AD trade scenarios...

[Pelicanidae]

I agree. The only way I think AD should be traded is if the package includes Morant. Otherwise, the rest of these potential trade offers seem lackluster and uninspiring.

What you have to realise is that there may not be three options here.

The way you've presented it there makes it look like the options are: 1) trade AD for these things, or 2) Keep AD.

That's not the choice that's being made here. The choice is 1) Trade AD for these things, 2) possibly keep AD, 3) lose AD for absolutely nothing.

Griffin will know after the meeting coming up, but it's possible that option 2 doesn't exist. IN that case, the choice is 1) Make the best trade for AD you can, or 2) Lose him for nothing.

In that case, you make a trade 100% of the time, even if it's not the perfect trade. You will almost never get 1-to-1 return for an MVP candidate.

[60minutes]

What you have to realise is that there may not be three options here.

The way you've presented it there makes it look like the options are: 1) trade AD for these things, or 2) Keep AD.

That's not the choice that's being made here. The choice is 1) Trade AD for these things, 2) possibly keep AD, 3) lose AD for absolutely nothing.

Griffin will know after the meeting coming up, but it's possible that option 2 doesn't exist. IN that case, the choice is 1) Make the best trade for AD you can, or 2) Lose him for nothing.

In that case, you make a trade 100% of the time, even if it's not the perfect trade. You will almost never get 1-to-1 return for an MVP candidate.

I have not presented it this way at all. As you have somewhat alluded to, the meeting between Griffen and AD is forthcoming. Coming out of that meeting, we will know whether or not option #2 is actually an option at all.

If Davis is willing to sign a max contract--and I believe strongly he has to agree to an extension to avoid a trade--then you move forward with him. If he hedges on signing an extension--opting to remain on the team short-term while taking a wait-and-see approach--then you wisely trade him because you lose leverage the closer he gets to free agency next summer.

Yes, certainly, you try to make the best trade you possibly can. I do not disagree. But that does not mean that the potential trade scenarios have not been lackluster. The most intriguing aspect of the Knicks offer is reuniting RJ Barrett and Zion and the potential of securing the unprotected 2021 draft pick from the Mavs. This could very well be your best offer although to me--and it is only an opinion--it would look a helluva more attractive if the Knicks were sitting in the #2 spot where the Pels could secure Morant. But this deal might be the most enticing.

Then you have the Lakers. I do not understand what is so good about their offer. That team is in shambles and cannot win with the terrible young talent that we should now agree to accept in return for Davis? I do not like their assets whatsoever. Ingram is about to fall apart, the #4 pick in a shallow draft is not making me jump and down, and I do not think we want Lonzo any more than his father does not want him to be here. Kuzma is good but not elite. In fact, if Griffen's price is an elite young talent, please show me who in the Lakers' haul fulfills that part of the calculus.

Finally, I do like Tatum a lot despite his struggles in the playoffs. But word on the street is Ainge might not want to trade him if he feels that Kyrie won't return. But let's say he feels desperate to add AD and trades Tatum. Then what? The #14 and #20 picks are not the kind of haul many expected when just two years ago everyone raved about all the draft picks the Celtics had. This is what even causes me some pause about the Mavs 2021 pick--things can change quickly. In any case, maybe you get Smart and Brown and it is decent but not the kind of thing that makes me jump up and down.

So in the end, if you are forced to trade AD, then you have to take one of these offers or whatever best offer is there even if it is IMPERFECT. But right now as we all speculate on this, and while we do not know if Griffen will convince AD to return, I am not to keen on a lot of the potential trade scenarios I have heard.

[Pelicanidae]

I have not presented it this way at all. As you have somewhat alluded to, the meeting between Griffen and AD is forthcoming. Coming out of that meeting, we will know whether or not option #2 is actually an option at all.

