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Thread: Truncated Offseason Thread

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by JJackisangry View Post
    I?d be perfectly content with a Jrue swap for a pick in that 5-8 area. I would not be happy if we swapped firsts and traded Jrue to move up. Thankfully it seems there are plenty of suitors so I don?t see us getting screwed.
    So theoretically you'd be perfectly happy with Jrue for, say, #8 and nothing else?
    Cade Cunningham/Usman Garuba/Scottie Barnes/Moses Moody/Brandon Boston Jr endorser.

    Eye test people: analytics people watch more basketball than you do.

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    So theoretically you'd be perfectly happy with Jrue for, say, #8 and nothing else?
    It depends on who is available at 8 and the pieces involved. My point is I?d be pissed if we bent over and swapped picks. Thankfully that doesn?t seem likely and we may get an overhaul

  3. #28
    I would do Jrue for Haliburton or Patrick Williams and nothing else. Because nothing else means you can go in FA with 25 mil in cap room. And that doesnt just mean free agents. It means taking on salary for picks or making uneven trades, along with targeting free agents.

    If Griff makes a trade like that, you would know he already has other deals wrapped up with that space. Of course I would want more, but if they get the guy in this draft they want and have money to do other things in an offseason where very few teams have cap room, I would take that over a lot of the other deals I have heard proposed
    @mcnamara247

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by JJackisangry View Post
    It depends on who is available at 8 and the pieces involved. My point is I?d be pissed if we bent over and swapped picks. Thankfully that doesn?t seem likely and we may get an overhaul
    Well in that hypothetical there are no other pieces. Just Jrue for 8, straight up, nothing else. Assume the other team had the space to just absorb him without sending anything else back.

    I ask because you said ''I'd be perfectly content for a Jrue swap for a pick in that 5-8 area'', so I was wondering you meant literally just a straight swap, or if you meant with other stuff too.

  5. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Well in that hypothetical there are no other pieces. Just Jrue for 8, straight up, nothing else. Assume the other team had the space to just absorb him without sending anything else back.

    I ask because you said ''I'd be perfectly content for a Jrue swap for a pick in that 5-8 area'', so I was wondering you meant literally just a straight swap, or if you meant with other stuff too.
    Mac put it pretty well above. I just don?t want to lose this trade. If we acquire a pick and don?t swap picks or take in a godawful contract, we are looking pretty good. We may get an overhaul but that isn?t guaranteed considering Jrue is expiring for us. Not sure we will get much better value than this.

  6. #31




    Never change, Magic

  7. #32
    My concern with that is how much value a ton of cap space has to us. MM points out that it wouldn't have to be used to sign FAs (which is good, because since when has New Orleans been a hot FA destination?) and instead could be used to absorb imbalanced trades, but for what? For me, that value of that would depend on what those other trades would be, so it's impossible for me to say whether it's something I'd be in favour of, or against, without more information.

    I am sceptical of it, though. Trading your single best marketed asset for one pick in a bad draft and nothing else is a risky gambit.

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post




    Never change, Magic
    I love Magic on Twitter. He's the absolute worst in a great way.

    ''I just watched a fantastic game of basketball! They tried hard to put the ball in the net and eventually one team did so more successfully than the other! X player finished with a team high 28 points, which helped his team a lot!''

    Thanks, man.

  9. #34
    Second reply was "hard hitting analysis as always magic"

    /ded

  10. #35
    Griff would have verbals with other guys/teams. He isnt just negotiating the Jrue trade and then moving on from there. He has contingencies and next steps no matter what Jrue trade he selects.

    So, if he selects the one that is just the pick and he gets cap room, he will already know how he is spending it and whatever that is -- he likes it better than the 2nd and 3rd guys he gets in the trade he doesnt make.

    To me, its not about the quantity of things we end up with in this trade. You need to walk out with ONE guy that you really, really believe in as a core piece. You try for Herro. You try for Mikal Bridges. But if neither of them are available, you go for the guy you believe has the best chance in this draft to be the Herro or the Bridges of this draft. A future core piece that you get in your developmental program from day 1.

  11. #36
    Well yes, but as I said, before any of us could actually judge what we think of that move, we would have to see what that is. It's fine to say ''if Griff does X, it's because he knows his next step'', but unless you have blind faith in Griff to never make a mistake, you should know that before you can say whether that's a good thing or not it's important to know what that next step is.

