I like Reddish something tells me his skillset is a better fit for the NBA than the college game. The biggest thing with him is I hear too many questions about his work ethic. That kind of stuff scares me.Originally Posted by Mythrol
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I like Reddish something tells me his skillset is a better fit for the NBA than the college game. The biggest thing with him is I hear too many questions about his work ethic. That kind of stuff scares me.
Shamit Dua and Mason Ginsberg had Ricky O'Donnell from SBN on the latest edition of In the N.O., and Ricky said he thinks Reddish is going to be the player in this draft that gets a GM fired.
He was not good at college. He just wasn't. Shot poorly, didn't play D, moved kind of awkwardly, etc etc. But he looks like he should be better than he is. His jumper is so smooth to watch, it looks like it should fall even though it doesn't. Either he is going to really click together at the NBA level and be a huge player, or he's going to be a total bust. A GM will either pass over him and get fired when he explodes into a top tier player, or they'll take him and get fired when he busts out hard.
Personally, I wouldn't take the risk on him, but he's truly the definition of high risk, high reward.
Basketball.
Maybe so. My ranking on players isn't some set in stone thing. I don't watch enough college ball for that. Just from everything I've watched and read about Reddish, I'd be nervous as heck to draft him.
Anything that can get Zion and Ja together , i'm for.
Unless we get a 3rd pick after 8 spot and he's there I'd say pass. But he'll be a kid I keep an eye on moving forward.
Like I said above. Unless we somehow get two early 1st in a Davis trade and he's there with that 3rd pick I can't see pulling the trigger on him personally.
Did anybody see The Ringer’s draft guide? Jonathan Tjarks had my boy Brandon Clarke at two. I did not realize his wingspan was only 6’9 ish, figured it was longer. I still think if its the Celtics package and includes no. 14, I would love to see a front-court pairing of Clarke and Zion closing out games. I also had not heard much discussion about my favorite package which is the Clippers. The core would be Shamet, SGA, and the Miami 2021 unprotected first. Im sure either Harrell or Gallo would be included, and more firsts.
Yeah, I'm pretty sceptical about Clarke, partially cause he is pretty old for a rookie (obviously you would still take him if you really liked him despite that) and he's basically got a wingspan the same as his height, which kinda sucks for an undersized guy who can only really play at C.
I'm not so hot on the Clippers package. The guys over on the Bird Calls podcast released their episode on the Clippers trade packages just recently, and they absolutely rave about SGa's potential, and I just don't see it. At least, not on the level they do. Some of the guys on there, I think Grubb was one of them, basically made the argument that SGA is a future star. Not just a good roleplayer, but a star. I don't get that from watching him play, or from his numbers. He has the potential to be a solid player, sure, but I'm not sure if I'm seeing anything magical.
Similar with Shamet. He's a solid shooter, and in the playoffs he did have that one great game against Golden State, but he struck me as a good solid roleplayer type too, rather than a star.
I do like Harrell, and the Miami pick is promising. I'd assume Gallo would be included to make salaries work.
Yeah, I know Oleh Kosel is high on SGA. However, he seems to base his opinion on a very small set of games SGA played against Golden State.
I think possibly the worst argument they had is where they listed a couple of extremely mediocre advanced stats on the pod, and then acted like that was an achievement because relatively few other guards had had that specific arrangement of advanced stats.
They were like, ''oh SGA had a 13.4 PER, a .554 TS%, 0.9 VORP, .074 WS/48, and 3.3 WS this season... the only other rookie guards in the last ten years to post those numbers were X, Y, Z'' and it's like, sure, because that's quite a lot of stats and some of them don't really line up with each other so if you demand a complex enough sequence you make the number of possible matches pretty small. But on a case by case basis, what do those numbers mean? Well, 13.4 PER is a little under league average. 55.4% TS is about league average. 0.9 VORP is above average but nothing amazing. .074 WS/48 isn't great. 3.3 WS for a starter on a playoff team isn't very good.
I think we disagree on SGA, i.e. if you were just looking at the guys that would headline packages. SGA, Tatum, Ingram, and Barrett, I would personally take SGA over all 4 although Tatum is close. His shooting has only improved since he was at Kentucky, in high school he was seen as a question mark in that department, and it has continued to get better. He is not an explosive athlete for a PG by any means, but plays with pace and feel well beyond his years. In that regard he is similar to Luka although obviously not at that level. While not an elite playmaker, he is certainly serviceable at this point, and it would only seem he is going to get better in that regard. He’s also 6’6 with a 7’0 foot wingspan and his defense isn’t theoretical he has already shown it at the NBA level. A Jrue/SGA backcourt would be devastating defensively. You could essentially build a team that 3 of your 5 starters are elite multi positional defenders. On Shamet we agree, but he seems to be the perfect non-star you would want to build around Zion. High IQ guys with elite shooting ability. Gallo and Harrell are what they are, and I would not wanna have to pay Harrell 15 plus million next year just to keep him, although he is a solid player.
