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Thread: December 7th - New Orleans Pelicans vs Detroit Pistons - 15-8

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by luigi modelo View Post
    You guys are seriously undervaluing the covid affect on CJ. Dude has been sick since the beginning of the season and has just recently been working his way back to game shape, both physically and mentally. Dude will be fine
    I'd generally agree, if it weren't for the fact that

    A) CJ didn't get covid until a few weeks ago whereas his poor play has been a season long phenomenon and
    B) He was really bad in the playoffs last season too

    Unless you mean when he went into covid protocols last year, but if you're arguing that his poor play today is a result of him getting covid in March then I think he has serious issues that should concern us long term. And if he's ''working his way back to game shape'' you should expect his play to be getting better rather than worse, and it hasn't, generally speaking.

    In reality, I don't think CJ is doomed. I'm totally happy to believe he'll be better later in the season and that he's just going through the roughest patch of his career - sometimes that does happen, and yeah, it's possible multiple bouts of corona have been catalysts for that poor play. But that doesn't mean it's not concerning for the on-court product that our highest paid player who insists on being taken seriously as a lead guard has been dreadful and that many games are being won in spite of him right now.
    Basketball.

  2. #102
    I'm surprised the Pelicans taking the #1 slot in the West is not a bigger story. Nba.com had a blurb in the game coverage, ESPN said nothing, nothing yet at The Athletic... I know I'm a fan, but still-- objectively, with CJ underperforming so far and multiple games missed by BI, Herb, and Zion due to injuries, plus an extra tough schedule to start the season, the Pels being #1 is incredibly impressive.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Eyquem View Post
    I'm surprised the Pelicans taking the #1 slot in the West is not a bigger story. Nba.com had a blurb in the game coverage, ESPN said nothing, nothing yet at The Athletic... I know I'm a fan, but still-- objectively, with CJ underperforming so far and multiple games missed by BI, Herb, and Zion due to injuries, plus an extra tough schedule to start the season, the Pels being #1 is incredibly impressive.
    There needs to be serious discussions going on for Zion as an MVP candidate. I don't think he's the favourite right now, but he's a damn better candidate than a lot of the names being talked about in the media.

  4. #104
    Even if CJ has been struggling I still think his off the court presence is too vital to this young team for the next 2 years. CJ will be one of the most famous post-NBA guys in media. https://youtu.be/Y0FwlpAuVDE

  5. #105
    The Franchise Contributor luigi modelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I'd generally agree, if it weren't for the fact that

    A) CJ didn't get covid until a few weeks ago whereas his poor play has been a season long phenomenon and
    B) He was really bad in the playoffs last season too

    Unless you mean when he went into covid protocols last year, but if you're arguing that his poor play today is a result of him getting covid in March then I think he has serious issues that should concern us long term. And if he's ''working his way back to game shape'' you should expect his play to be getting better rather than worse, and it hasn't, generally speaking.

    In reality, I don't think CJ is doomed. I'm totally happy to believe he'll be better later in the season and that he's just going through the roughest patch of his career - sometimes that does happen, and yeah, it's possible multiple bouts of corona have been catalysts for that poor play. But that doesn't mean it's not concerning for the on-court product that our highest paid player who insists on being taken seriously as a lead guard has been dreadful and that many games are being won in spite of him right now.
    He was sick for a few weeks, essentially since the first game, before he actually got diagnosed with Covid. He was very sick and the tests kept coming back negative, until they didn't.

  6. #106
    The Franchise Contributor luigi modelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I'd generally agree, if it weren't for the fact that

    A) CJ didn't get covid until a few weeks ago whereas his poor play has been a season long phenomenon and
    B) He was really bad in the playoffs last season too

    Unless you mean when he went into covid protocols last year, but if you're arguing that his poor play today is a result of him getting covid in March then I think he has serious issues that should concern us long term. And if he's ''working his way back to game shape'' you should expect his play to be getting better rather than worse, and it hasn't, generally speaking.

