Pels Off season thread

[Pelicanidae]

Correct me if I'm wrong, I certainly don't watch or follow as close as many of you do.

We were one of if not the youngest team.

We were on the younger side but not the youngest.

Youngest teams in the NBA this year:

- OKC Thunder: 23.5 years old on average
- Minnesota Timberwolves: 23.9 yrs
- Memphis Grizzlies: 24.3 yrs
- Orlando Magic: 24.3 yrs
- Detroit Pistons: 24.4 yrs
- New Orleans Pelicans: 24.4 yrs

Something worth noting is that basically none of the very youngest teams in the league are good teams. Or even just real playoff teams.

The oldest rosters, on the other hand?

- Los Angeles Lakers: 29.1 yrs
- Los Angeles Clippers: 29.0 yrs
- Miami Heat: 28.8 yrs
- Brooklyn Nets: 28.5 yrs
- Milwaukee Bucks: 27.7 yrs
- Philadelphia 76ers and Utah Jazz tied: 27.5 yrs

Unsurprisingly, the best teams in the NBA tend to also be older and more experienced. The only one of the top top tier teams not listed here is Denver, whose average age is 26.5 and falls somewhere in the middle of the league.

[Taker597]

That's generous

It really issss

[13 - 3]

Let Zion run the show. Just like Lebron does. Let Zion form his dream team. Gayle just going have to accept she may need to spend more money.

[Sleeper]

Let Zion run the show. Just like Lebron does. Let Zion form his dream team. Gayle just going have to accept she may need to spend more money.

Luckily Gayle has accepted this and Griffin has mentioned it a couple of times. He has said she is not worried about the tax if it means a winning team.

Just hard to do that when the player pool is small and you haven?t had much time to evaluate what you already have.


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[new city champ]

I'll go 75-25 roster construction versus coaching mistakes.

Griffin clearly cross-stepped with the roster. Even he acknowledged the lack of shooting and that the line up was, in his words, "wonky." I give him points for not trying to white wash the facts. But none of the problems he identified were unknowable in advance. Indeed, the lack of shooting was widely commented on before the season even started and the wisdom of allocating $29 million to a traditional pivot with a fair amount of wear on the tread, to say nothing of the draft picks involved, was questioned as well, especially given the obvious other needs on the team. I think it's crystal clear in retrospect--and was pretty obvious even advance--that the roster the front office put together was a poor fit for the modern game. It sometimes looked like a 2004 analog NBA team trying to keep up in a digital league.

The more troubling question is what kind of vision or perception of the game allowed this to happen? A lot of comment from Griffin, Gundy & Co. early on suggested that they had an alternative vision for how to play basketball, one based on deemphasizing the 3-pointer and pace and space in favor of scoring in the lane and shooting foul shots while also denying opponents penetration and not fouling.

As we know, that didn't really work out. On offense, we got to the line, but were so poor at foul shooting that we didn't reap the benefits many nights. We were efficient on two-pointers, but opposing teams shot the lights out from deep, burying the Pels many nights in a 3-point avalanche so deep it was almost impossible to dig out. And, to add insult to injury, even when we kept it close despite these handicaps, we were woeful in late game situations, meaning that the dividend of game-toughness, experience and situational basketball IQ that we hoped to gain by paying Adams and Bledsoe $45 million never showed up, leaving with the team two very expensive and flawed veterans who comprised 40% of our starting line up and alone ate up a third of our payroll. Tough to overcome that.

Yet, I think some coaches and GMs would have looked the situation in the face and said the roster is fatally flawed, we accept that fact and we are going to move quickly to make changes. Griff and Gundy instead said they weren't going to "give" minutes to young players implying they had to earn them even when a veteran like Bledsoe clearly was not earning them. At a minimum, they could have tried replacing Bled with Josh Hart, who clearly had earned some equity with the team. But they futzed around until the injury bug hit and then it was too late. Too much status quo for too long.

I'm in the camp that doesn't want to overreact to the disappointment of this season. The Pelicans really were close in many ways and a season of maturity will help address some of the problems. But Bledsoe can't be a starter on this team and I think getting a true PG who hopefully can shoot and defend as well as take the reins of the team at crunch time is the top priority. Point Zion will be a weapon, but I still think you need a floor leader at this point who can make things run the right way. And a couple of long shooters, pretty please...