If Davis is willing to sign a max contract--and I believe strongly he has to agree to an extension to avoid a trade--then you move forward with him. If he hedges on signing an extension--opting to remain on the team short-term while taking a wait-and-see approach--then you wisely trade him because you lose leverage the closer he gets to free agency next summer.

Yes, certainly, you try to make the best trade you possibly can. I do not disagree. But that does not mean that the potential trade scenarios have not been lackluster. The most intriguing aspect of the Knicks offer is reuniting RJ Barrett and Zion and the potential of securing the unprotected 2021 draft pick from the Mavs. This could very well be your best offer although to me--and it is only an opinion--it would look a helluva more attractive if the Knicks were sitting in the #2 spot where the Pels could secure Morant. But this deal might be the most enticing.

I agree that it's the most enticing, and I also agree that it would be better if they had better stuff. I think that's true for all trades though: they are more attractive if they have better assets. I'm higher than you on Robinson though. I think his ceiling is Rudy Gobert level talent. Obviously that's a long shot and he may never reach that ceiling, but it's definitely attractive to me.

Then you have the Lakers. I do not understand what is so good about their offer.

You and I both I genuinely think the Lakers deal is awful. Won't catch me disagreeing there.

Finally, I do like Tatum a lot despite his struggles in the playoffs. But word on the street is Ainge might not want to trade him if he feels that Kyrie won't return. But let's say he feels desperate to add AD and trades Tatum. Then what? The #14 and #20 picks are not the kind of haul many expected when just two years ago everyone raved about all the draft picks the Celtics had. This is what even causes me some pause about the Mavs 2021 pick--things can change quickly. In any case, maybe you get Smart and Brown and it is decent but not the kind of thing that makes me jump up and down.

So in the end, if you are forced to trade AD, then you have to take one of these offers or whatever best offer is there even if it is IMPERFECT. But right now as we all speculate on this, and while we do not know if Griffen will convince AD to return, I am not to keen on a lot of the potential trade scenarios I have heard.

I'm pretty keen on the Knicks trade. I think #3, Robinson, and the Dallas picks are a legitimately attractive haul, and I think you could probably flip DSJ for something else later too, though exactly what I'm not sure. Obviously no trade is perfect in this kind of scenario, but that's one that wouldn't make me feel sick.

Can you point me to a decent source for the idea that Ainge is suddenly not open to trading Tatum? All we've heard all year is that basically everyone is on the table, and even some recent reports from the last two weeks or so have said that Ainge is still open to trading for AD whether Kyrie stays or not. In that case, I'd be curious about contradictory reports.

As for the Mavs pick, I think that depends on a lot of factors. Luka is a really special talent, but Porzingis has been seriously injured for a long time, and his off-court life has been crazy recently. I don't see him returning at all-star level, and if he doesn't then the Mavs may be in trouble: they aren't known for their ability to attract free agents.

[donato]

Really would love to get Ja. Even a bit of an overpay (whatever that is), it would be nice. I wonder if that's something our FO is thinking about exploring. So, I like the idea of a three-way (don't we all ).

[DaPelFromHell]

An ideal scenario would be a 3 team trade.

Boston: AD & Avery Bradley (or just AD)

Memphis: Jaylen Brown, Terry Rozier, pick 14 & 20 in the draft (maybe 23 too)

Pelicans: Jayson Tatum, Marcus Smart, Robert Williams, & Memphis’ #2 to select Ja Morant

C: Okafor, Williams
PF: Zion
SF: Tatum
SG: Jrue, Smart
PG: Morant

That would be so sick!! Smart as our 6th man. Don’t know if this would even be possible, but it’s highly unlikely anyway. A Jrue & Smart defensive backcourt would be sick

Memphis still has Conley under contract for 2 years, so they don’t need Ja really lol.

We would probably have to take Al Horford though which would make us have to switch Brown for Smart. I don’t know how it works with contracts and BS

C: Horford
PF: Zion
SF: Tatum
SG: Jrue, Smart
PG: Morant

That team could make the playoffs for sure

[Saints#34]

Is Ja Morant that much better of a prospect than RJ Barrett? I don’t watch much ncaa basketball. I had the impression at least early on that most thought they were fairly equal?


