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Thread: The Alternative to Trading the Pick for A Vet

  1. #1

    The Alternative to Trading the Pick for A Vet

    Griff will shop this pick non stop from now until draft night. But I still dont see who the sellers are. So, the backup plan is to kick the assets down the road. Keep an eye on OKC, NY, Houston -- each have two firsts in that 15-25 range. Griff would love to pick up picks and then move them for future 1sts (similar to what he did last year with the Milwaukee pick)

    So, we get 16 and 18 for #10 and then Griff trades each of those picks for a future top 10 or lotto protected 1st. Added two more picks to the war chest for when sellers do emerge. Because future picks will almost always be more valuable than a non top 5 pick recent rookie. Example -- what would have more trade value right now: Kira or the 2023 lotto protected Hornets pick and the 2024 lotto protected Memphis pick? The latter.

    Just something to keep an eye on and thing about. Or...you can do a combo - 10 for 18 and Dort. Then, trade 18 for a future 1st. Get a guy for now and a pick for the chest.
    @mcnamara247

  2. #2
    I can frick with that

  3. #3
    Band of Skulls & Neon Trees ramsters60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    Griff will shop this pick non stop from now until draft night. But I still dont see who the sellers are. So, the backup plan is to kick the assets down the road. Keep an eye on OKC, NY, Houston -- each have two firsts in that 15-25 range. Griff would love to pick up picks and then move them for future 1sts (similar to what he did last year with the Milwaukee pick)

    So, we get 16 and 18 for #10 and then Griff trades each of those picks for a future top 10 or lotto protected 1st. Added two more picks to the war chest for when sellers do emerge. Because future picks will almost always be more valuable than a non top 5 pick recent rookie. Example -- what would have more trade value right now: Kira or the 2023 lotto protected Hornets pick and the 2024 lotto protected Memphis pick? The latter.

    Just something to keep an eye on and thing about. Or...you can do a combo - 10 for 18 and Dort. Then, trade 18 for a future 1st. Get a guy for now and a pick for the chest.
    I'm thinking that Griff better start producing more wins soon, or this so called warchest might well belong to someone else....
    "we might make dollars, but we don't necessarily make sense"

    "always be sincere....whether you mean it or not"

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsters60 View Post
    I'm thinking that Griff better start producing more wins soon, or this so called warchest might well belong to someone else....
    That's the end game of a warchest

  5. #5
    If we keep the pick, we should draft the hands down best 3 point shooter in the draft in Kispert. He fills a desperate need. There may not be any legitimate sellers, and I would rather fill a need with a guy with a high floor than get cute. Griffin is under the gun for results. We can?t afford a stagnant free agency and a project 1st round pick or 2 in this draft.

    I don?t think the Pacers blow it up. They may even be buyers than sellers. Adding Suggs in Toronto likely rejuvenates that team. I rather keep the pick than overpay for flawed overpaid players in Harrison Barnes and/or Buddy Hield.
    Last edited by Darkhorse985; 06-22-2021 at 10:05 PM.

  6. #6
    Well, hypothetically why not both? You could draft Kispert and trade Bledsoe and picks to SAC/3-way for Buddy. Maybe at that point you even keep Lonzo and just hope the young guys take leaps. 3pt shooting goes from a weakness to a strength. Then if you can somehow find the right deal for Adams that's on the table too.