    I would be withholding my opinion until such a time as I knew what actually played out, not just assuming it must be good.

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    My concern with that is how much value a ton of cap space has to us. MM points out that it wouldn't have to be used to sign FAs (which is good, because since when has New Orleans been a hot FA destination?) and instead could be used to absorb imbalanced trades, but for what? For me, that value of that would depend on what those other trades would be, so it's impossible for me to say whether it's something I'd be in favour of, or against, without more information.

    I am sceptical of it, though. Trading your single best marketed asset for one pick in a bad draft and nothing else is a risky gambit.
    I get what you mean, but we are on a race against time with Jrue expiring (and I don?t think the buzz will be as high as it is right now). We can only get as much as is offered. And I?m sure Griff and co are aware of the possibility of him getting injured and any deals therefore flushed down the toilet. That is my thinking behind it anyways. I?m not sure we will have a better opportunity to move him

  13. #38
    Why cant we just wait until the whole offseason plays out before we have to judge the first domino?

    The offseason is a whole. Each move impacts the next. The trade with the Hawks during draft day last year was not just the trade in a vacuum....it also gave the team cap space it would use to get JJ.

    The need to have a take instantly, to judge everything instantly is just foreign to me. Must be a generational thing. I would rather judge the offseason as a whole and we wont have that long to wait, seeing as how training camp will be less than 2 weeks after the draft

  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    Why cant we just wait until the whole offseason plays out before we have to judge the first domino?

    The offseason is a whole. Each move impacts the next. The trade with the Hawks during draft day last year was not just the trade in a vacuum....it also gave the team cap space it would use to get JJ.

    The need to have a take instantly, to judge everything instantly is just foreign to me. Must be a generational thing. I would rather judge the offseason as a whole and we wont have that long to wait, seeing as how training camp will be less than 2 weeks after the draft

    I literally said that I would have to withhold judgement until such time as I had seen what had actually played out, rather than judging it in advance. That is pretty much exactly what you're saying here. Not sure what the conflict is.

  15. #40



  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I literally said that I would have to withhold judgement until such time as I had seen what had actually played out, rather than judging it in advance. That is pretty much exactly what you're saying here. Not sure what the conflict is.
    There is no conflict. You dont have to take everything so personally. You always assume I am attacking you. I was basically saying -- Yeah (agreeing with you) and then pontificating on why others feel the need to judge everything instantly.

    Dont always assume I am battling you. If I disagree with something you say, it will be clear and I will lay out what I dont agree with regarding you personally

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    There is no conflict. You dont have to take everything so personally. You always assume I am attacking you. I was basically saying -- Yeah (agreeing with you) and then pontificating on why others feel the need to judge everything instantly.

    Dont always assume I am battling you. If I disagree with something you say, it will be clear and I will lay out what I dont agree with regarding you personally
    It comes off as combative when you follow up what someone says with a sort of agreement but surround it with the whole ''oh, I don't know if it's just this generation, but this whole need to have a take is just foreign to me, why do we have to judge the first domino, etc etc'' kind of approach. The combination of the two without clear delineation makes it seem very much like you're being fairly judgmental.

  18. #43
    I am very judgmental of the younger generation. I have no idea what age you are. Again, if I was targeting you, I would say YOU need to have patience and wait. I did not say that.

    I interacted with thousands of fans for nearly a decade and they got more and more impatient every year and I genuinely dont understand it.

    As for you and I -- you get far more defensive when I type than anyone else on the board. Its like you are anticipating a combative statement. Happened the other day too. You read my words, assuming the worst. Assume the best, or at least not the worst, next time. I have no desire to combat anyone. If I disagree, I will be direct and say why.

  19. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I am very judgmental of the younger generation. I have no idea what age you are. Again, if I was targeting you, I would say YOU need to have patience and wait. I did not say that.

    I interacted with thousands of fans for nearly a decade and they got more and more impatient every year and I genuinely dont understand it.

    As for you and I -- you get far more defensive when I type than anyone else on the board. Its like you are anticipating a combative statement. Happened the other day too. You read my words, assuming the worst. Assume the best, or at least not the worst, next time. I have no desire to combat anyone. If I disagree, I will be direct and say why.
    I feel like we're just fairly incompatible personalities, at least in terms of what comes out on this board. Happens sometimes.

