May 9th - New Orleans Pelicans @ Charlotte Hornets - 30-37

[As I See It]

If Monty or Alvin were our coach I would say we win all games. I lost count how many games Stan blew when we had double digit leads. We would probably be a#4 seed if he was not our coach.

You got that right.

GREAT POST!!!

Like you, I remember all those ill-advised shots SVG took early in the shot clock and late in games when we up double digits. We can only imagine how different things would be if it were the players in the game during crunch time and not SVG, huh?

Remember that Knick Game? There was SVG coming off his man at the three point line to cover Derrick Rose driving to the basket in the waning seconds of the game when we were up by three, only to have a soft pass gently tossed out to Reggie Bullock for an easy three to tie it up. Gee I wish Lonzo or Bled were in that game at the end of regulation; the outcome would have been different. They would have certainly carried out any bench coaching our 'moron' coach would have offered, huh?

And how can we forget the Denver game? Lawd!!! Who would have thought we would see SVG come running off the bench to 'foul' Zion as he was going to the goal to tie the game at the buzzer? The refs were completely justified not calling that foul that SVG committed against Zion.

Yeah, man...we easily would be a Top Four seed in the West with anybody coaching the team not named SVG.

[Pelifan]

Cant be hoping for a lotto luck bail out at this point. Pels got Zion. We had our luck. Another top pick would be nice obviously, but at some point the pels have to start being a well run franchise who make consistently good FO decisions and play good basketball.

It's a marathon not a sprint.

[Pelicanidae]

Cant be hoping for a lotto luck bail out at this point. Pels got Zion. We had our luck. Another top pick would be nice obviously, but at some point the pels have to start being a well run franchise who make consistently good FO decisions and play good basketball.

It's a marathon not a sprint.

That point generally not being less than 2 years into the rebuild. As you say, it's a marathon, not a sprint: Sixers got 3 top picks in their rebuild, and we've got to move into overdrive and ignore the lottery because we got one? Lakers had 3 consecutive top 3 picks during their dead years. Bulls have been in the lottery for a decade. We're allowed to want a solid pick

[DaFranchise80]

That point generally not being less than 2 years into the rebuild. As you say, it's a marathon, not a sprint: Sixers got 3 top picks in their rebuild, and we've got to move into overdrive and ignore the lottery because we got one? Lakers had 3 consecutive top 3 picks during their dead years. Bulls have been in the lottery for a decade. We're allowed to want a solid pick

I feel you brother. This is why I’m hoping for the best despite the things that are out of our control.

[Pelicanidae]

I feel you brother. This is why I’m hoping for the best despite the things that are out of our control.

Precisely. It's not like I'm saying we need to accept being bottom dwellers for 5+ seasons before we should expect any results here, I'm just saying that give it this offseason. I think with Zion where he is, with Ingram where he is, with Jax and NAW showing the signs, if we have one more good draft and then a solid offseason with regards to free agents and/or trading, we can be set for the future. We should be a playoff team next year: not a 'play in' team, not 9th or 10th seed, but 8th seed or better. We have the pieces in terms of players and assets to make that happen, I think.

And even that is only the third year after trading AD, really! A full re-build, set for the future, in 3 seasons is quick in the NBA. It's not a record quickness, but it's faster than the Sixers rebuild, faster than the Lakers rebuild, faster than whatever this Detroit rebuild is, faster than this OKC rebuild is likely to be, faster than the Bulls rebuild, and so on and so on. We're in a fine position.

Now, will Griff screw it? Maybe! But be patient. Draft is king right now.

[luckyman]

One thing a franchise like this can't do is toss away the ability to acquire cheap young talent in a good draft. If its a bad draft yes sure.

They should keep their 1st round pick this year and maybe deal the rest. Or trade down and get even more picks to trade. But they should walk away from this draft with a serious future prospect.

Next year with two 1sts might be a good time to start swinging bigger deals for tradeable talent.

[Silverfoxx]

One thing a franchise like this can't do is toss away the ability to acquire cheap young talent in a good draft. If its a bad draft yes sure.

They should keep their 1st round pick this year. Next year with two 1sts might be a good time to start swinging deals for tradeable talent.

Are you aware of our off season situation? You have to factor in the timeline we are on. This draft class is really good, but due to Zion situation we cannot sit around and wait for a rookie to develop this season because next season is literally playoffs or likely loose Zion.

[luckyman]

Are you aware of our off season situation? You have to factor in the timeline we are on. This draft class is really good, but due to Zion situation we cannot sit around and wait for a rookie to develop this season because this season is literally playoffs or likely loose Zion.

Lol. Explain this "lose Zion" timeline to me. He an unrestricted free agent in a couple years or something?

[MichaelMcNamara]

We put the extension in front of Zion next summer. You think he signs it if they have missed the playoffs the first 3 years? And what do you think the buzz becomes if he is offered a max rookie extension and doesnt sign it? Its not make or break but you dont want to put the biggest possible contract in front of your cornerstone and have him say no.

[Pelicanidae]

Are you aware of our off season situation? You have to factor in the timeline we are on. This draft class is really good, but due to Zion situation we cannot sit around and wait for a rookie to develop this season because next season is literally playoffs or likely loose Zion.

