It depends where and how it’s available. This was only streamedd because our fans whinged until they caved (good job fans). The stream was pretty bad.Originally Posted by Nichols
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It depends where and how it’s available. This was only streamedd because our fans whinged until they caved (good job fans). The stream was pretty bad.
Probably, but this is the first time in literally years that I haven't been able to find a good, reliable, HD way to watch a Pels game. For the last two seasons, I've used league pass and this is the first time I've ever been unable to watch a game on LP.
Basketball.
Man that sucks.. Yea it was bad, all those ridiculous spurs replays right in the middle of the Pel's offensive possession.
http://bleacherreport.com/post/new-o...e-f50db175e5eb
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Zion's Per 36s (he hasn't played 36 mins yet because why would he)
— TS% Eliot (@Cosmis) October 13, 2019
30.7 points
8.9 rebounds
2.9 assists
1.9 steals
.719/.687/.200 from the field.
Actually a .737 TS% I miscounted his FTA in one game.
Key to this is remembering that TS% average is something like 56% coming into the 2019-20 season.
93 points on 49 shots is 1.89 points per shot. Which is staggeringly efficient.
To be averaging basically 23ppg on 17% +rTS% is bonkers for anyone, let alone a rookie. Yes, it's pre-season, but it's not like everyone does this in preseason either, and we've played teams that will probably end up with top 10 defenses in Utah and San Antonio.
Averaging 31/9/3 on 74% TS is just beyond incredible.
Last edited by Pelicanidae; 10-13-2019 at 06:37 PM.
Just for comparison (and yes, doing it for a full season is way more impressive than just 4 games in pre-season, this is for comparison only, not saying Zion's been as impressive).
Last season:
Luka Doncic: 23.7 pts per 36, 54.5% TS
Trae Young: 22.3 pts per 36 on 53.9% TS
Steph Curry: 29.1 pts per 36 on 64.1% TS
Lebron James: 28.0 pts per 36 on 58.8% TS
Giannis: 30.4 pts per 36 on 64.4% TS
James Harden: 35.4 pts per 36 on 61.6% TS
If you look at those numbers and then you look at 30.7 pts per 36 on 73% TS, that's ridiculous. Zion's scoring rate right now is through the roof.
"Its just highschool, wait til he get to college"
"Its just college, wait til he get to the NBA"
"Its just the Preseason, wait til the regular season"
"Its just the regular season, wait til the playoffs"
'Its just round 1, pressure not all that high"
"Its just his first championship, other teams had injuries"
"Its only his 4th championship, Jordan had 6"
"Its only his 8th championship, Russell had 11"
How far will the Zion detractors go? Stay tuned...
I know you're only joking, but with the incredible achievements of past players, what would somebody need to do in their career to be the new, undisputed GOAT? Not Zion specifically, but just anyone, what would they need to do to be clearly the greatest ever?
Would have to be something like this:
7 Championships (MJ and Kareem both had 6)
7x Finals MVP (MJ had 6)
6x MVP (Kareem had 6, MJ had 5, Lebron has 4)
2x DPOY (MJ had one!)
15x All-NBA (Lebron is 15x MJ is 11x, Kareem was 15x)
15x All-Star (MJ was 14x, Lebron is 15x)
10x All-Defense (MJ had 10x all defense)
30k career points (Lebron, Kareem, and MJ all have at least 30k)
280 career Win Shares (Kareem has a career 270 win shares))
180 career VORP (Lebron has a career 130 VORP at this point)
Career 30+ PER (MJ and Lebron both have career PERs of 27 point something)
And that's just such an insane list. You'd also have to fare well in other advanced stats, like having a 5 year sustained peak on a better level than MJ from 87 to 92, or Lebron from 08-13
The requirements are so unrealistic for anyone to ever be the new, undisputed GOAT
Last edited by Pelicanidae; 10-13-2019 at 10:14 PM.
I don’t have anything to add I just wanted to give this post credit. 3 headed monster, any one of the 3 capable of 40 a night for sure.
Yes. That looks like what the criteria will be.