    In any case, my bad for taking it personally. I'm glad we agree on this much: whatever happens, we should try to reserve judgement until the off-season is over and we can examine the totality of the choices made overall rather than looking at a single piece out of context.

  20. #45
    Correct. Draft day will come and moves will be made but even on that night we wont know what kind of contract we will sign our 2nd round picks to. Some will slot our rookies into the rotation, unaware of what FA's we will add or other trades we could make. I would say we will know by Thanksgiving what the roster will likely look like, minus a minimum guy or two. And at that point, we can evaluate both the expectations for this season and the long term pathway

  21. #46
    I'd rather use the 2nd round picks on nothing but draft and stash players

  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by rebelman View Post
    I'd rather use the 2nd round picks on nothing but draft and stash players
    You dont have to do that any more. You can draft them and sign them to a 2-way deal for this year. And with the rules this year, you can keep them with you for almost all of the season.

    So, you can take a guy and have him in house for most of the year, as opposed to half way around the world where your staff cant work with him. I would much, much rather go that route.

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by rebelman View Post
    I'd rather use the 2nd round picks on nothing but draft and stash players
    I'd rather package all my two this year for the opportunity to get a first (doesn't matter where) next year. though I did see a draft where we would get Nico Mannion at 42. That would be tremendous value IMO. I doubt he'll ever be a starter, but a back up point guard with his passing instincts would be a big plus.

    The Mock Draft I saw had

    13: Kira Lewis
    39: Vernon Carey
    42: Nico Mannion
    60: Lamar Stevens
    Last edited by As I See It; 11-15-2020 at 10:02 PM.
    Say Cannon Hinnant's Name.

  24. #49
    I don't know.

    I'm not excited about the Jrue stuff. We currently have the right amount of youth on this team. We could skip this draft and have no rookies and still be at the right amount of youth. There's also not much in this draft I feel significantly upgrades the team....not enough to lose Jrue. To top that off, we're sitting on top of an insane amount of picks. We could trade 2/3's of our draft picks in the next decade and still field enough youth for that time period. So I don't like the idea of trading Jrue for more assets. It feels like trading your only orange juice for two gallons of milk when you've already got 5 gallons of milk in the fridge. And I know people will say that we're stockpiling milk for a play at trading for apple juice or something....but still. There's only so much milk you can use before it expires. We won't be offered any players near the caliber of Jrue. The only way I trade him is if he is letting me know he wants out. And maybe that's happening. I dunno.

    I'd be holding on to Jrue and waiting to cash in my assets on another Jrue level or higher player to make waves sooner as opposed to later.
    PSA: Not a single elite poster or pels "insider" predicted the Cousins trade, Jrue to the Bucks, or the Adams trade. They didn't know about the Adams extension before Woj and Shams reported it and no one connected us to Kira Lewis in the draft.

    Because there ARE no elite posters/insiders. We're all equals in Pels Fandom.

    "There is only so much film an amateur can watch before they begin to think they know more than they do."

    - Abraham Lincoln

  25. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by msusousaphone View Post
    I don't know.

    I'm not excited about the Jrue stuff. We currently have the right amount of youth on this team. We could skip this draft and have no rookies and still be at the right amount of youth. There's also not much in this draft I feel significantly upgrades the team....not enough to lose Jrue. To top that off, we're sitting on top of an insane amount of picks. We could trade 2/3's of our draft picks in the next decade and still field enough youth for that time period. So I don't like the idea of trading Jrue for more assets. It feels like trading your only orange juice for two gallons of milk when you've already got 5 gallons of milk in the fridge. And I know people will say that we're stockpiling milk for a play at trading for apple juice or something....but still. There's only so much milk you can use before it expires. We won't be offered any players near the caliber of Jrue. The only way I trade him is if he is letting me know he wants out. And maybe that's happening. I dunno.

    I'd be holding on to Jrue and waiting to cash in my assets on another Jrue level or higher player to make waves sooner as opposed to later.
    If it makes you feel any better about trading Jrue, just go watch many games where he makes boneheaded turnovers or bad shots in clutch situations and his great defense equals a net negative.


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