I don't think this is necessarily the case.

The solution is, of course, to draft someone with upside but who will be likely ready to contribute on some level immediately. If you draft Moody, for example, you're not doing so on the hope that he will be able to play in 3 years, you're doing so in the believe that, like many other recent draftees (Vassell comes to mind) he is able to perform real NBA rotation minutes immediately but will also have room to develop. Don't pick someone who is 23 already and is basically done, but don't draft a super raw, Precious Achiuwa style project.

Just draft someone who is good and has room to get better.

[MichaelMcNamara]

Being in the rotation and impacting winning is not the same thing. The number of rookies who play minutes is long. The number of rookies who impact winning every year is miniscule. Griff wants to/needs to win next year
Hoping you find the rare rookie who helps you do that is not a plan if winning is your objective. Not saying it SHOULD be, but if it is, you trade that pick for an established player 10 out of 10 times

[luckyman]

Im not going to waste time pointing out all the invalid reasons Zion would ******** and moan about not making the playoffs in year 3 of an obvious rebuild (basically year 2.5 for him), to turn down a max extension.

But I will say, given those facts, it would be basically unprecedented for him to turn down a rookie max extension. That would reflect more poorly on him than this franchise. This is not a Porzingis/Knicks situation. This is not a Harden/OKC situation. Even if he turns it down, the leverage still resides with the franchise this early in his career. The NBA made it that way.

Please stop with the nonsense.

[MichaelMcNamara]

Its not just not making the playoffs. The relationships are also not great behind the scenes. Notice I didnt say bad.... but they arent great with Zion, FO, and his family. There was virtually no communication last offseason between the team and Zion despite their best efforts to reach him and he basically did his own thing training and rehab wise. His step dad is not a fan of Griff and things just simply arent good, like say they are with Ja and Memphis. Even if they miss the playoffs again this year and next, he is signing that extension minute 1.

Combine this all with the fact that Zion will have a huge QO and will get whatever marketing money he wants wherever he goes, and I would say it is as close to a perfect storm as you could get to cause a guy not to sign the extension, especially if the team isnt winning. I'd still put it at 80% he signs it as of today, but I'd put it at 100% Luka does, 100% Ja does, 100% Trae does, etc.

But if a fan doesnt want to be objective and wants to see only the reasons for something and not the reasons the non ideal thing could happen.....well, that wouldnt be the first time a fan did that.

[Taker597]

That point generally not being less than 2 years into the rebuild. As you say, it's a marathon, not a sprint: Sixers got 3 top picks in their rebuild, and we've got to move into overdrive and ignore the lottery because we got one? Lakers had 3 consecutive top 3 picks during their dead years. Bulls have been in the lottery for a decade. We're allowed to want a solid pick

It's like damn... Do they not see the talent gap between us and a Nets, Suns, and etc. A lot of lottory players. We can't just imagine being a contender. Lol

[Pelifan]

That point generally not being less than 2 years into the rebuild. As you say, it's a marathon, not a sprint: Sixers got 3 top picks in their rebuild, and we've got to move into overdrive and ignore the lottery because we got one? Lakers had 3 consecutive top 3 picks during their dead years. Bulls have been in the lottery for a decade. We're allowed to want a solid pick

Not saying Im not pulling for losses too, but to act like the sky is falling because we might end up with pick 11 instead of pick 9 so we have a 10% lower chance at a top pick is a little much.

There are so many variables to consider. It's entirely possible in the 2 universes where the pelicans get extremely lucky and end up at 4 vs ending up at 11, the latter gives the pelicans a better player.

And in the most likely scenario where they stay put they likely end up with teh same player at 9 as they do at 11 given how little consensus there is outside of the top 4 or so.

[MichaelMcNamara]

All the little losses add up. Its the same argument with all of them that its not the end of the world and people are overreacting. Nobody said the sky was falling juat.like nobody said it was falling after the Adams trade and extension. Or not getting the Minny 2nd rounder for JJ and settling for the Dallas one instead. None of these things are the end of the world but in a league where only one of 30 wins and where you have a smaller margin of error than big markets, every little thing adds up

[Pelifan]

All the little losses add up. Its the same argument with all of them that its not the end of the world and people are overreacting. Nobody said the sky was falling juat.like nobody said it was falling after the Adams trade and extension. Or not getting the Minny 2nd rounder for JJ and settling for the Dallas one instead. None of these things are the end of the world but in a league where only one of 30 wins and where you have a smaller margin of error than big markets, every little thing adds up

But that's my point, the decisions made by FO add up much more than lotto luck (outside of getting Cade) ever could. There's plenty of perennial losers out there who constantly have high picks but go nowhere because their franchises are run terribly. Then other franchises who have built perennial contenders at the end of the lottery.

Rooting for losses is fine. Better statistical odds at ending up with a good player is great. But at the end of the day FO decisions and random luck is going to be what makes or breaks the Zion era.

