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Thread: Please do not trade Zion or Ingram for Durant (PART 2)

  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by coreylaron View Post
    If I make a trade for KD, the enjoyment factor for me would be highest if it’s for Zion
    What the hell are you trying to say dude?

    You want to trade Zion for KD?

  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I think all agree with this. The debate, IMO, is ?- If you could peek into the future and see the following two outcomes, which would you choose:

    A) Trade for KD. Go to WCF in year 1, win chip in year two, and then 2nd round, 2nd round, first round, first round?Zion and/or BI start to look elsewhere because of inability to build a great team around them, eventual trade one or both and retool/rebuild

    B) Don?t trade for KD. Two out of the three of DD, Herb, and Trey really develop, along with one more guy we draft over next four years. Combined with Zion and/or BI, you have 4 or 5 guys who become Pels for the majority of their career (say 9-10 years). Play their primes here, all are loved by fan base for decades. But it?s a 90s Jazz situation where they are always 50 wins, get close a few times, maybe even a Finals trip or two. But never win it

    You KNOW those are the two outcomes?which do you choose?
    Initially, I thought I would answer "B" but in an either/or paradigm I guess I'd choose "A."

    If you remove any hope for a championship from the equation, the equation changes, at least for me. Hope is a powerful motivator.

    Obviously, what I really want is to change the conditions of the test, a la Kirk and the Kobayashi Maru. I also don't like a predetermined "no win" scenario!

  3. #53
    You wouldn’t know, while you were in it, that you wouldn’t win a title. Imagine future you decides which multiverse current you would live in, and you just get to live it

    You get to have the hope, in season, that your team would win (and all the joy that comes with it). You just never actually win
    @mcnamara247

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    What the hell are you trying to say dude?

    You want to trade Zion for KD?
    Woah bro. Yes. If we were to make the trade, I would prefer it be for Zion rather than BI or the young guys. Lawd lol

  5. #55
    Well, under those conditions, I'd obviously choose "B" in large part due to the--doomed-- belief that it was possible Pels could win it all.

    But, you are making it hard by predetermining a championship win under "A" and foreclosing it under "B". This is why I've always found either/or hypothets of limited insight. They are too easily constructed to force a result or at least strongly incentivize one. I know I don't have to tell you about the frequent misuse of the false dichotomy in rhetoric. This isn't that exactly but if you say you definitely win a championship one way and you definitely don't win one the other way, the thumb is on the scale pretty heavily. The only way to get me to choose "A" is to extinguish all hope of doing so under "B". If you even said you have an 80% chance of winning under "A" and a 20% chance under "B", I'd still choose "B." But if it's a 0% chance...

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by coreylaron View Post
    Woah bro. Yes. If we were to make the trade, I would prefer it be for Zion rather than BI or the young guys. Lawd lol
    I completely agree. Only KD trade I would be happy with

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I completely agree. Only KD trade I would be happy with
    No that would be a bad idea. See Carmelo Anthony.

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I completely agree. Only KD trade I would be happy with


  9. #59
    Graham 2 2nds and an extra covid card should do it for a kd trade

  10. #60
    Best Coach Ever ULsaint's Avatar
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    I'd rather try and fail to win a title with Zion than win one with Durant. ******** that ashy **********.

  11. #61
    I feel that same way, but about Herb, Trey, BI, and Daniels. Not Zion so much

    And it’s not the drama that everyone now seems to think was made up. It’s the loafing up and down the court in the eighty whatever games he has played in his career. You aren’t gonna find me videos of young MJ, young Lebron or Magic or Larry, etc just walking up and down the court 80 percent of the game. Year 15? Sure, those guys will take some plays off. Year 1 and 2? The true greats play like their hair is on fire. He only ran when he had the ball in his hand, iso. Then, he had all the energy in the world.

    Now, I will be open minded and if this past year was a wake up call, and it was really the coaches he didn’t like and he loves Willie, etc then I will change my tune. There was a reason I was always obsessed with CP3 and never really loved AD - and it’s because production don’t matter nearly as much to me as the effort you put in and how obsessed you are with not losing. Why CP3 will always be the GOAT of this franchise despite many being more “talented”

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I feel that same way, but about Herb, Trey, BI, and Daniels. Not Zion so much

    And it?s not the drama that everyone now seems to think was made up. It?s the loafing up and down the court in the eighty whatever games he has played in his career. You aren?t gonna find me videos of young MJ, young Lebron or Magic or Larry, etc just walking up and down the court 80 percent of the game. Year 15? Sure, those guys will take some plays off. Year 1 and 2? The true greats play like their hair is on fire. He only ran when he had the ball in his hand, iso. Then, he had all the energy in the world.

    Now, I will be open minded and if this past year was a wake up call, and it was really the coaches he didn?t like and he loves Willie, etc then I will change my tune. There was a reason I was always obsessed with CP3 and never really loved AD - and it?s because production don?t matter nearly as much to me as the effort you put in and how obsessed you are with not losing. Why CP3 will always be the GOAT of this franchise despite many being more ?talented?
    Totally fair. Did he loaf around at Duke? He seems reinvigorated now. We shall see!