Crazy part is Zion has the potential to achieve it. Griffin has done an outstanding job this summer. I dont think a player of Zions magnitude has come into a better situation in the NBA. Except Duncan but Robinson was much older. Zion has a young nucleus to grow with. If NAW, Ball and Hayes all reach their potential this team will be a juggernaut for the next 15 years. Not only are they immensely talented but they have amazing chemistry off the court as well. Zion and Hayes on the break will be the scariest sight in sports in 3-4 years.
We have young defensive role players in Frank, Hart and Kenrich. Imo a superstar Vet in Jrue. Very good role player vets in JJ, Favors, Meli and Moore. A young talent in Ingram. We have Didi coming over next year. We have all of our future picks and the Lakers picks. We have cap flexibility. With a coach who style fits like a glove. This team is just built for success.
As far as individually, when Zion develops a jumper, game over. We're talking about a 285lb, insanely athletic James Harden/Shaq hybrid. There will be no stopping him. He has the tools to be great defensively as well, which we know he will work hard at it. Zion is just an alpha male with a killer mentality. Still cant believe he's a Pelican and in a situation that he can be one for his entire career.
I don't disagree, I've said before on this site that if Zion reaches his absolute ceiling (which is hard, very few players ever max out their potential) he's got that top 5 of all time potential in him. I'm certainly not going to back down on that now, and I agree that he's in a very good long term situation with regards to young talent, a coach who has his style of play in mind, tons of picks and draft capital, etc etc, so that's all very true.
But I'm not even thinking that way with Zion yet. I don't wanna put too many expectations on him, because he could be an incredible player, the best player in the league, win championships, and MVPs, and still never make that upper GOAT tier. That's fine with me, and I'll be more than happy with him even if he never reaches that standard. I'm keeping my expectations low for now: all I ask for in year 1 is for him to show progress, positive impact stats, and win that ROTY.
Anything else comes after
If those stats are even close in an 82 game season we are seeing something that no one has ever seen in the NBA.Ever.Zion is possibly the most efficient player in NBA history.This is one reason why I don't care if he ever shoots a 3 pointer.He's not just catching lobs for dunks like the all time fg% leader Deandre Jordan He's going to the rim off the dribble and no one so far has an answer on how to stop it.His ability to finish at the rim even with contact consistently even with two defenders is unreal.I've never seen anything like him.
The only player I can think of who spent a full season averaging that kind of efficiency without it being all dunks is probably Wilt Chamberlain.
In Wilt's final season, he shot 72.7% from the floor. Obviously I haven't watched all of those games (I don't think it's even possible to find them all) but knowing Wilt, it probably involved hook shots, push shots, and layups. So that's the closest thing I can think of.
Obviously we have to see if it stands up to a full season first, and it's totally normal for arookie to have some rough spots so if Zion isn't historically efficient this year, that's no big issue. But I do agree, he has the potential to be stunningly efficient. His touch around the basket is just all-time great, even as a rookie.
Here's the update on advanced stats that I do after every game, once the numbers become publicly available. 4 games down, here's where we're at. Favors not counted due to injury issues limiting his play, Hayes and Okafor not counted due to far too few minutes, same with Redick. (Redick and Okafor have also both missed a game)
Lonzo: 9.5 points, 4.5 rebounds, 6 assists, 1.5 steals. 48.9% TS, +1.3 Net Rating, 17.53 PER. 20.6% usage,
Jrue: 15.7 points, 2.3 rebounds, 3.7 assists, 2 steals. 72% TS, +24.3 Net Rating, 31.42 PER, 25.2 usage (only 20 minutes a game)
Ingram: 14 points, 4 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal. 56.1% TS, -4.8 Net Rating, 18.04 PER, 27.5% usage
Zion: 23.3 points, 6.5 rebounds, 2.3 assists, 1.5 steals. 73.7% TS, +28.2 Net Rating, 34.19 PER. Only at 25.8% Usage.