  7. #7
    RIP BDJ AUSSIE_PELICAN's Avatar
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    Or he may not find any takers for the 10th pick that is worth while and draft best player.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN View Post
    Or he may not find any takers for the 10th pick that is worth while and draft best player.
    I just cant see that. Last year, we had a deal to move back if Haliburton fell one more pick. The only reason we didnt trade the 13th was because the two offers he had to trade back were contingent on Haliburton being there. Once he got taken, Griff had no offers and selected Kira

    This year, there are enough buyers to almost guarantee there will be someone a team loves at 10 to pay for

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    Griff will shop this pick non stop from now until draft night. But I still dont see who the sellers are. So, the backup plan is to kick the assets down the road. Keep an eye on OKC, NY, Houston -- each have two firsts in that 15-25 range. Griff would love to pick up picks and then move them for future 1sts (similar to what he did last year with the Milwaukee pick)

    So, we get 16 and 18 for #10 and then Griff trades each of those picks for a future top 10 or lotto protected 1st. Added two more picks to the war chest for when sellers do emerge. Because future picks will almost always be more valuable than a non top 5 pick recent rookie. Example -- what would have more trade value right now: Kira or the 2023 lotto protected Hornets pick and the 2024 lotto protected Memphis pick? The latter.

    Just something to keep an eye on and thing about. Or...you can do a combo - 10 for 18 and Dort. Then, trade 18 for a future 1st. Get a guy for now and a pick for the chest.
    I understand the logic behind this move, but how do you sell this to Zions camp, season ticket holders, etc that this move will contribute to wins for next season? Of course you can have strong war chest at the deadline, but if next season is playoffs or bust what if there is a scenario that's real where Griff plays things too long term and safe and we get off to a bad start and by the time trade deadline arises we are in a more pressured or unrealistic situation to even make the playoffs with the third piece (Chicago Bulls Vuc trade situation).

    I understand the long game approach, but trading the 10 pick for future picks with Bled still on the roster and having to resign Lonzo is just a hard sell based on the expectation for moves/FAs to grab in the off season and to start the season with a better roster. I can be missing something, but is it possible to this move AND get off Bled salary or Adams and aquire more talent before the season start?
    CAW CAW!!!

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  10. #10
    The offseason wouldnt end the second the draft is over.

    You think Zions camp would care if you brought in some rookie? Rookies dont effect winning.

    Griffs #1 route will still be to trade 10 for a vet. I am just saying if that isnt an option, this route above is more likely tjan just staying at 10 and picking some kid at 10.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    The offseason wouldnt end the second the draft is over.

    You think Zions camp would care if you brought in some rookie? Rookies dont effect winning.

    Griffs #1 route will still be to trade 10 for a vet. I am just saying if that isnt an option, this route above is more likely tjan just staying at 10 and picking some kid at 10.
    I'm sticking with Davion Mitchell at 10. He'll be 23 when the season starts. He's ready to contribute to winning now. I would look to trade future picks for a vet. Like maybe Adams or Bledsoe + picks for Turner

  12. #12
    Just because we like Mitchell does not mean Griff. likes him.

  13. #13
    If we trade back, I hope we target Chris Duarte. I agree that OKC and the Knicks are possible candidates to trade up.
    Last edited by Darkhorse985; 06-22-2021 at 11:31 PM.

  14. #14
    Griff may pull a Loomis and pick a guy projected in 2nd round with the 10 th pick.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by 13 - 3 View Post
    Just because we like Mitchell does not mean Griff. likes him.
    True. I can't imagine Griff not liking him though. A PG like Mitchell gives him a great pass on letting Zo walk.

  16. #16
    Surely Griff can’t screw this up.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    The offseason wouldnt end the second the draft is over.

    You think Zions camp would care if you brought in some rookie? Rookies dont effect winning.

    Griffs #1 route will still be to trade 10 for a vet. I am just saying if that isnt an option, this route above is more likely tjan just staying at 10 and picking some kid at 10.
    I'm more concerned with Bled or Adams being off the books to grab FAs after the draft. If we can trade #10 and Bled for future picks than that would be fine

  18. #18
    Admittedly I’m a few beers in but I found myself daydreaming about a franchise reset to go with new coach. Reports are that several teams with top picks would trade out for a veteran All-Star player. What if we leaned into this draft instead of bailing out?