  13. #63
    Charter Member PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I feel that same way, but about Herb, Trey, BI, and Daniels. Not Zion so much

    And it’s not the drama that everyone now seems to think was made up. It’s the loafing up and down the court in the eighty whatever games he has played in his career. You aren’t gonna find me videos of young MJ, young Lebron or Magic or Larry, etc just walking up and down the court 80 percent of the game. Year 15? Sure, those guys will take some plays off. Year 1 and 2? The true greats play like their hair is on fire. He only ran when he had the ball in his hand, iso. Then, he had all the energy in the world.

    Now, I will be open minded and if this past year was a wake up call, and it was really the coaches he didn’t like and he loves Willie, etc then I will change my tune. There was a reason I was always obsessed with CP3 and never really loved AD - and it’s because production don’t matter nearly as much to me as the effort you put in and how obsessed you are with not losing. Why CP3 will always be the GOAT of this franchise despite many being more “talented”
    To be fair, most of the team (including BI) loafed around under SVG. I think they really hated playing for him.

  14. #64
    Utah has not changed asking price for Mitchell. If NY wants him they may ask for Barrett too. LOL.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    To be fair, most of the team (including BI) loafed around under SVG. I think they really hated playing for him.
    Actually, thats more of indictment of him than an excuse. There's more to being a professional than the Tuesday pay stub. And a real superstar is always game-ready. What we have seen the past three years is a combination of three things:

    1. Neglect - Failure to maintain his physical conditioning is unforgiveable for a superstar.
    2. Entitlement - He has shown very little in this league to prove he is a winner, but has shown considerable abilities as a whiner.
    3. Me First Attitude - He, above everyone else, knew what was being written about him..the team. Rather than squelching the negative pub early on...he let it ride.

    Finally, if it takes a nine figure contract (un-earned to date) to get you to care, you are no superstar.

    Now prove me wrong, Zion.
    Last edited by As I See It; 08-18-2022 at 01:45 PM.
    The most important ABILITY that a player must demonstrate in order to claim "Superstar Status" is AVAILABILITY!!

  16. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by As I See It View Post
    Actually, thats more of indictment of him than an excuse. There's more to being a professional than the Tuesday pay stub. And a real superstar is always game-ready. What we have seen the past three years is a combination of three things:

    1. Neglect - Failure to maintain his physical conditioning is unforgiveable for a superstar.
    2. Entitlement - He has shown very little in this league to prove he is a winner, but has shown considerable abilities as a whiner.
    3. Me First Attitude - He, above everyone else, knew what was being written about him..the team. Rather than squelching the negative pub early on...he let it ride.

    Finally, if it takes a nine figure contract (un-earned to date) to get you to care, you are no superstar.

    Now prove me wrong, Zion.
    Good to see you here. You make some valid points.

  17. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Upper Decker View Post
    Totally fair. Did he loaf around at Duke? He seems reinvigorated now. We shall see!
    Duke Zion was one of my favorite college players ever. But even with Gentry, he was just walking around.

    If h changes, I will be the first to recognize and praise him for it

  18. #68
    Hollygrove 4 Life DroopyDawg's Avatar
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    KD ain't going nowhere. KD met with Nets brass and they decided to "move forward" with the current situation (Nash and Marks). So we can dead this whole KD trade thing.

  19. #69
    The Franchise DarkHornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DroopyDawg View Post
    KD ain't going nowhere. KD met with Nets brass and they decided to "move forward" with the current situation (Nash and Marks). So we can dead this whole KD trade thing.
    Great news. I'm hoping the Kyrie Irving talks die with it and the Lakers are stuck with Westbrook.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkHornet View Post
    Great news. I'm hoping the Kyrie Irving talks die with it and the Lakers are stuck with Westbrook.
    Agreed. No one's bailing out the Lakers for a 2029 first round pick!

  21. #71
    At least we won't have any more YouTubers grifting on the Kevin Durant YouTube Algorithm

  22. #72
    Charter Member PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DroopyDawg View Post
    KD ain't going nowhere. KD met with Nets brass and they decided to "move forward" with the current situation (Nash and Marks). So we can dead this whole KD trade thing.
    Translation - management informed KD that no one will give anything close to value for him, so he either plays or retires.

  23. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkHornet View Post
    Great news. I'm hoping the Kyrie Irving talks die with it and the Lakers are stuck with Westbrook.
    Right. Hopefully nets don’t try to blow it up and send Kyrie at the deadline. In which the case the lakers would get him for cheaper

  24. #74
    Hollygrove 4 Life DroopyDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    Translation - management informed KD that no one will give anything close to value for him, so he either plays or retires.
    Bingo. Nets were asking for the moon... knowing no team would give up all of that. Their sole intention was to keep him all along. If they really wanted to trade him they would have.

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