February 17th - New Orleans Pelicans VS Portland Trailblazers - 12-15

[Nichols]

Everyone knows I'm an Ingram guy.. Bottom line is he's been terrible to watch as of late. Not just terrible from a consistency standpoint from quarter to quarter, but he plays like he's braindead.

It's inexcusable to be a max player and so-called leader and exhibit the poor decision making he does when it counts. He is consistently making bad decisions.

There was also a time, when he played for the Lakers.. that he actually cared about defense. Was never a good off-ball defender, but at least played really well on-ball. Now it doesn't seem like he cares at all when he's scored on. No pride at all.

He needs to be coached. It needs to be made clear to him who the last shot goes to, or who the offense will be ran through. You can't blame him entirely for what's transpired. It's not like he's disobeying the coach and doing what he wants. If he's told to focus more on facilitating, that's what he will do. In addition, he'd look a lot better on offense if he didn't have to generate the majority of his open looks on his own, without a play. In fact most players in the league wouldn't look that impressive if they had to generate their own offense. With that being said, he needs a better presence of mind, and a coach to tell him to dial it back.

I'm disappointed in what I've seen from him this year.. Definitely not an all-star. And though I've defended him from a lot of you who never liked him to begin with. He deserves most of the criticisms he's getting right now. He's earned it.

[Fedupfan]

That's what it seems like to me. The only way that you can believe they were trying to run a 2 man game with Zion involved is if you believe Ingram went 100% AWOL and choseto just freeze Zion out, cause the play did not look a thing like Zion was supposed to be involved.

So either Stan's covering his own mistake by pretending they ran something they didn't, or he's being honest and Ingram just decided it was Ingram Time. Your choice. Who knows, maybe both?

I think it’s both to an extent. BI was probably supposed to take a different route. Zion was trying to move faster and BI went so slow that Pels couldn’t get the motion going. So, BI probably told himself he is taking the shot.

[Fedupfan]

Everyone knows I'm an Ingram guy.. Bottom line is he's been terrible to watch as of late. Not just terrible from a consistency standpoint from quarter to quarter, but he plays like he's braindead.

It's inexcusable to be a max player and so-called leader and exhibit the poor decision making he does when it counts. He is consistently making bad decisions.

There was also a time, when he played for the Lakers.. that he actually cared about defense. Was never a good off-ball defender, but at least played really well on-ball. Now it doesn't seem like he cares at all when he's scored on. No pride at all.

He needs to be coached. It needs to be made clear to him who the last shot goes to, or who the offense will be ran through. You can't blame him entirely for what's transpired. It's not like he's disobeying the coach and doing what he wants. If he's told to focus more on facilitating, that's what he will do. In addition, he'd look a lot better on offense if he didn't have to generate the majority of his open looks on his own, without a play. In fact most players in the league wouldn't look that impressive if they had to generate their own offense. With that being said, he needs a better presence of mind, and a coach to tell him to dial it back.

I'm disappointed in what I've seen from him this year.. Definitely not an all-star. And though I've defended him from a lot of you who never liked him to begin with. He deserves most of the criticisms he's getting right now. He's earned it.

This is spot on. Nice post.

[Pelicanidae]

Everyone knows I'm an Ingram guy.. Bottom line is he's been terrible to watch as of late. Not just terrible from a consistency standpoint from quarter to quarter, but he plays like he's braindead.

It's inexcusable to be a max player and so-called leader and exhibit the poor decision making he does when it counts. He is consistently making bad decisions.

There was also a time, when he played for the Lakers.. that he actually cared about defense. Was never a good off-ball defender, but at least played really well on-ball. Now it doesn't seem like he cares at all when he's scored on. No pride at all.

He needs to be coached. It needs to be made clear to him who the last shot goes to, or who the offense will be ran through. You can't blame him entirely for what's transpired. It's not like he's disobeying the coach and doing what he wants. If he's told to focus more on facilitating, that's what he will do. In addition, he'd look a lot better on offense if he didn't have to generate the majority of his open looks on his own, without a play. In fact most players in the league wouldn't look that impressive if they had to generate their own offense. With that being said, he needs a better presence of mind, and a coach to tell him to dial it back.