    For example, would you trade Ingram to the Cavs for a deal centered on the #3 pick + Kevin Love? Say you came out of that deal with Suggs and then took Kispert at 10? So your top 10 next year are:

    PG: Suggs/Lewis
    SG: NAW/Hart
    SF: Kispert/Marshall
    PF: Zion/Love
    C: Adams/Hayes

    In this scenario I’m assuming you sign and trade Lonzo, unloading Bled in the deal or in a separate deal. I know the CW is you have to placate an impatient Zion with win-now vets, but I’d be willing to risk that if I got two foundational guys on rookie deals that fit with him. I guess I can’t shake the feeling that something is fundamentally bent in the Zion/Ingram pairing….but again I’ve had a few.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by new city champ View Post
    Admittedly I?m a few beers in but I found myself daydreaming about a franchise reset to go with new coach. Reports are that several teams with top picks would trade out for a veteran All-Star player. What if we leaned into this draft instead of bailing out?

    For example, would you trade Ingram to the Cavs for a deal centered on the #3 pick + Kevin Love? Say you came out of that deal with Suggs and then took Kispert at 10? So your top 10 next year are:

    PG: Suggs/Lewis
    SG: NAW/Hart
    SF: Kispert/Marshall
    PF: Zion/Love
    C: Adams/Hayes

    In this scenario I?m assuming you sign and trade Lonzo, unloading Bled in the deal or in a separate deal. I know the CW is you have to placate an impatient Zion with win-now vets, but I?d be willing to risk that if I got two foundational guys on rookie deals that fit with him. I guess I can?t shake the feeling that something is fundamentally bent in the Zion/Ingram pairing?.but again I?ve had a few.
    Chemistry. BI to me thinks he?s better than he is (which is cool. I?d rather be caught with it than without it you know what I mean) and I do believe there?s something not connecting as well. If someone convinces me that Suggs could come in on some D Rose/Ja who understands Zion needs 20-22fga volume, I?d be down tbh. It?s a risk I?m sure griff Is pondering somewhere.

  20. #20
    I say if they have a shot at Kispert take him, and replace Lonzo?s contract with a shooter.


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  21. #21
    Charter Member PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    This year, there are enough buyers to almost guarantee there will be someone a team loves at 10 to pay for
    Why is that? Is there a perceived big drop off after say, 10 or 12, that would make teams below us buyers? I do like the idea of trading 10 for 18 and Dort or even 16 and 18 (and trading one for a future 1st and drafting a player at 16 that has "fallen").

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by 13 - 3 View Post
    Just because we like Mitchell does not mean Griff. likes him.
    So true.

  23. #23
    Charter Member PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Didn't Mitchell measure smaller than expected yesterday? That and his age may contribute to a fall on draft night. Would be exciting if we were able to trade down from 10 to 16 and 18 with OKC and someone like Mitchell or Kispert fall to 16. We could have the best of both worlds - draft one of them and trade the other pick for a future 1st.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    Why is that? Is there a perceived big drop off after say, 10 or 12, that would make teams below us buyers? I do like the idea of trading 10 for 18 and Dort or even 16 and 18 (and trading one for a future 1st and drafting a player at 16 that has "fallen").
    There will be multiple guys sitting there at 10 that OKC and NYK know have no chance of getting to 16 or 19. Guys like Giddey or Sengun. Maybe Knicks want another Kentucky guy - he aint falling to 19.

    Was there a guy at 4 that was THAT much better than who would be there at 8 in 2019? No, but Atlanta was willing to give up 8, 17, three high 2nds and take on a bad deal to jump up because they wanted THEIR guy. You are hoping for the same thing here

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    Didn't Mitchell measure smaller than expected yesterday? That and his age may contribute to a fall on draft night. Would be exciting if we were able to trade down from 10 to 16 and 18 with OKC and someone like Mitchell or Kispert fall to 16. We could have the best of both worlds - draft one of them and trade the other pick for a future 1st.
    He was shorter than expected without his shoes on...

    So we should only take him if he can guarantee that he will play the majority of his games with shoes on...

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