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Thread: 2024 Offseason Thread

  1. #351
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    They've been rumoured to want only one of the two for a while, and similarly have been associated with wanting to pare down their logjam at C. Mobley's big showing these playoffs combined with Allen's reported locker room issues (his teammates were apparently annoyed he didn't take injections to reduce his pain from injury so he could play? weird), and it may be possible that they're wanting to make a decisive action on their C for the future as well.

    Which means one of Garland/Mitchell and Mobley/Allen are on the move.

    I think most of us accept Allen is mostly likely there, so it comes down to whether you think Garland or Mitchell. I'm the reverse of you; I actually think this makes Garland more gettable, because not only is Mitchell the better player (and therefore the Cavs are more likely to go all-in on trying to retain him) but retaining him is apparently going to come at the explicit consequence of Garland asking out, according to the recent news. So if the Cavs are looking at both and they know that one is potentially extending and the other is already one foot out of the door in the event of that happening, they might just cut the middle man and move the edge-case and be done with it.

    Of course, that's one read on the situation and I'm not saying that is for sure what will happen, but it sounds a lot to me like Mitchell wants that extension and as a result, Garland is on the outs.
    I see, well I could be misreading what's happening. I also didn't know the Cavs were looking to settle on only one of the two. Either one of those guys would be great for whoever's lucky enough to acquire them.

    So maybe it's a matter of who offers the more attractive packages for either player.. Or have you heard they're most likely settling for D Mitchell?

  2. #352
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    Oh, and what's Garland's issue with Mitchell??

  3. #353
    Quote Originally Posted by Nichols View Post
    Oh, and what's Garland's issue with Mitchell??
    I'm not sure if there is a personal issue (though Mitchell seems to clash with just about everyone, from the looks of it) or if Garland just doesn't think he's getting enough opportunities as the lead guard with Mitchell there. Hard to know - I don't have any internal sources.

    Similar with the idea that the Cavs are looking to settle on one, I don't have any internal sources on that but it's just what the majority of the talk coming from reporters and stuff has implied. Maybe that's incorrect, but it's the vibe they've been putting out for probably a year or so.
    Basketball.

  4. #354
    I'm a believer in Garland.

    He had his jaw broken in December, missed over 6 weeks of the season, and when he came back he had reportedly lost upwards of 10lbs in weight and was out of it. He had a rough season from that point on, never able to get himself properly back together, but I think this season wasn't a fair representation of his play.

    If we look at the previous two seasons, he played 68 and 69 games in each year (not bad at all) and averaged 21/3/8, shooting 39.6% from 3 on 6+ a game. 87.5% from the FT line. TOV% had gone down every year of his career until this year, TS% had increased every year until this year, and his Defensive BPM had improved every year until this year.

    I'd be willing to buy that this year is the outlier. Get him fully healthy with an off-season to recover, I'd bet on him shooting 39% or better from 3 on high volume again, for the turnovers to come back down, and for his defense to be acceptable for a guy of his size.

  5. #355
    This Cavs thing seems similar to the Hawks back court issues. Starting to think Mitchell will stay and Garland will be traded

    Also the best the Cavs looked during the season was when Garland was out and Mitchell was playing PG which I'm pretty sure Mitchell and hiz camp are quietly talking about

  6. #356
    NetsDaily
    @NetsDaily
    I remain unconvinced that Donovan Mitchell is absolutely, positively leaving Cavs. Mitchell would have to give up $69.9 million and an extra year of security if he’s traded, $$269.9 million over 5 vs $200 million over 4. No one hates Cleveland that much!

    Pretty much , "I'll ask for a trade at a later date".

  7. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by Mount_Zion View Post
    NetsDaily
    @NetsDaily
    I remain unconvinced that Donovan Mitchell is absolutely, positively leaving Cavs. Mitchell would have to give up $69.9 million and an extra year of security if he’s traded, $$269.9 million over 5 vs $200 million over 4. No one hates Cleveland that much!

    Pretty much , "I'll ask for a trade at a later date".
    I'm of the firm belief that Mitchell and Mobley are staying and that Allen and Garland are on the way out.

    No clue if we'll end up with them (either, or both) but they're not staying in Cleveland. Be shocked if they were both still there next season.

  8. #358
    Yeah that's the way I'm leaning right now with those two being gone. As for Allen, I'm not convinced the Pels should go after him. Not big on his fit next to Zion and the $$$ you would have to pay him, but if you want that pairing at the 3 and 5. The 1 ,2 and 4 has to be able to shoot
    Last edited by Mount_Zion; 05-16-2024 at 11:27 AM.

  9. #359
    Quote Originally Posted by Mount_Zion View Post
    Yeah that's the way I'm leaning right now with those two being gone. As for Allen, I'm not convinced the Pels should go after him. Not big on his fit next to Zion and the $$$ you would have to pay him, but if you want that pairing at the 3 and 5. The 1 ,2 and 4 has to be able to shoot
    The fit next to Zion isn't perfect but we've seen enough now from Zion next to JV and Steven Adams to know that as long as there's shooting on the perimeter, Zion can make it work wonders. Garland, Trey, Herb, Hawkins all provide crazy shooting, Matt Ryan is still there if Willie remembers him, and we might even still have CJ for a while until a trade for him gets worked out - he might be a deadline move.