I'm disappointed in what I've seen from him this year.. Definitely not an all-star. And though I've defended him from a lot of you who never liked him to begin with. He deserves most of the criticisms he's getting right now. He's earned it.

I agree with almost everything you've said here, though I do disagree a little bit with the ''he has to generate the majority of his own looks'' thing; that's been less and less of a thing in recent games as Zion has taken over more and more ballhandler responsibilities, and yet Ingram has looked no better for it. I mentioned it earlier and you touch on it here, it's absolutely 100% true that the coach has to try and make things easier on Ingram, but it's also true that he has to make things easier on himself and right now he just doesn't look interested in doing that.

He needs to improve, and quickly. It's been dismal.

[luckyman]

Lmao at you deciding to prove your point that Ingram is actually good in the clutch by listing him in a lineup where he has the 2nd worst TS% and by far the worst AST%. Like, the only guy with a worse TS% is worse by only 1% and has an AST% almost 3x Ingram's. Everyone else, he's worse than in both TS% and AST% by a minimum of 8%.

Gotcha.

And that's before we realise that Ingram's actually been even worse than that so far this year, as mentioned before; 39%TS and 4.5%AST this season so far in clutch minutes.

Those players would be regarded as top 10 players in the league. Thats the point. As such, that guy that was "only worse by 1%" happens to be the best player on the planet. His 3 point % is 2nd best on that list of top 10 players in the game, which you called "pretty bad." His floor % was within range of 3 of those players.

But again, when it comes to BI, people turn real dumb.

[Nichols]

Ingram caught the ball on the inbounds, he's the one who drove it and then passed it out to Lonzo when he couldn't get a shot he liked. Then Lonzo bricked it, we got an OREB and Ingram took the fadeaway from there.

You've totally misdiagnosed what happened on that play because you have blind spots when it comes to Ingram...

Clearly you can see a pick between Zion and Ingram before Ingram passed it to Zo. That pick between the two didn't generate anything, which then led to Ingram passing it. Secondly it wasn't enough time for Ingram to get the ball to Zion after the offensive board. Take the blinders off dude... I know Ingram has been playing bad but at least attempt to be objective..

[UNO Gracias]

Like George Washington before me weeping for his country, I too weep for this team. These games are hard to watch.

[UNO Gracias]

Willy is a keeper, and I hope we don’t Woods this one up.

[luckyman]

He touched it first. Got the ball with 13 seconds and got completely clamped. Then passed out cause he was locked up and forced a bad shot on Zo. Got the ball back and missed a wide open JJ twice while looking at the floor thinking he was going to do his best Kobe impression. You need the replay?

Ok cool. My bad. Now point to me how and when BI was supposed to get the ball to Zion? Zion was used as a screener, yet no one set a screen for him to get open. They switched and Zion didnt post his man up.

What BI magic would have gotten Zion the ball there?

[Nichols]

I agree with almost everything you've said here, though I do disagree a little bit with the ''he has to generate the majority of his own looks'' thing; that's been less and less of a thing in recent games as Zion has taken over more and more ballhandler responsibilities, and yet Ingram has looked no better for it. I mentioned it earlier and you touch on it here, it's absolutely 100% true that the coach has to try and make things easier on Ingram, but it's also true that he has to make things easier on himself and right now he just doesn't look interested in doing that.

He needs to improve, and quickly. It's been dismal.

I don't agree.. Here's what you're missing.. Ingram is still generating his looks in-spite of what Zion is doing. Zion isn't creating open looks for Ingram. No one is creating open looks for Ingram. Rarely does the offensive sets. He's been talented enough to put up some good numbers despite this, but long term it's not a winning formula.

There's only two guys that are creating open looks for others on this team.. Ingram, and Zion. With more time I think Kira can change that.