Having said that if the Celtics would include Tatum, Brown, and the Memphis pick next year as the nucleus, I would still take that over the Clippers package.
I touched on this with Clarke, and I actually wasn’t aware of his wingspan until you mentioned it, but he has completely reworked his jump shot in the last year. The strides he has made only in the last year are incredibly promising. You couple that with the touch he shows with finishing and floaters, etc., I feel very confident that he is a league average shooter sooner rather than later. Essentially progression is not linear. Couple that with his defensive prowess, and the idea of a Zion/Clarke front-court closing out games makes me drool.
Sorry I can’t quote for some reason Pelicanidae, still having issues posting.
We disagree a bit on SGA. His shooting was seen as a liability coming out of high school, and there were even some questions about it coming into the league. The fact that he is already a league average shooter leads me to believe he is going to be at least a plus shooter relatively soon. While not an explosive athlete, the pace and feel he play with is remarkable for a 19 year old, while not at Luka’s level it really is something to behold. He is also 6’6 with a 7’0 foot wingspan. His defensive potential, and what he has already shown in the league is incredible. Pairing him with Jrue and Zion, would essentially give you 3 elite multi positional defenders. He also doesn’t have to be on the ball, which would make him an ideal partner for both Zion and Jrue. While not an elite playmaker, he is solid, and only continues to get better. I would be really surprised if he at least does not make a couple of all star teams. He could also be one of those guys whose stats don’t match his value. The Al Horford of guards so to speak. I think the Miami pick has real value they are in cap hell, and unless Pat Riley can pull something off, which I am not discounting, they easily seem like a lottery team in 2021. We agree on Shamet, although a high IQ guy who shoots lights would be the type of guys Im getting to build around Zion. I would rather have Shamet than say Mitchell Robinson.
Having said that if the Celtics would include Tatum, Brown, and the Memphis pick next year as the nucleus, I would still take that over the Clippers package.
I touched on this with Clarke, and I actually wasn’t aware of his wingspan until you mentioned it, but he has completely reworked his jump shot in the last year. The strides he has made only in the last year are incredibly promising. You couple that with the touch he shows with finishing and floaters, etc., I feel very confident that he is a league average shooter sooner rather than later. Essentially progression is not linear. Couple that with his defensive prowess, and the idea of a Zion/Clarke front-court closing out games makes me drool.
Last edited by bogiesfedora; 05-23-2019 at 05:33 PM. Reason: Difficulties Posting
I think we disagree on SGA, i.e. if you were just looking at the guys that would headline packages. SGA, Tatum, Ingram, and Barrett, I would personally take SGA over all 4 although Tatum is close. His shooting has only improved since he was at Kentucky, in high school he was seen as a question mark in that department, and it has continued to get better. He is not an explosive athlete for a PG by any means, but plays with pace and feel well beyond his years. In that regard he is similar to Luka although obviously not at that level. While not an elite playmaker, he is certainly serviceable at this point, and it would only seem he is going to get better in that regard. He’s also 6’6 with a 7’0 foot wingspan and his defense isn’t theoretical he has already shown it at the NBA level. A Jrue/SGA backcourt would be devastating defensively. You could essentially build a team that 3 of your 5 starters are elite multi positional defenders. On Shamet we agree, but he seems to be the perfect non-star you would want to build around Zion. High IQ guys with elite shooting ability. Gallo and Harrell are what they are, and I would not wanna have to pay Harrell 15 plus million next year just to keep him, although he is a solid player.
I like Hunter a lot, but I don't see how the Knicks can get another top 10 pick unless we do a 3 team trade and that include AD and Jrue Holiday.
Strange that you're still not able to post normally. I wonder why that is, but I'm afraid I have no idea.
For SGA, I'm aware that his defense is good and I'm pretty happy to go along with the fact that he's a capable, switchy defender with real length. A lot of my problem with him comes on offense. Obviously he's only a rookie, and he's only what, 20? So he still has time to improve, but there's very little in his game offensively that really knocks my socks off. He shot about league average from three this year, and a touch above average on catch and shoot threes, but well below average off the dribble. That's not the end of the world, but it's also not massively encouraging. He only put up a little over 10 points a game, and only about 3 assists per game. I know he only played a bit over 25 minutes a game, but if you're not scoring as a PG you need to be playmaking and creating for others, and he wasn't really doing that. He wasn't awful at it either, I'm not trying to say that, but I'm just trying to explain why I don't see star from him.
I think my worry is that when you trade AD, you really want somebody with star potential in there. With the Knicks, there's the #3 pick which could be Barrett. Some think he has that possible all-star potential, I know I do. With Boston, there's Tatum who has already flashed some of that star potential. With the Clippers, I think they just have a couple of good promising roleplayers. There's definitely value in that, but I don't value it over potential all-star guys, especially when their picks aren't that great either.