[13 - 3]

Luckily Gayle has accepted this and Griffin has mentioned it a couple of times. He has said she is not worried about the tax if it means a winning team.

Just hard to do that when the player pool is small and you haven?t had much time to evaluate what you already have.


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How many years do you need to evaluate talent? Zion needs to take over and start making the phone calls just like Lebron, KD do.

[Sleeper]

How many years do you need to evaluate talent? Zion needs to take over and start making the phone calls just like Lebron, KD do.

This year i think was sufficient. Sounds like they have a good grasp of who goes and stays.


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[13 - 3]

This year i think was sufficient. Sounds like they have a good grasp of who goes and stays.


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We said that last season.

[Stalwart385]

This year i think was sufficient. Sounds like they have a good grasp of who goes and stays.


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Yeah, I think they need to shift from developing, trading assets to acquiring value and experimenting with positions to building a team around the core. I'd like to see a big move, like replacing Bledsoe with a very good SG, but I'm not necessarily expecting it unless the right situation arises. I do expect them to identify their core and build around it at a minimum though.

I think the 1st stage of the rebuild was so-so for Griff. We did get a lot of draft assets but Bledsoe and to a smaller extent Adams are negatives to those moves. I think the Davis trade turned out pretty well though. Starting this offseason the aquiring of talent to build up will define Griff here imo.

[13 - 3]

Ouch. SVG is certainly not an evaluator of talent. As a matter of fact it was a train wreck when he was GM it sounds like

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2018/5...van-gundy-exit

[Pelicanidae]

This year i think was sufficient. Sounds like they have a good grasp of who goes and stays.


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I agree. I've said a bunch of times, as have others, that while rebuilds don't take place in five minutes and we shouldn't expect to be a finals contender next season, there does need to be a leap. We have the top-end guys on the roster needed to make this team a playoff team in Zion and Ingram. We have the assets in terms of young players, older players on good/expiring deals, and picks to make trades to improve the roster. We even have, though I think it's unlikely, S&T possibilities with guys like Lonzo. And, because of this season and getting to trial different things, we also know what we need to put around Zion as the number 1 option.

Therefore, with all those assets and all that information, this off-season, and really up until next trade deadline, needs to be a serious future-making period. Not everything needs to be set in stone, not every asset needs to be offloaded, but some clear changes need to be made, this roster needs to show some real upgrade, and we have to start winning now. Playoff team next year is a must.

[Taker597]

I agree. I've said a bunch of times, as have others, that while rebuilds don't take place in five minutes and we shouldn't expect to be a finals contender next season, there does need to be a leap. We have the top-end guys on the roster needed to make this team a playoff team in Zion and Ingram. We have the assets in terms of young players, older players on good/expiring deals, and picks to make trades to improve the roster. We even have, though I think it's unlikely, S&T possibilities with guys like Lonzo. And, because of this season and getting to trial different things, we also know what we need to put around Zion as the number 1 option.

Therefore, with all those assets and all that information, this off-season, and really up until next trade deadline, needs to be a serious future-making period. Not everything needs to be set in stone, not every asset needs to be offloaded, but some clear changes need to be made, this roster needs to show some real upgrade, and we have to start winning now. Playoff team next year is a must.

Maybe a Sign and Trade Lonzo and some 2nds to ATL for Bogdan Bogdanović

[hornetzplaya]

Maybe a Sign and Trade Lonzo and some 2nds to ATL for Bogdan Bogdanović

Meh, decent trade, However I will say, the way we kept on getting beasted by PG's and SG's day in and day out speaks volumes about our guard situation with the defensive ability. Not saying all of it was Lonzo's fault (Or bledsoe's to be fair) cause he did have some tough assignments and i don't expect him to be a defensive stopper, but we need a disruptor on the guard end. Didi showed some decent promise along with Hart & NAW. But Lonzo and Bledsoe? It was horrific to watch them get tossed around all game. (Some of it was the rotations and miscommunications.) Also i don't think Brogdon is that much better defensively. So we have some tough decisions to make this offseason. I personally think Lonzo is gone via S&T.

