Players get drafted all the time when they don't workout with teams. This was discussed pages backOriginally Posted by Freyfamilyreuni
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Players get drafted all the time when they don't workout with teams. This was discussed pages back
CAW CAW!!!
-Founder and valuable member of the Caw Caw Boyz-
No way in hell Ivey falls to us. Too many teams trying to trade up to get him
Latest mock draft from @DraftExpress & @espn is interesting for the Pels, suggesting that the 8th pick has created "quite a bit of chatter in NBA circles" for trade purposes & mentions the Suns & Cam Johnson.https://t.co/bNvdLBIpPw
— Mason Ginsberg (@MasonGinsberg) June 21, 2022
Now this is unexpected
I would absolutely lock myself into a core of CJ, BI, Zion, Herb, Trey, Cam
Cam will need a new contract. What are you willing to pay him? Gonna be 26 next year, good shooter, solid defender, pretty average everywhere else. Basically is now what 21 yr old Trey Murphy was at the end of the year. Nothing wrong with having two Trey Murphy's, but I dont know if it makes sense to pay him 16-20 mil over paying say Sochan or Daniels 4-7 mil over the next few years.
Last edited by MichaelMcNamara; 06-21-2022 at 08:19 AM.
@mcnamara247
I think Cam Johnson is the exact type player you’re looking for to really unlock this team’s full potential. I don’t think I’d be upset at all with 4/80 for Cam. You’d have to get off of DG and Temple, but you can roll out CJ, BI, Herb, Zion, JV with a second unit of Jose, Trey, Cam, Jax, Nance. All while staying out of the luxury tax and still having flexibility with JV and Hayes contracts to tinker if the fit isn’t perfect.
I don’t do it if Cam is looking for a starting role
Cam is 'fine,' but he'll also be more expensive soon and he gets cooked on defense for being slow-footed a lot. I don't get the appeal of trading away cheap young help for that...
Staying out of the luxury tax this year, sure. But that team would need to give new deals to Zion and Nance next year
CJ, BI, and Zion will be at 100 million by themselves. JV and Nance is another 25-30 mil. You give Cam that contract and just between those 6 guys, you are at 150 million. Luxury tax projects to be aroung 160 for 23/24.
Now, if they are willing to be a tax team, go for it. But if they make a trade like this only to let Nance walk in a year, never use the MLE, etc then you have to consider those things a part of the trade too.
Cam Johnson is a nice player.
I'd rather draft a guy at 8, roll with the guys we got, and re-evaluate what we need before the trade deadline. Our #8 pick will either be too good not to play, or will barely get any minutes. I don't see much depreciation. If we need to move the #8 guy at the deadline to get a piece that fits our core, go do it then.
We've not seen what CJ/BI/Herb/Zion/JV can do. I'd much prefer a wait and see approach to improving the team. And I'll readily admit that I love our squad and don't want any of them moved. But then again, I grew up a Bad Boys Pistons fan and was mad as heck when they traded Adrian Dantley for Mark Aguirre. And then they won back-to-back championships.
People are really quick to forget the role that Cam Johnson just played on a 64 win team
That’s not how it works though. Depreciation is real. You’re not getting Cam Johnson at the deadline for whoever you pick at 8. And Cam comes in having been a 6th man’s for Phoenix. He should know his role on this team (if he doesn’t then I’m out). Zion driving with Cam in one corner and Trey in the other, I honestly don’t know what you do
I’d also be extremely interested in acquiring a Suns future 1st
Or...... everyone will acknowledge that he is a solid player but we all know he isnt going to be a top player. You can get 5th, 6th best players in many different ways. Pels got one at pick 35 last year. Got another one by trading down 7 spots in a draft. You dont get many chances to get All Star caliber players. And even if the Pels only have a 10-20% chance of getting that at 8, its a chance.
You have to be the best out of 30. Thats a really, really hard thing to do. You dont get there by hitting singles and doubles. This team would need another home run (or at least a triple) to become a real contender. Some people are risk adverse, and thats fine. Some people go high risk, high reward, and thats fine too.