    In reality, I don't think CJ is doomed. I'm totally happy to believe he'll be better later in the season and that he's just going through the roughest patch of his career - sometimes that does happen, and yeah, it's possible multiple bouts of corona have been catalysts for that poor play. But that doesn't mean it's not concerning for the on-court product that our highest paid player who insists on being taken seriously as a lead guard has been dreadful and that many games are being won in spite of him right now.
    so it's not concerning

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by luigi modelo View Post
    so it's not concerning
    I explained my position in detail, if you don't think it's a bad thing that someone is out there taking 10+ shots every night and bricking 60% of them, I can't convince you otherwise. Nobody is blaming CJ on a personal level, it's not like anyone is saying he's a bad person because he's playing bad and it's not like people are saying it's going to last forever. It's just causing problems on the court right now, which I'm not sure that anyone could deny without doing some mental gymnastics.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I'd generally agree, if it weren't for the fact that

    A) CJ didn't get covid until a few weeks ago whereas his poor play has been a season long phenomenon and
    B) He was really bad in the playoffs last season too

    Unless you mean when he went into covid protocols last year, but if you're arguing that his poor play today is a result of him getting covid in March then I think he has serious issues that should concern us long term. And if he's ''working his way back to game shape'' you should expect his play to be getting better rather than worse, and it hasn't, generally speaking.

    In reality, I don't think CJ is doomed. I'm totally happy to believe he'll be better later in the season and that he's just going through the roughest patch of his career - sometimes that does happen, and yeah, it's possible multiple bouts of corona have been catalysts for that poor play. But that doesn't mean it's not concerning for the on-court product that our highest paid player who insists on being taken seriously as a lead guard has been dreadful and that many games are being won in spite of him right now.
    He was dealing with a finger and an illness earlier in the season and is now coming back from covid. His game is extremely technical, so if his legs aren't under him it kills his ability.

    It is extremely odd to me that people have totally forgotten the four game stretch he had prior to getting covid, when the finger band was removed, in which he shot 17 of 34 from 3. He had broken out of the slump and then got covid. He will be very good again very soon

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I explained my position in detail, if you don't think it's a bad thing that someone is out there taking 10+ shots every night and bricking 60% of them, I can't convince you otherwise. Nobody is blaming CJ on a personal level, it's not like anyone is saying he's a bad person because he's playing bad and it's not like people are saying it's going to last forever. It's just causing problems on the court right now, which I'm not sure that anyone could deny without doing some mental gymnastics.
    CJ needs to take 10+ shots whether he is making them or not. Simple as that. Any further analysis is unnecessary

  10. #110
    The Franchise Contributor luigi modelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I explained my position in detail, if you don't think it's a bad thing that someone is out there taking 10+ shots every night and bricking 60% of them, I can't convince you otherwise. Nobody is blaming CJ on a personal level, it's not like anyone is saying he's a bad person because he's playing bad and it's not like people are saying it's going to last forever. It's just causing problems on the court right now, which I'm not sure that anyone could deny without doing some mental gymnastics.
    Bruh! It has nothing to do with his feelings or being a bad person. I'm not sure why you even brought that up. It's simple: he's a shooter and shooters shoot. Dude has been sick and is working his way back. He is not causing "problems" on the court. Your overanalysis is causing problems. Don't take it personally, I'm sure you are a good person (see what I did there!?)

  11. #111
    The Franchise Contributor luigi modelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    He was dealing with a finger and an illness earlier in the season and is now coming back from covid. His game is extremely technical, so if his legs aren't under him it kills his ability.

    It is extremely odd to me that people have totally forgotten the four game stretch he had prior to getting covid, when the finger band was removed, in which he shot 17 of 34 from 3. He had broken out of the slump and then got covid. He will be very good again very soon
    Thank you

  12. #112
    The Franchise Contributor luigi modelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    CJ needs to take 10+ shots whether he is making them or not. Simple as that. Any further analysis is unnecessary
    and thank you

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by luigi modelo View Post
    Bruh! It has nothing to do with his feelings or being a bad person. I'm not sure why you even brought that up. It's simple: he's a shooter and shooters shoot. Dude has been sick and is working his way back. He is not causing "problems" on the court. Your overanalysis is causing problems. Don't take it personally, I'm sure you are a good person (see what I did there!?)
    Whatever makes you happy, man.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    CJ needs to take 10+ shots whether he is making them or not. Simple as that. Any further analysis is unnecessary
    Sure, that's why I didn't say that it's a bad thing he's taking 10+ shots a night.

    I said it's a bad thing that he's doing that and shooting so poorly on them. That part is the important bit of the sentence.

    I cannot believe we're seriously at a point where I'm saying ''it is bad that our $33m a year player is shooting 39% from the floor'' and people feel the need to argue it

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    He was dealing with a finger and an illness earlier in the season and is now coming back from covid. His game is extremely technical, so if his legs aren't under him it kills his ability.

    It is extremely odd to me that people have totally forgotten the four game stretch he had prior to getting covid, when the finger band was removed, in which he shot 17 of 34 from 3. He had broken out of the slump and then got covid. He will be very good again very soon
    Also, you don't need to explain to me that it's a slump and he'll bounce back - I literally said that in the post you're replying to.