[Pelicanidae]

Those players would be regarded as top 10 players in the league. Thats the point. As such, that guy that was "only worse by 1%" happens to be the best player on the planet. His 3 point % is 2nd best on that list of top 10 players in the game. His floor % was within range of 3 of those players.

But again, when it comes to BI, people turn real dumb all of a sudden.

Or we understand that pretty much everyone gets at least a bit worse during 'clutch' time for a number of reasons, and the real question is how much worse you get. If someone like, in your example, Kawhi Leonard goes from 58.9%TS - which is what he averaged overall last season - down to 54%TS, then yeah that's a reduction but it's not a massive massive cratering reduction. By comparison, Ingram went from 58.7%TS overall on the season to 45% in the clutch. Kawhi got 4.9% worse, Ingram got basically 14% worse. That's a pretty steep drop off. You expect some drop off, as in the Kawhi example, you don't expect that much of a drop off.

Yeah, Lebron having a similarly sized drop is also really bad. I'm not suddenly trying to claim that Lebron shot well in the clutch, he obviously didn't. The 'gotcha' doesn't work cause I agree, Lebron shot poorly in the clutch last year.

And then you still haven't addressed the fact that BI has been even worse than that in the clutch so far this year.

What's with that? He was pretty bad in the clutch last year, he's even worse this year, and apparently I'm ''real dumb'' for thinking that's something to be concerned about? Grow up.

[Fedupfan]

Those players would be regarded as top 10 players in the league. Thats the point. As such, that guy that was "only worse by 1%" happens to be the best player on the planet. His 3 point % is 2nd best on that list of top 10 players in the game, which you called "pretty bad." His floor % was within range of 3 of those players.

But again, when it comes to BI, people turn real dumb.

He’s just not playing well right now. Hopefully, he turns it around. Maybe he us in his own head because of his defense and it’s hurting his decision making. If this team wants to turn the page, he will need to be more of a leader.

[Fedupfan]

Ok cool. My bad. Now point to me how and when BI was supposed to get the ball to Zion? Zion was used as a screener, yet no one set a screen for him to get open. They switched and Zion didnt post his man up.

What BI magic would have gotten Zion the ball there?

It was just extremely slow developing in my opinion. I think Stan expected them to be quicker but everyone kind of quit moving. At the end he had 2 seconds to get it JJ twice while he was open. That’s my gripe. He didn’t need to force.

[Fedupfan]

Willy is a keeper, and I hope we don’t Woods this one up.

He played outstanding. I love him and Kira together.

[Nichols]

It was just extremely slow developing in my opinion. I think Stan expected them to be quicker but everyone kind of quit moving. At the end he had 2 seconds to get it JJ twice while he was open. That’s my gripe. He didn’t need to force.

The play failed.. That's coaching.. It's not on Ingram or Zion.. Even though the play was designed for them.

[Pelicanidae]

He’s just not playing well right now. Hopefully, he turns it around. Maybe he us in his own head because of his defense and it’s hurting his decision making. If this team wants to turn the page, he will need to be more of a leader.

You're not allowed to say that, apparently. Ingram is beyond reproach.

[UNO Gracias]

He played outstanding. I love him and Kira together.

I wonder how much of that chemistry is them spending so much time running with the 2nd unit, and how much is them just being talented and right in this system. Either way I don’t want this train to stop.

[Nichols]

This is spot on. Nice post.

Thanks boss.. just trying to offer some objectivity.

We can like the guy and still level criticisms when warranted. We can also not like him, which seems to be the case with some.. and have objective analysis on why he's been struggling without going overboard.

[Fedupfan]

You're not allowed to say that, apparently. Ingram is beyond reproach.

Sometimes truth can be tough for Pels fans. We didn’t have a SF for years and we get one that can really score and Max him. So, fans get excited and when a player gets a max, you would expect them to play with tenacity on both sides. BI is not earning the contract right now. I’m hoping it’s just youth but leaders are usually easy to see. I think Kira has it more than BI. I also think a time comes where Zion demands the ball. That will be when this team is unstoppable.