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[Pelicanidae]

Is Ja Morant that much better of a prospect than RJ Barrett? I don’t watch much ncaa basketball. I had the impression at least early on that most thought they were fairly equal?


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A lot of people soured on Barrett as the season went on, while Morant's stock shot up. While I think they both have pretty similar levels of overall promise, the hype around Morant is much higher right now.

[tdcreator]

An ideal scenario would be a 3 team trade.

Boston: AD & Avery Bradley (or just AD)

Memphis: Jaylen Brown, Terry Rozier, pick 14 & 20 in the draft (maybe 23 too)

Pelicans: Jayson Tatum, Marcus Smart, Robert Williams, & Memphis’ #2 to select Ja Morant

C: Okafor, Williams
PF: Zion
SF: Tatum
SG: Jrue, Smart
PG: Morant

That would be so sick!! Smart as our 6th man. Don’t know if this would even be possible, but it’s highly unlikely anyway. A Jrue & Smart defensive backcourt would be sick

I doubt those late picks would be enough. I’d try this

Boston: AD & Moore

Memphis: Jaylen Brown, pick 14 & 20, and their pick from Boston back

Pelicans: Jayson Tatum, Hayward, pick 22 & Memphis’ #2 to select Ja Morant
(I’d like to flip Hayward to the suns for Warren and Bridges and if not get their number 6 to take Culver or trade for Beal)

Morant, Elfrid
Jrue, Frank
Tatum, Bridges
Zion, TJ Warren
Okafor, Woods

[pelicanchamp]

LAKERS: get AD

GRIZZLIES: get 4th pick of draft, Lonzo Ball, Brandon Ingram. PELS 2nd round pick

PELS get 2nd pick, Kyle Kuzma, Josh Hart LAKERS 2021 and 2023 1st rounders

Draft Ja Morant.


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[Pelicanidae]

LAKERS: get AD

GRIZZLIES: get 4th pick of draft, Lonzo Ball, Brandon Ingram. PELS 2nd round pick

PELS get 2nd pick, Kyle Kuzma, Josh Hart LAKERS 2021 and 2023 1st rounders

Draft Ja Morant.


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Why would the Grizzlies ever do that?

[tdcreator]

Why would the Grizzlies ever do that?

Depends if they like Ingram and Ball. I think any trade will depend on that with the Lakers involved.

[Pelicanidae]

Depends if they like Ingram and Ball. I think any trade will depend on that with the Lakers involved.

I guess, but when have the Grizzlies ever shown signs that they're really bad talent evaluators?

[Eman5805]

Is Ja Morant that much better of a prospect than RJ Barrett? I don’t watch much ncaa basketball. I had the impression at least early on that most thought they were fairly equal?


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Much? No. I don't think so. RJ was the one people thought would be the consensus #1 pick when the season started. His talent is considerable. Great handle, good athleticism, great slasher, a decent rhythm shooter while sporting a 6'7" frame that looks like a true 6'7" and not those phantom ones that get like an inch and a half from the shoes. He moves fluidly and the ball doesn't seem to stall in his hands. He's either attacking, making a pass, or shooting it when he gets the ball.

Ja Mortant has all of those qualities, while being a better athlete...but his frame is so slight it worries me. But he and De'Aaron Fox are pretty much identical in terms of build and athleticism, so it's no great worry. But when things are kinda even. I tend to lean towards Morant for this team though.

[Pelicanidae]

Much? No. I don't think so. RJ was the one people thought would be the consensus #1 pick when the season started. His talent is considerable. Great handle, good athleticism, great slasher, a decent rhythm shooter while sporting a 6'7" frame that looks like a true 6'7" and not those phantom ones that get like an inch and a half from the shoes. He moves fluidly and the ball doesn't seem to stall in his hands. He's either attacking, making a pass, or shooting it when he gets the ball.