    I don't think CJ is doomed. I'm totally happy to believe he'll be better later in the season and that he's just going through the roughest patch of his career - sometimes that does happen
    People are acting like I said CJ is a scrub that needs to get cut or something, it's weird.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Sure, that's why I didn't say that it's a bad thing he's taking 10+ shots a night.

    I said it's a bad thing that he's doing that and shooting so poorly on them. That part is the important bit of the sentence.

    I cannot believe we're seriously at a point where I'm saying ''it is bad that our $33m a year player is shooting 39% from the floor'' and people feel the need to argue it
    There's a general angst among Pels fans with some trying to say he should move to the bench, so it's more of a general pushback with your post being the easiest to respond to in order to make my point. I know you know

  17. #117
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    Take the ball out of CJ's hands and you have an above average player. Force him be the 'lead guard' and he becomes 'meh' at best...covid or no covid...finger or no finger...legs or no legs.

    I hear people talk about the team having a "Big Three" and I concur. BI, # 1, and JV are as good as any other threesome in the league.
    The most important ABILITY that a player must demonstrate in order to claim "Superstar Status" is AVAILABILITY!!

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by As I See It View Post
    Take the ball out of CJ's hands and you have an above average player. Force him be the 'lead guard' and he becomes 'meh' at best...covid or no covid...finger or no finger...legs or no legs.

    I hear people talk about the team having a "Big Three" and I concur. BI, # 1, and JV are as good as any other threesome in the league.
    incredibly ignorant

  19. #119
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    1 seed in the West Baby 😎

  20. #120
    CJ seems to know at the very least when to take those shots even when he isn’t making them. My biggest peeve is when we have an empty possession or turn the ball over. Zion and BI had big issues with that in the past and it killed us in games. As long as we are getting shots off I can live with him being a bit cold here and there. He has (even as bad as he has struggled this year) literally shot us back into games. He can be that guy more consistently if he can find a stable role in this team. It is loaded. Too loaded. CJ doesn’t have to be THAT guy every night. There are some nights where we will need him to be.

  21. #121
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    incredibly ignorant
    Slander? I wonder where the moderator is. LOL

  22. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by pelafanatic View Post
    incredibly ignorant
    nah man you need to live in reality and accept that its been many months since CJ looked good. He has struggled to fit with Zion, and just struggled in general.

  23. #123
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by hornetsrebirth View Post
    nah man you need to live in reality and accept that its been many months since CJ looked good. He has struggled to fit with Zion, and just struggled in general.
    He certainly showed he couldn't do it last year in Playoffs and that was before #1 entered the picture. He is probably best suited as a sixth or seventh man. From what I've seen thusfar he is a more expensive version of DG (remember when DG was starter for the first three months last year). And, that might be being too kind.

    There is certainly more 'dawg' in Jose'.....certainly more bang for the buck with Jose'!!!
    Last edited by As I See It; 12-08-2022 at 10:43 PM.

  24. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by JJackisangry View Post
    CJ seems to know at the very least when to take those shots even when he isn’t making them. My biggest peeve is when we have an empty possession or turn the ball over. Zion and BI had big issues with that in the past and it killed us in games. As long as we are getting shots off I can live with him being a bit cold here and there. He has (even as bad as he has struggled this year) literally shot us back into games. He can be that guy more consistently if he can find a stable role in this team. It is loaded. Too loaded. CJ doesn’t have to be THAT guy every night. There are some nights where we will need him to be.
    In fairness, outside of his 28 point outing, I struggle to think of many occasions in which he has shot us back into games. On the other hand, I can think of several games he's either shot us out of, or come close to doing so if it weren't for others (Ingram, Zion) going insane in the 4th.

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    In fairness, outside of his 28 point outing, I struggle to think of many occasions in which he has shot us back into games. On the other hand, I can think of several games he's either shot us out of, or come close to doing so if it weren't for others (Ingram, Zion) going insane in the 4th.
    I can live with his cold streak for now knowing that it will eventually get better. I think we are both in agreement that he needs to know when to defer (especially when BI and Z are on the floor). Everyone and their mama wishes he would take that sixth man role. We need him to be assertive though and take his looks. That’s the player he is. When he starts hitting this team is that much more unstoppable.

    Side note- I’m just glad we are actually shooting the ball. How many years did we hesitate to take anything at all and dribble the clock to nothing? It’s a vast improvement in watchability.

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