    As for price? Allen is an all-star who has finished top 12 in DPOY voting 3 times despite being only 25 years old, and is signed for an even $20m for the next few years. He'll want to be paid after that, but a $20m expiring is actually movable, so that's not a huge deal, and if it does all work out then a pay rise might be in order anyway. Obviously I wouldn't pay him $40m a year, but some bump up might be fine.

  10. #360
    Garland + Mobley/Allen...And you can have BI

  11. #361
    A base trade of BI + Larry for Garland + Allen works. The question is what extra compensation the Pels would have to offer. Personally, I'd go as high as two additional first rounders, with some protections attached, maybe getting a 2nd rounder back...

  12. #362
    Quote Originally Posted by new city champ View Post
    A base trade of BI + Larry for Garland + Allen works. The question is what extra compensation the Pels would have to offer. Personally, I'd go as high as two additional first rounders, with some protections attached, maybe getting a 2nd rounder back...
    I'd give them this year's first, plus handing over the LA swap rights and a top 5 protected FRP in like, 2026.

  13. #363
    The Pelicans are a potential team to monitor for Donovan Mitchell, per
    @ZachLowe_NBA
    (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000655930152).

    https://x.com/esidery/status/1791558...7Ctwgr%5Etweet

  14. #364
    Charter Member PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I'd give them this year's first, plus handing over the LA swap rights and a top 5 protected FRP in like, 2026.
    A bit much it seems, but I would not haggle over the extra 1st. Garland makes a bit much for his game.

  15. #365
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    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    A bit much it seems, but I would not haggle over the extra 1st. Garland makes a bit much for his game.
    I would agree, I doubt there's a consensus among execs, and talking heads that Garland is better than Ingram. You can make an argument for "fit" here, but that's about it.

    So overpaying for him while Ingram is included in the trade is a bad move. We're talking about Garland, not D. Mitchell.

  16. #366
    Who fits better with Zion?

    Garland or Mitchell if you had a choice

  17. #367
    Quote Originally Posted by WhyHornetsWhy View Post
    Who fits better with Zion?

    Garland or Mitchell if you had a choice
    Garland! Got to get him .

  18. #368
    Don't forget Garland is represented by Klutch. When they ask for a trade it's for a bigger marker and/or to join one of their other player. I would be quite surprised if Pelicans are into the list and the fact that they're already deflating his trade value by making it public tends to show they already have an agenda in mind.

  19. #369
    Evan Sidery
    @esidery

    The Pelicans are not willing to offer Brandon Ingram a max contract, per
    @cclark_13
    (https://nola.com/sports/pelicans/wil...a37aa1c31.html).

    Ingram is eligible to sign a four-year, $208 million extension.

    New Orleans is reportedly open to adding more years onto

    This is the early part of being traded, Ingram agent will find out who's willing to max his client and a trade may happen after

  20. #370
    Quote Originally Posted by Nichols View Post
    I would agree, I doubt there's a consensus among execs, and talking heads that Garland is better than Ingram. You can make an argument for "fit" here, but that's about it.

    So overpaying for him while Ingram is included in the trade is a bad move. We're talking about Garland, not D. Mitchell.
    I agree. I don?t see Garland as a better player than Ingram, just a better fit. D. Murray and T. Young from Atlanta are better players than Ingram, and I would prefer to pursue them. Give me Young/Murray + Capela/Okongwu over Garland + Allen all day. Garland is the most currently overpaid player of all the names on the list including Ingram. If Ingram was given a max deal, he would take that title.

  21. #371
    D Mitchell for BI + Dyson + 3 firsts

    KAT for CJ + 2 1sts



    ~

    Starting Line-Up:

    Mitchell
    Herb
    Trey
    Z
    KAT

    Think that could contend for a title.

    ~

    Dream over.

    But, I would love to build around Z, Herb, and Trey. All we need is a superstar PG and a 5 who can shoot 3's
    Last edited by WhyHornetsWhy; 05-19-2024 at 05:59 PM.

  22. #372
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    I've seen a few people mention KAT but I don't understand why he would be available considering how integral he has been to their success. I'd expect his team to consider him off limits.

  23. #373
    Quote Originally Posted by hornetsrebirth View Post
    I've seen a few people mention KAT but I don't understand why he would be available considering how integral he has been to their success. I'd expect his team to consider him off limits.
    Because their money is tied up and way over the luxury tax I believe.

  24. #374
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyHornetsWhy View Post
    Because their money is tied up and way over the luxury tax I believe.
    How does swapping KAT for CJ help with that?

  25. #375
    Quote Originally Posted by hornetsrebirth View Post
    How does swapping KAT for CJ help with that?
    Didn't think that far into it lol

    Then give me Naz Reid too and let Minnesota draft a 4 or 5 with one of those multiple 1st round picks we gave them
    Last edited by WhyHornetsWhy; 05-19-2024 at 06:12 PM.

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