Ja Mortant has all of those qualities, while being a better athlete...but his frame is so slight it worries me. But he and De'Aaron Fox are pretty much identical in terms of build and athleticism, so it's no great worry. But when things are kinda even. I tend to lean towards Morant for this team though.

RJ can also defend whereas Morant just can't, and doesn't have the kind of build that projects well towards it. Morant is, of course, the superior passer though. So it's up to you to judge. I take RJ over Morant, personally.

[pelicanchamp]

https://youtu.be/mkXK4Js7rNg

We should trade with LAKERS.

I believe the Bulls will give LA 7th pick for Lonzo Ball. This is a trade idea....

PELS receive 4th pick(Garland), Kyle Kuzma, Brandon Ingram, 7th pick via Chicago. PELS draft Center Jaxson Hayes or Bol Bol.

BULLS receive: Lonzo Ball

LAKERS receive AD

[PELICANSFAN]

https://youtu.be/mkXK4Js7rNg

We should trade with LAKERS.

I believe the Bulls will give LA 7th pick for Lonzo Ball. This is a trade idea....

PELS receive 4th pick(Garland), Kyle Kuzma, Brandon Ingram, 7th pick via Chicago. PELS draft Center Jaxson Hayes or Bol Bol.

BULLS receive: Lonzo Ball

LAKERS receive AD

I have heard that rumor reported as well (Bulls sending #7 to the Lakers). If true, is this possible?-

Bulls - Ball
Lakers - AD
Pels - #2, Ingram, Kuzma, Wagner
Grizzlies - #4, #7, Hart

This would give the Pels Zion and Morant. We would be gambling on Ingram's health, but it could pay off.

[Pelicanidae]

I have heard that rumor reported as well (Bulls sending #7 to the Lakers). If true, is this possible?-

Bulls - Ball
Lakers - AD
Pels - #2, Ingram, Kuzma, Wagner
Grizzlies - #4, #7, Hart

This would give the Pels Zion and Morant. We would be gambling on Ingram's health, but it could pay off.

I don't know if I'd take it. I'm not as high on Morant as a lot of people (I like him, but I have him behind RJ), Ingram's health is such a huge gamble I want no part of it, Kuzma is a whatever player and Wagner is a nothing. Why would I take this instead of taking the NY trade and getting RJ, who most people agree is roughly on a level with Morant, and Robinson who actually shows signs of being good and doesn't have the health risks someone like Ingram carries?

[Mythrol]

It's not just gambling on Ingram's health. It's a no win situation with Ingram. He's a RFA after next season. Either he balls out and we are forced to match a big contract while still only being 1 year removed and always the lingering issue of his condition or he plays bad enough that he doesn't command a large contract and he will have been a waste in the AD trade.

Ask yourself this: What could the Lakers get for Ingram from other teams? Do you think anyone else is giving up much value at all for him? Nope. So why do people want him to be the 2nd best piece from an AD trade? Simply doesn't make sense.

[PELICANSFAN]

It's not just gambling on Ingram's health. It's a no win situation with Ingram. He's a RFA after next season. Either he balls out and we are forced to match a big contract while still only being 1 year removed and always the lingering issue of his condition or he plays bad enough that he doesn't command a large contract and he will have been a waste in the AD trade.

Ask yourself this: What could the Lakers get for Ingram from other teams? Do you think anyone else is giving up much value at all for him? Nope. So why do people want him to be the 2nd best piece from an AD trade? Simply doesn't make sense.

All depends on how Griffin and staff feel about Ingram as well as Morant and Barrett. I agree that I am not big on taking a risk on Ingram, but there were rumors (before the blood clot issue) that Griffin was high on Ingram. It is all a mystery right now as we do not know how Griffin and staff feel about the draft choices after Zion or the individual potential young trade assets such as Robinson, DSJ, Knox, Tatum, Brown, Ingram, etc.

