lesser extent), a kind word or two might from you might be in order about your assessment of Jackson.

[Pelicanidae]

While you are at it (but to a lesser extent), a kind word or two might from you might be in order about your assessment of Jackson.

Mine?

My assessment of Jackson remains true. Valuable spark plug bench scorer, provides relatively little else, and doesn't put a huge amount on the court when his shot isn't falling. Can't run an offense. I do like him, but when you have depth sometimes people get squeezed out and it doesn't necessarily mean that they're not NBA players, it just means that you can't have 10 guards on one team.

[pelicanchamp]

Keep Zion off the floor until he is 270.


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[Pelicanidae]

Keep Zion off the floor until he is 270.


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Seems a bit old imo, not really willing to wait 251 years to see him play.

[As I See It]

Mine?

My assessment of Jackson remains true. Valuable spark plug bench scorer, provides relatively little else, and doesn't put a huge amount on the court when his shot isn't falling. Can't run an offense. I do like him, but when you have depth sometimes people get squeezed out and it doesn't necessarily mean that they're not NBA players, it just means that you can't have 10 guards on one team.

Statistically Jackson is ahead of JJ Redick's first THREE years in the league (and never mind that JJ played four years at Duke and Frank played just one). Frank's $1.6MM dwarfs JJ's $13.5MM in terms of production and value. And at least Frank doesn't play 'Matador Defense'.

[pelicanchamp]

Seems a bit old imo, not really willing to wait 251 years to see him play.

Man, Zion is possibly the best player in the league in 3-4 years IF healthy. It’s true that he needs to lose weight. 270-275 is really important. 265 is ideal.


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[pelicanchamp]

There so much in your post that just strikes me as really wild takes.

Sit Zion all season? Why?

If we're tanking, we're already likely to have a top 5 pick, why would you trade the Cavs pick UP to get someone like Lamelo when you're already in that position with your own pick?

Why would anyone consider Wiseman the top C prospect in this class and worthy of a top 5-8 pick?

Why is Cole Anthony being considered anything less than a top 3 pick candidate?

I wasn’t clear. Keep Zion out as long as we need to is what I really meant. And when he comes back be careful with him. I want more weight loss and I don’t know if that’s possible. Like I said 270 is probably a lot safer than 285. We can bring Zion back with CAUTION and Tank.


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[da ThRONe]

Here's my take. We should shift the focus to the young players(where the focus should have been on to begin with). If we are still awful by the time FA signed this year are eligible for trade we should sell Favors, Holiday, Redick, Moore or what ever vet for the best assets we can get. Also if we're still awful fire Gentry. Zion should not play this year. Let him focus on getting his weight down to 260ish. 275+ is far too much weight when you consider his height and the torque his body can generate.

[Pelicanidae]

Statistically Jackson is ahead of JJ Redick's first THREE years in the league (and never mind that JJ played four years at Duke and Frank played just one). Frank's $1.6MM dwarfs JJ's $13.5MM in terms of production and value. And at least Frank doesn't play 'Matador Defense'.

That's kind of irrelevant. My criticisms of Frank are completely independent of what JJ is doing. Whether JJ is stinking it up, or shooting lights out, my criticism of Frank is the same because they apply to Frank, not anyone else.

Yes, JJ has been bad. But that has nothing to do with whether Frank can run an offense, or provide surplus value beyond scoring.

[pelicanchamp]

I've literally said about 20 times now in the last few days that Ive been generally impressed by Ingram's play so far this season, that he's taken several large steps in key areas, that he's been playing good enough that even if he regresses he'll still be good, and that he's been far better than Ball who I originally had been more optimistic about.

I've made absolutely no bones about that. It's not my fault if you haven't seen it.

Ingram will be an all star if he starts getting more FTA. I predict he will be an all star soon. Also, Lonzo would lead the league in assists if Zion were playing. I really believe that.


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