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After this last game, and the last few he hasn't played.. This is your major takeaway? Trey clearly isn't a replacement for Ingram, no one on this squad is. Murray Isn't nearly as good if we're being honest. At this point it's pretty obvious Ingram has nothing to do with this team's shortcomings.Originally Posted by Silverfoxx
I agree, but Ingram and Zion cannot remain on the same team due to cap constraints. One has to go. This point isn’t even debatable.
That's a better argument for moving either one of them. But this idea some have on this board that anyone on this squad can fill in for Ingram is absurd. Always has been.
Pels will let themselves out of the zion deal.
Ingram I think they trade for whatever
It starts with the FO decisions. Not prioritizing 3 pt shooting and bringing in an actual freaking PG until it's too late is the type of stupidity that landed us here to begin with. We just assumed that Zion and BI could shoulder all of the playmaking burdern themselves and it bit us in the arse. It was stupid. We could have realistically built a team around them but we threw pieces together and called it a day. CJ in hindsight was not the move we needed. It made us a better team but we didn't learn to win the right way. Not his fault so much as the front office's.
Where do I start with the Willie hire. We waited until deep in the rebuild to hire a rookie head coach. Not the first year. Not the 2nd. We waited until the third year and acquired CJ and Jonas to make us a win now team and piled the pressure on a rookie head coach. It was spectacularly unfair to expect Willie to be ready. I do believe he has good qualities and can make it in the right environment and with more time. But I said it when he was hired- it was a massive mistake. I think he is good at developing talent and is a guy the players can get behind. He has some qualities. The problem with him is he just doesn't understand how to win. He doesn't get it. The fact that the one player that he'd get heated at (Jonas) was the one player who was always available and always brought the veteran presence we needed speaks volumes. He has favorites. He doesn't seem to see things objectively and it affected his lineups and decisions in game. He thought Zion and Bi could handle ballhandling duty for the entire game. He thought Zion could get away with bully ball and 0 3pt shooting to support him. He actively encouraged our players to keep doing the same things and expect different results. As a result we never grew. Willie needs to take this on the chin and learn from it wherever he ends up next. It is almost a certainty he is gone after this year. We would be stupid not to get rid of him. He is wildly unpopular and it will only get worse. Not all his fault. But we clearly need a better coach now. We can't wait for Willie to maybe get it someday.
The writing is on the wall that the Zion/BI combo is done, and the players are giving up on Willie. We still have quality players to build around in Murray, Murphy, Jones, and Missi. Hawkins is flawed and has a Cj McCullum at best ceiling as he can?t play a lick of defense. CJ and Hawkins are nice complimentary players but not building blocks. Would love to swap BI and CJ for Lavine. Lavine is flawed but at least gives us a more athletic 3 point shooter/scorer to make a big 3 of Murray/Lavine/Zion if Zion doesn?t force his way out.
Lavine would be another CJ here
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Make of this what you will but for those thinking we can get a haul of picks for Zion its worth thinking about.
https://clutchpoints.com/nba-rumors-...-harsh-reality
"“Yet, as always, the success of the Pelicans hinges on the health of Williamson, who another NBA executive told HoopsHype he’d only consider trading one first-round pick to acquire due to his consistent durability concerns,” HoopsHype wrote."
It just isn't working. I am of the mind that once the rot sets in, it is hard to shake it off. In a different world where Willie had 5 years and BI and Zion were healthy, the situation could be drastically different. I think as things stand, Willie isn't good enough and you cannot rely on BI and Zion. Not only do they struggle so stay healthy, they and the coach don't know how to win. We drop way too many games when they are healthy. Willie has proven that he cannot make adjustments quick enough and he cannot deal with the slightest hint of adversity. This team should not have a winning record by any means. But 4-18? At some point you have to say enough is enough. It's Gentry all over again. I'm not going to get mad at Willie because the environment was set up for him to fail. We have to develop a winning mentality and that starts with a player that can carry the franchise. That ain't BI or Zion. I like them both. But they ain't it. We also need a better coach. Things have to change.
I think the Pels will keep Zion as his trade value is depleted . Zion has no skins on the wall to demand anything. I don’t think he signs a 3rd contract with the Pels, but he will likely be with the team for at least 2 more seasons. We need to move BI and CJ, so that should be the focus.
There will most certainly be a trade to stay out of the tax.
BI, CJ and every first we can send for Giannis!
Lol at trading for Lavine. Anyone proposing that should take a look at his injury history...
Have you seen BI?s ? Who could we really get for BI and CJ, like realistically? No one is trading Giannis. That discussion destroys brain cells.
Honestly, every trade discussion destroys brain cells.
Oh, we're (presumably) not getting anyone good...but I can't imagine this franchise/fanbase has any interest in a guy making $50MM/yr and is always hurt.
Trade scenarios are just too unpredictable. Everyone remembers the Cousins trade, nobody saw it coming.
Herb
TM3
Hawk
Missi
Everybody else can go. You can't "play like Golden St" if you have a bunch of dudes that play ISO ball and don't know how to play off the ball. Use these guys as foundation pieces and build from here.
At this point you take that one pick. You're not getting a haul for Zion.
I disagree, you hang on to him and hope he can somehow find enough health over the rest of his contract for someone to add another first or good young player. Otherwise, just wait it out and take whatever you can get later, cut him or just look at it as an expiring. It isn't like he's hindering the development of younger players.
I agree, right now he's like a pair of sixes. He could stay a pair of sixes or if the right cards come up he could turn into full house. So far he just looks like that pair of sixes and nothing else. If somehow he comes back later this month or early January and can stay healthy, which is honestly extremely unlikely, and the team can make a run it may be enough to up his trade value to get an additional first.
With 3 years left on his contract this is probably going to be the longest hand of poker ever.
No they will not. Be realistic.
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