[Fedupfan]

I wonder how much of that chemistry is them spending so much time running with the 2nd unit, and how much is them just being talented and right in this system. Either way I don’t want this train to stop.

I think they are both very talented. Especially Kira. His usage is the only thing stopping him from being a major piece.

[luckyman]

Or we understand that pretty much everyone gets at least a bit worse during 'clutch' time for a number of reasons, and the real question is how much worse you get. If someone like, in your example, Kawhi Leonard goes from 58.9%TS - which is what he averaged overall last season - down to 54%TS, then yeah that's a reduction but it's not a massive massive cratering reduction. By comparison, Ingram went from 58.7%TS overall on the season to 45% in the clutch. Kawhi got 4.9% worse, Ingram got basically 14% worse. That's a pretty steep drop off. You expect some drop off, as in the Kawhi example, you don't expect that much of a drop off.

Yeah, Lebron having a similarly sized drop is also really bad. I'm not suddenly trying to claim that Lebron shot well in the clutch, he obviously didn't. The 'gotcha' doesn't work cause I agree, Lebron shot poorly in the clutch last year.

And then you still haven't addressed the fact that BI has been even worse than that in the clutch so far this year.

What's with that? He was pretty bad in the clutch last year, he's even worse this year, and apparently I'm ''real dumb'' for thinking that's something to be concerned about? Grow up.

Which part of "seasoned top 10 vets" are you missing? Didn't I say I chose those players for a reason? Nobody will accuse Lebron of being a poor clutch player at this point despite the bad shooting. Ingram is still a young player that has just ascended to a max player in the last year and 28 games.

Where was all this talk of him not being a max player before this? A player whose overall stats have gone up slightly across the board outside of rebounding AFTER becoming a max player?

It's only 28 games into the year. If he finishes the year being atrocious in the clutch this year then talk. Otherwise he's earned not being attacked every small chance by certain folks. You're not supposed to be a chicken little here in a place full of them. Stop being one when it comes to Ingram. Grow up faster.

[Nichols]

Sometimes truth can be tough for Pels fans. We didn’t have a SF for years and we get one that can really score and Max him. So, fans get excited and when a player gets a max, you would expect them to play with tenacity on both sides. BI is not earning the contract right now. I’m hoping it’s just youth but leaders are usually easy to see. I think Kira has it more than BI. I also think a time comes where Zion demands the ball. That will be when this team is unstoppable.

Kira is a point guard.. He's suppose to look more like a floor leader than Ingram. He's demonstrated an ability to play the point, and facilitate as a point forward really well in stretches. But a good point guard will almost always look like a better floor leader than a point forward.

[Fedupfan]

Which part of "seasoned top 10 vets" are you missing? Didn't I say I chose those players for a reason? Nobody will accuse Lebron of being a poor clutch player at this point despite the bad shooting. Ingram is still a young player that has just ascended to a max player in the last year and 28 games.

Where was all this talk of him not being a max player before this? A player whose overall stats have gone up slightly across the board outside of rebounding AFTER becoming a max player?

It's only 28 games into the year. If he finishes the year being atrocious in the clutch this year then talk. Otherwise he's earned not being attacked every small chance by certain folks. You're not supposed to be a chicken little here in a place full of them. Stop being one when it comes to Ingram. Grow up faster.

Remember we are talking about a max player here. He’s going to warrant plenty criticism. I mean nobody should be given a free pass. He’s not the first Pels player to ink a big contract and not live up to it. You give a max to someone that you want to play and lead by example. How do expect the Pels to feel when their max player is slowing down the offense and getting scored on at will? Can’t be comforting.

[Fedupfan]

Kira is a point guard.. He's suppose to look more like a floor leader than Ingram. He's demonstrated an ability to play the point, and facilitate as a point forward really well in stretches. But a good point guard will almost always look like a better floor leader than a point forward.

I’m talking about mental here. Sorry I should have clarified. Kira just has a dog in him and I love it.

[Fedupfan]

Also, is it me or does Jax look like he has put on some muscle over the last couple weeks?