NAW: 15 points, 2.8 rebounds, 4.8 assists, 1 steal. 59% TS, +13.2 Net Rating, 30.11 PER, 30.3% usage (18 minutes per game only)
Frank: 11.8 points, 1.5 rebounds, 1.5 assists, 0.5 steals. 65.6% TS, +8.5 Net Rating, 20.7 PER, 21.2% usage
Kenrich: 4.3 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.3 assists, 1 steal. 77.3% TS, +29.6 Net Rating, 11.88 PER, 6.6% usage
Melli: 8.8 points, 6 rebounds, 1.8 assists, 1 steal. 53.4% TS, -5.5 Net Rating, 17.41 PER, 23.6% usage
I know it’s not the end all be all, but if either Zo or Ingram can hang around the 18–22 PER mark for the entire season, I will be ecstatic.
NAW is looking like an absolute steal from the draft. Where would he rank amongst current rookies atm? top 10, top 5? touch wood this is looking like a franchise altering draft.
I haven't watched every single rookie personally, so I can't say from experience, but from what I've heard from people who have specifically been watching all the rookies in preseason, NAW looks like probably the third or fourth best guy so far. Zion's in a class of his own, and then it's NAW, Brandon Clarke, Jordan Poole, Coby White, names of that sort.
I haven't watched much Poole, to be honest, so I can't make statements on that, but I have watched Clarke play a bit, and I've seen two of White's games, and I'd put NAW as confidently above White, but perhaps a touch behind Clarke, so that would be third or fourth depending on how Poole actually is.
Still, very impressive from the 17th pick. He's making an all-rookie team, if given minutes, no doubt about that.
very exciting. So you in Aus? im in melbourne myself. mornington peninsula. I was originally a hornets fan since early 90s. What brought you to be a pelicans fan? you certainly know your bball!
England myself, just mostly nocturnal due to life demands haha. I started watching basketball in 2012 (I'm 22, for reference) when the Olympics came to London. That was my first exposure to the sport, and it just so happened to be the year that Anthony Davis came to the Pelicans. Since he was playing on that Olympic team, I basically just said ''hey, this is his first year, this is my first year watching basketball, wherever he ends up, that's my team''. Kind of silly in retrospect, I guess, but he ended up on the Pels (though we now know how that all ended) and I've been a fan since.
When I was at university I had a lot of spare time because I didn't really care about my grades in first year, so I watched a ton of old games from the 80s, 90s, mid 2000s, with all the big names: Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, Hakeem, Magic, Ewing, you know, so that's where my ''historical'' appreciation of basketball came from. And I watch probably about 350 games per season (all Pels games, plus 50 games or so from another 4 or 5 teams of interest every year, plus random games of interest, like the Cavs/Warriors games in prior years), keep up with the podcasts, and read a lot of the articles from analysts like Ben Taylor, Jacob Goldstein, etc. This year was the start of me getting into college ball, since it was the first time the Pels have really had a reason to care about the draft for years, so I'll be adding some of that to my schedule this season. But yeah, that's basically been my basketball journey over the last 7 years or so.
Yo bro...
so just a casual fan then :P impressive. Being a small business owner and father of a 3 year old I dont have the time to watch as much as I'd like but will definitely watch most Pels game with league pass. I am genuinely excited to watch this team.
sup g? I bet the pelicans start to get more fans in Aus. Zion is going to be a global phenom.
Oh, I watch too much basketball, to be honest, so I don't expect anyone really to watch as much as I do. I'm lucky that my job entails long stretches of not-doing-much, which allows me to usually end up watching an entire game while at work. I genuinely wonder how those professional statisticians and analysts manage to watch as much as they do, it's bonkers.
I'm hype too. Last season, despite the exciting start, petered out pretty quickly and the last 35 games or so were just torture. Thankfully, it's over and we can get back to some actual basketball that's worth watching.
If the half-time break, all ads, all timeouts and the time it takes for guys to get to the free-throw line are all deleted, how long does a normal game take to watch? Naturally, it would take over 48 minutes, but I would guess you could see a cleaned-up game in around an hour instead of the 2 hours or so it take to have a game.
Is there a source of cleaned-up complete games to review?
Yeah and I'm ok with bandwagon fans.
I've been a fan since 1992 going back to Larry Johnson, Alonzo Mourning and Muggsy Bougues.
I think this generation of players and organisation finally has the talent and culture to win big.
Looking forward to it.
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