[Pelicanidae]

It's not just gambling on Ingram's health. It's a no win situation with Ingram. He's a RFA after next season. Either he balls out and we are forced to match a big contract while still only being 1 year removed and always the lingering issue of his condition or he plays bad enough that he doesn't command a large contract and he will have been a waste in the AD trade.

Ask yourself this: What could the Lakers get for Ingram from other teams? Do you think anyone else is giving up much value at all for him? Nope. So why do people want him to be the 2nd best piece from an AD trade? Simply doesn't make sense.

As far as I'm concerned at this point, if we end up with Ingram at all it has to be as a cheap throw in piece. He cannot be the first, second, or even third most important thing in an AD deal. He's just not been good enough to warrant anything like the risk he presents.

[Eman5805]

I have heard that rumor reported as well (Bulls sending #7 to the Lakers). If true, is this possible?-

Bulls - Ball
Lakers - AD
Pels - #2, Ingram, Kuzma, Wagner
Grizzlies - #4, #7, Hart

This would give the Pels Zion and Morant. We would be gambling on Ingram's health, but it could pay off.

I'd rather give them Ingram and Kuzma and get the Lakers 4th pick. But I doubt they'd ever go for that.

[Primetime]

At his current value, Ingram is definitely a piece you want. The blood clot only serves to lessen his value and because he's a Laker, he's getting downgraded probably more than he should. Ingram has a ton of upside, was playing good basketball prior to blood clot, and as mentioned is a RFA, which isn't completely a bad thing; we always have last call on matching.

I'd love to take the risk w/him, but I agree that if he's the second biggest piece and we're not getting a boatload of picks back, something seems off.

[Mythrol]

All depends on how Griffin and staff feel about Ingram as well as Morant and Barrett. I agree that I am not big on taking a risk on Ingram, but there were rumors (before the blood clot issue) that Griffin was high on Ingram. It is all a mystery right now as we do not know how Griffin and staff feel about the draft choices after Zion or the individual potential young trade assets such as Robinson, DSJ, Knox, Tatum, Brown, Ingram, etc.

There's far more ways to get Morant or RJ Barrett than doing a deal with the Lakers. Any deal that you can get with Lonzo you can get with Tatum and better pieces too. Heck I bet Brown has similar or better value than Lonzo. Or just do the trade directly with the Knicks for Barrett. How the Pels feel about Morant and Barrett are irrelevant to judging Ingram.

Ingram as he currently is with his current contract simply cannot be the 2nd "best" piece in an AD trade. I'd lay money on it that Griffin feels this exact same way. Again, look at his value around the league. What team is giving up anything for him outside of some Pels fans thinking he should be a core piece to the AD deal.

[pelicanchamp]

Wow, Brandon Ingram is better than any player I’ve heard mentioned in any trade for AD. I am really surprised that y’all think he’s not worth it. He’s definitely better than Tatum. It’s not even close in my opinion. If he has a great season then that’s FANTASTIC! We want to resign him and be set at SF. The kid shot nearly 50 percent from the field. He’s very skilled and has potential to be an all star.

https://youtu.be/aNisYMJQKUg


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[Primetime]

There's a part of me that wonders if doing a deal w/Lakers isn't the clear best route -- I mean if they include the youngsters of our choice, and all their future picks. That front office is laughably bad. In a few years, those picks could be worth a ton. Remember that LeBron is old and age can hit you all at once. Not to mention injuries. AD himself is injury prone and isn't the type of guy who is going to go out and recruit for you. They can easily find themselves in a couple years with an old LeBron and a maxed out AD on their books leaving them no room for anything. Plus they won't have the draft picks to help them. Plus the picks in the mid to late lottery now carry more value. If the Lakers say 'F it, lets go for it' I'm not sure this isn't a sure-fire win for Pelicans.

We are talking about a front office who after signing LeBron went out and got Rajon Rondo, Lance Stephenson, and JaVale McGee.