[13 - 3]

Its not just not making the playoffs. The relationships are also not great behind the scenes. Notice I didnt say bad.... but they arent great with Zion, FO, and his family. There was virtually no communication last offseason between the team and Zion despite their best efforts to reach him and he basically did his own thing training and rehab wise. His step dad is not a fan of Griff and things just simply arent good, like say they are with Ja and Memphis. Even if they miss the playoffs again this year and next, he is signing that extension minute 1.

Combine this all with the fact that Zion will have a huge QO and will get whatever marketing money he wants wherever he goes, and I would say it is as close to a perfect storm as you could get to cause a guy not to sign the extension, especially if the team isnt winning. I'd still put it at 80% he signs it as of today, but I'd put it at 100% Luka does, 100% Ja does, 100% Trae does, etc.

But if a fan doesnt want to be objective and wants to see only the reasons for something and not the reasons the non ideal thing could happen.....well, that wouldnt be the first time a fan did that.

Everyone got that? He is gone in 7 years.

[AusPel]

All the little losses add up. Its the same argument with all of them that its not the end of the world and people are overreacting. Nobody said the sky was falling juat.like nobody said it was falling after the Adams trade and extension. Or not getting the Minny 2nd rounder for JJ and settling for the Dallas one instead. None of these things are the end of the world but in a league where only one of 30 wins and where you have a smaller margin of error than big markets, every little thing adds up

What's the story behind the Minny 2nd for JJ?

[Taker597]

Everyone got that? He is gone in 7 years.

Farm team gonna farm

[AusPel]

Farm team gonna farm

From what Mac is saying, the org has pissed off Zion's fam somehow

[Taker597]

From what Mac is saying, the org has pissed off Zion's fam somehow

Most players get pissed off at their team. This is a non story. Winning cures all, but they are right to be pissed with David Whiffin. He has made repeated mistakes and unlike an SVG. Who is atleast humble enough to take blame and call himself out. David got an ego for a LeBron Puppet and never admit to a bad move like Anthony Bennett.

So, until David can prove he's more than a Snake Oil Salesman. He should be treated as such. His only good move is brain dead moves that any person have to make in his situation.

They got to do something with their pro scouting. Langdon doing everything he can with really bad picks to build a team while David trading away picks because he doesn't want another 19 year old but he'll trade away the 4th overall for two young long term projects. Then, he'll trade away a 1st pick for an aging vet that won't even be here in Zion prime. Nothing he does makes any sense. We are two years into the Zion era. This is where you load on young guys. You try to draft a big 3 like OKC and GSW.

********ing sabotaging us is stupid annoying with this competing for play in garbage and rush through a rebuild. Griffin gonna be big stupid if Garland turns out to be the next Curry.

And what do we need... Consistent shooter. Freaking stupid

[AusPel]

Most players get pissed off at their team. This is a non story. Winning cures all, but they are right to be pissed with David Whiffin. He has made repeated mistakes and unlike an SVG. Who is atleast humble enough to take blame and call himself out. David got an ego for a LeBron Puppet and never admit to a bad move like Anthony Bennett.

So, until David can prove he's more than a Snake Oil Salesman. He should be treated as such. His only good move is brain dead moves that any person have to make in his situation.

They got to do something with their pro scouting. Langdon doing everything he can with really bad picks to build a team while David trading away picks because he doesn't want another 19 year old but he'll trade away the 4th overall for two young long term projects. Then, he'll trade away a 1st pick for an aging vet that won't even be here in Zion prime. Nothing he does makes any sense. We are two years into the Zion era. This is where you load on young guys. You try to draft a big 3 like OKC and GSW.

********ing sabotaging us is stupid annoying with this competing for play in garbage and rush through a rebuild. Griffin gonna be big stupid if Garland turns out to be the next Curry.

And what do we need... Consistent shooter. Freaking stupid

Griffin has done a lot of good and some bad too

DeAndre for Jax and NAW looks good now. As does the AD trade and the Jrue trade

He does come across a bit slimey, but I don't think he's a pure snake oil salesman. It could have been worse

[new city champ]

FWIW, the version I heard was that Zion and his folks were genuinely frosted by the whole minutes restriction thing his rookie year into the bubble, kind of feeling like the team was holding him back, dimming his star and maybe even patronizing some in his camp. In short they found Griff's act a bit overbearing. I also heard things were better after the bubble and the family appreciated the organization's discretion when Z was out of action on that private matter (never heard what it was for sure). That was all a while back and haven't heard anything new about it one way or another since before this season started. Keep in mind this came from people connected to Pels management (though not Griffin).

[AusPel]

FWIW, the version I heard was that Zion and his folks were genuinely frosted by the whole minutes restriction thing his rookie year into the bubble, kind of feeling like the team was holding him back, dimming his star and maybe even patronizing some in his camp. In short they found Griff's act a bit overbearing. I also heard things were better after the bubble and the family appreciated the organization's discretion when Z was out of action on that private matter (never heard what it was for sure). That was all a while back and haven't heard anything new about it one way or another since before this season started. Keep in mind this came from people connected to Pels management (though not Griffin).

Cheers for the insight. Surely the minutes restriction came as a directive from Aaron Nelson?