I write that knowing I might be abnormally high on SGA, I would point blank take him over both Morant and Barrett longterm in a heartbeat.
Yeah, that is a little abnormally high.
In fact, are you Oleh Kosel?
Maybe I have not watched him enough, but I do not get it. I do not see him as special.
Lol Na, I havent listened to the podcast yet. I am not the only one that high on SGA though, Jonathan Tjarks expressed similar thoughts on The Ringer’s draft podcast on Friday, he would take SGA 2 in this draft no questions asked, and liked him over Tatum. I think our disagreement is I view SGA as future all star and you do not. I agree Barrett certainly has that potential, but SGA’s floor is just so much higher, and I think he has all star potential.
Been seeing coach Vinson at the gym. Want me to ask him if he knows what they are doing lol?
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I think how you feel about the Clippers package depends totally on how you feel about SGA. I think even a high end Clippers package is somewhat limited, though if other teams don't go all out I could be talked into it.
I really like him. I see a lot of Jrue Holiday in him both offensively and defensively, with the main difference being that he's much longer and a bit less quick (and not nearly as strong as current Jrue). I see him as a pretty sure long-term starter, with multiple time All-Star as his ceiling. He has a great feel for playing in the half-court, is smooth, skilled, and incredibly long at the point. He understands how to use ball-screens and in a limited sample size is dangerous in isolation. He's a good defender already who will eventually be able to guard 1-3, maybe small ball 4s given his nearly 7 foot wingspan. He gets blocks, steals at a high rate for a guard, pretty similar in that regard to Jrue as well.
He needs to do a better job limiting bad turnovers and could improve as a playmaker in the halfcourt, but he's a smart, unselfish player who I think will get there.
He lacks high end athleticism or high end shooting skill that makes it hard for me to imagine him as an All-NBA type of guy.
I think he's one of the better assets available that have been discussed for AD. The rest of the Clippers stuff is kind of meh, though Shamet is a great, cost-controlled shooter who doesn't kill you otherwise, which is valuable.
Who knows what the offers will be. Breaking it down into tiers, with my target being maximizing my top end talent and future flexibility, based upon length of contract, potential of asset:
Tatum
SGA, 3 (I like SGA a bit better than 3)
4
Siakam
Lonzo
Memphis Pick, Brandon Ingram, Jaylen Brown, Mitchell Robinson, Landry Shamet, Marcus Smart
14, Future Heat, Kuzma, OG Anunoby
Other Celtics picks, Future Sixers, Future Mavs, Future Lakers, Future Knicks, Future Clippers, Future Raptors
Getting rid of Solomon Hill
Hart, Trier, Danilo Gallinari's expiring, Montrez Harrell's expiring, Van Vleet
Kevin Knox, Mo Wagner, other minor pieces
I think Celtics have the most good pieces with good fit and are diversified over the years. They can make the strongest offer, who knows if they will. I think Lakers are next, but their pieces have fit issues and probably at least one if not several would need to be moved to other teams. I don't think their best pieces are quite as good as the Celtics, Knicks, or Clippers best piece, but they have probably 3 things as good or better than the next best asset from any of those teams. I think, gun to my head, I prefer the Lakers absolute best offer to the Clippers and Knicks best offers, but it's tough and I like Brandon Ingram better than most.
Last edited by Biasvasospasm; 05-23-2019 at 07:49 PM.
http://www.inquisitr.com/5449576/nba...anthony-davis/
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I don't see why the Suns would do that but I'd be interested in it. It's basically better players than NYK or LAL but with a worse pick.
I would probably take that Suns deal, but I would want to flip Jackson.
I like a deal with Brooklyn over anything else I’ve seen. If we could Russell, LeVert, Allen, & maybe Harris. We would essentially be trading AD for the core of a young promising playoff team in the east. Then if we like whoever they acquire in the draft maybe we add one of those players as well. I would like to get one player on a rookie deal, so hopefully we like who they draft or get a future pick instead. Someone like Romeo Langford would be a nice get IMO. I would drop Harris for one or both the first round rookies they draft if they get a decent wing, big, or point guard we like. They have done pretty good in the draft and since we would be getting the core of the team they have now they would likely draft players that fit those 4. Russell & LeVert would be a damn good duo to go with Zion & Jrue. LeVert was beast in the playoffs in those 5 games averaging 21 ppg. He looked unstoppable at times. Russell looked great as well. Allen would be a good starting center. Those 3 are a lot better than what the Knicks have to offer. I just love the thought of getting a 23 year old Russell on the start of a brand new contract that he will hit his prime during. Then hopefully sign LeVert to a decent extension that would run out right when Zion’s rookie deal would be coming up.
C: Allen
PF: Zion
SF: LeVert
SG: Jrue
PG: Russell
I love that team and hope AD would be willing to sign there. Or hope the Nets go back to their dumb ways and make the deal no matter what lol.
Last edited by DaPelFromHell; 05-23-2019 at 11:47 PM.
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