But people arent saying no to the deal because they "forget" anything
Yeah, it kinda is. An asset is an asset. This isn't buying a new Honda Accord. And you're not getting Cam Johnson for the #8 pick before the draft either.
My main point is that Cam Johnson doesn't move the needle for me. We need to see what our core truly needs. What if Herb's 3 point shooting improves? What if the lack of a true point guard ends up being a real issue and we need to target a PG? I would be patient unless we can nab an All Star. Cam Johnson had a fantastic season shooting the 3 (42% on 5.9 attempts!!!), but I'm not sold on whether he can sustain that moving forward.
https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/p...ig-enough-step
Ok I seem to be in the minority here on Cam and that’s fine. I’m interested to know what type of extension he would have to agree on in order for you to make that deal. In this article, they imply a 4/60. Again, I’d do that happily because I think he further unleashes your superstars. What do you think?
Nah. We're going to need to pay Herb soon enough. I don't think Johnson's anything special.
We need a facilitator someone who can set the halfcourt offense so we not just taking tough shots all game
So now we’re going to add another ball dominant player to CJ, BI, and Zion?
Here's the thing -- if you trade, or are willing to trade, the #8 pick for a guy, the agent now has a ton of leverage. They know you arent going to just let him walk after giving up that asset. Now, if he agrees to 4/60 as a condition of the trade, I would be interested but then as I lay out my minutes and rotation, I see that he either takes some of Murphy's minutes or he doesnt play enough minutes to have made giving up a great asset worth it. Lets play it out:
CJ - 35
BI - 35
Zion - 33
Herb - 33
JV - 29
Thats 165 out of 240 minutes just between the top 5
Now, lets say Nance and Jose win the backup big and backup guard jobs. 17 minutes a piece. That leaves you 41 minutes in the rotation. Even if you dont play anybody else and just go with a 9 man rotation (unlikely, but I am trying to be as generous as possible to the idea of adding Cam).... either you arent playing Trey enough or you arent playing Cam enough, or both.
You wouldnt give up the 8th pick for a 20 mpg player, so lets say you give him 28 off the bench. Now, you got 13 for Trey? And again, Kira isnt getting any run, or Jaxson, or Graham to try to boost any of their values/give them reps.
IMO, you cant recover the value from this trade, and if you do on the Cam end, you lose it in other places and that has to be a part of the opportunity cost
I like Cam the player. However, the contract would be the big issue. Zion's extension is going to lock us into a lot of committed contracts for a few players. We have to be smart about the non-starters. If we can get a similar player or at least close, on a rookie contract, that would be much more palatable.
I think you’re on the high end of minutes for all of those guys outside of a healthy Zion though. Regular season, I’d have:
CJ- 33
BI- 33
Zion- 31
Herb- 31
JV- 27
Outside of Herb, I think that’s around where those guys were following the CJ acquisition. That’s an addition 10 minutes for Cam and Trey
And don’t get me wrong, if Daniels or Benny are there I’m taking them. I don’t see the star potential, though, with Sochan or Dieng so that’s where I’d move for Cam. But I’d want him locked into a reasonable extension and I would need him to know his role. Obviously a ton of contingencies, but it’s the 8th pick so I need to be sure I’m getting that value
I disagree, I actually thought I was low, but fine, now you are at 51 minutes. Hayes, Kira, and Graham getting DNP's. 9 man rotation, which we know isnt happening.
We would all probably agree on the level of player Cam is. You seem to think others dont like him as much of a player as you do, I think that is incorrect. What I think you arent calculating properly is the entirity of the opportunity cost. Its not just the 8th pick, which is substantial in itself.
I think Cam Johnson and Dort are around the same level and will get paid about the same money on their next deal and I wouldnt do 8 for 12 and Dort, so I just personally wouldnt even consider 8 for Cam
He already have Cam Johnson, but his name is Trey
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