Also, let me add, I'm not feigning away from BI and Zion and their defensive lapses, but way more often we got blasted by PG's.

EDIT: Lonzo did get better as the season went on though to be fair to him. Late in the season. but if he wants 18M or more, we have to ship him elsewhere or let him walk.

[Taker597]

Meh, decent trade,

Ehhhh... That's really the best you'll get to be honest. A really solid bench player is more than a good deal for a S&T Lonzo.

Unless you want to package FFP with Lonzo to get a star guard.

[hornetzplaya]

Ehhhh... That's really the best you'll get to be honest. A really solid bench player is more than a good deal for a S&T Lonzo.

Unless you want to package FFP with Lonzo to get a star guard.

Facts. Ill rather keep the Draft pick. It's much better than the Cam Reddish Trade..... that one hurt my feelings.

[13 - 3]

SVG such a good coach that nobody wanted him but us.

[Eman5805]

SVG such a good coach that nobody wanted him but us.

By that logic any coach we hire is a bad coach. And the best coach for us one we would never get.

[13 - 3]

By that logic any coach we hire is a bad coach. And the best coach for us one we would never get.

Yep. You would think people would want to coach Zion right?

[13 - 3]

Oh wait my bad

POINT ZION

Griffin praised Van Gundy’s vision for “point-Zion,” an offensive scheme used increasingly throughout the season in which Williamson served as the primary ball-handler.

Griffin recalled that when interviewing nine coaching candidates last year, “Stan was the only one who saw point-Zion in Zion.”

https://apnews.com/article/new-orlea...2d853280ae2537

Too bad Zion does not see it that way

[As I See It]

The club should ditch "Point Zion" with all due haste. Williamson is a finisher of epic proportion; he is not an orchestrator. It's like asking a podiatrist to perform brain surgery on the fly; it just makes no sense. The podiatrist might have the medical knowledge to be competent at some point, but lacks both the know-how and experience right now.

Further, we hear SVG talk about how JAXSON needs to work on the basics and not worry about knocking down the three at this point. But with Zion, we are going to force feed "Point Zion" upon him when there is a litany of basics he should be working on first? Again, it's a 'head-scratcher'.

[HoustonPelicans]

The club should ditch "Point Zion" with all due haste. Williamson is a finisher of epic proportion; he is not an orchestrator. It's like asking a podiatrist to perform brain surgery on the fly; it just makes no sense. The podiatrist might have the medical knowledge to be competent at some point, but lacks both the know-how and experience right now.

Further, we hear SVG talk about how JAXSON needs to work on the basics and not worry about knocking down the three at this point. But with Zion, we are going to force feed "Point Zion" upon him when there is a litany of basics he should be working on first? Again, it's a 'head-scratcher'.

Exactly Point Zion is so gimmicky. Jordan and Kobe could run point, but Phil was smart enough to recognize that they were buckets so he kept them in that role. They still got 4-6 apg being allowed to do what they do best.

[Taker597]

The club should ditch "Point Zion" with all due haste. Williamson is a finisher of epic proportion; he is not an orchestrator. It's like asking a podiatrist to perform brain surgery on the fly; it just makes no sense. The podiatrist might have the medical knowledge to be competent at some point, but lacks both the know-how and experience right now.

Further, we hear SVG talk about how JAXSON needs to work on the basics and not worry about knocking down the three at this point. But with Zion, we are going to force feed "Point Zion" upon him when there is a litany of basics he should be working on first? Again, it's a 'head-scratcher'.

You use Point Zion in the same way as you use Point LeBron as a game finisher and that's it.

[Pelicanidae]

You use Point Zion in the same way as you use Point LeBron as a game finisher and that's it.

Lebron runs the point like 80% of the time he's on the floor. Bad comparison imo

[luckyman]

Lebron runs the point like 80% of the time he's on the floor. Bad comparison imo

I've learned there are just too many fires on this site to constantly try putting out.

[Taker597]

Lebron runs the point like 80% of the time he's on the floor. Bad comparison imo

In 2005-2016? I remember he didn't become Point dominant till he came to LA where he doesn't have a real point.