February 17th - New Orleans Pelicans VS Portland Trailblazers - 12-15

[Taker597]

Top 10


RK PLAYER SCHOOL YEAR POS POS RK HT WT
1 Cade Cunningham Oklahoma St. Fr G 1 6-8 220
2 Jalen Suggs Gonzaga Fr G 2 6-4 205
3 Jalen Green USA - SG 1 6-5 172
4 Evan Mobley USC Fr F 1 7-0 215
5 Jonathan Kuminga Congo - SF 1 6-8 205
6 Greg Brown Texas Fr F 2 6-9 205
7 Jalen Johnson Duke Fr F 3 6-9 220
8 Moses Moody Arkansas Fr G 3 6-6 205
9 James Bouknight Connecticut Soph G 4 6-5 190
10 David Johnson Louisville Soph G 5 6-5 210

I want to trade up to 4th. I think Cade/Suggs/Kum are a close lock for top 3.

Pick between Mobley or Green.

[Taker597]

Don't bother. This place needs to be rename Hot Take Central.

Questioning BI's contract is beyond stupid at this point. But here we are.

Agreed. He's the best trade asset on this team and letting him walk for nothing is moronic. Regardless if he struggling. Him being a consistent scorer just keeps raising his stock. If he continues to improve. His stock will raise further. It was always a horrible move to let him walk for basically nothing or a weak sign and trade.

[Pelicanidae]

I want to trade up to 4th. I think Cade/Suggs/Kum are a close lock for top 3.

Pick between Mobley or Green.

Trade up to 1. They can have our first for it, plus any 2 of the Lakers/Bucks picks, plus pocket change.

[luckyman]

Maybe you're the one who needs a bit of a refresher: Ingram shot 33.3% from the floor in the clutch last season (22/66) including 6/24 from 3 (25%) and had a -118 +/-. TS% of 39.2%. His AST% in the clutch was 4.5% and his AST/TO was 0.17. He was not ''just fine'' as a first option, he was actually pretty bad. Just cause you remember a few of the shots that went in doesn't mean all the shots that didn't ceased existing.

But you know, you do you.

I've caught you being slick with stats before. When I say clutch, we are talking last 5 minutes in a close game. Which those stats were provided here before.

Show me where this comes from, because I can almost guarantee you are restricting the minutes down to cherry pick these stats.

[PELICANSFAN]

Trade up to 1. They can have our first for it, plus any 2 of the Lakers/Bucks picks, plus pocket change.

No team is trading out of #1 this year.

[BigChris504]

If it was a one time thing, you'd have a point. This is a trend. Ingram needs someone to talk to him cause he's been doing stuff like this all year and it's irritating. He needs to accept he's not The Guy, cause right now his failure to realise his role is costing us games.

I disagree with you only cause Brandon definitely is our "guy". And up until Zion started running point like last week I think most people were in agreements to that, including of course the entire organization. Like I said Brandon is darn good player I feel as though he tends to Over think a lot on the court however and what can help that is as we all know not having him run the offense as much. B.I. really never have hardly any wide open shots in the halfcourt a large percentage i feel like is Brandon generating his own offense, which to me needs to be addressed cause he looks just as worn out as Zion towards the end.

[Pelicanidae]

I've caught you being slick with stats before. When I say clutch, we are talking last 5 minutes in a close game. Which those stats were provided here before.

Show me where this comes from, because I can almost guarantee you are restricting the minutes down to cherry pick these stats.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/cl...mID=1610612740

Literally the NBA official stats site.

Players - Clutch - Traditional, set the year to 2019-20, Team set to New Orleans Pelicans, change it from ''per game'' to ''total'' (cause otherwise it looks like Ingram only took like 2 shots in the clutch, hard to contextualise), and there you go. 33.3% shooting, 25% from 3, -118 +/-, et cetera.

My bad on a few of the numbers though: if you want the AST% and stuff you have to change it from ''Traditional'' to ''Advanced'', which re-set the year to this year and I didn't realise. If you change it to 2019-20 the AST% isn't 4.5% (that's this year) it's 20.0%, and the AS/TO isn't 0.17, it's the slightly better 0.89. TS% goes from 39.2% (again, that's this year) to 45.1%.

All of those numbers are still pretty bad, but just trying to be clear.

[Pelicanidae]

No team is trading out of #1 this year.

I know, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try lmao

[BigChris504]

Don't bother. This place needs to be rename Hot Take Central.

Questioning BI's contract is beyond stupid at this point. But here we are.

We've both been members on this board for a long time, I remember bro, we're all guilty of it from time to time. Lol

[Fedupfan]

I just would love to see BI show some leadership. It?s hard to understand how you max a player that doesn?t talk or take defense seriously. I can?t wait till the day he takes a defensive challenge and asks to guard a final possession. All that length for him to stand in a corner and put Zo on an island.

[PELICANSFAN]

And you'd still be wrong. Extremely wrong. But you'll never give up being wrong about him. So tonight is your chance to feast along with all the other chicken littles.

That final possession was bombed the minute Lonzo took a 30 footer. Which there was no need to do. He had ample time to move the ball to Zion. But he's not a point guard.

By the time Ingram got it back there is no time to go hand the ball to Zion. There's is no magic for that.

No, that possession was bombed when the coach called the play for BI. The ball should have gone straight into Zion's hands and let he and JJ work together for a final shot. Instead the ball went to BI for ISO ball and he ate up the clock and threw it out when he did not get the look he wanted. Lonzo rushed a shot so not sure if he thought it was later in the clock or not. It appeared everyone was standing around waiting for BI to take the shot. Not sure how he air-balled the final shot when it got back to him.

[Pelicanidae]

I disagree with you only cause Brandon definitely is our "guy". And up until Zion started running point like last week I think most people were in agreements to that, including of course the entire organization. Like I said Brandon is darn good player I feel as though he tends to Over think a lot on the court however and what can help that is as we all know not having him run the offense as much. B.I. really never have hardly any wide open shots in the halfcourt a large percentage i feel like is Brandon generating his own offense, which to me needs to be addressed cause he looks just as worn out as Zion towards the end.

The offense is vastly improved over a few weeks ago in terms of overall efficiency, but as the team offense has improved (which has coincided with Zion taking the reins) Ingram has not seen a consistent improvement despite a lot of the offensive load being taken off his shoulders.

It's absolutely true that the team has to try and make things easier for him, but he also has to make things easier for himself. He is, right now, refusing to do that, for whatever reason you want to choose to explain it.

Also, I absolutely do not believe Ingram is ''the guy''. Never have. Unless he can get out of his own head, probably never will.

[Pelicanidae]

Why y’all scared to ask for more when people suck? Y’all had no problem being on Zion’s ****** when his defense was horrendous. What’s different with these other players?

— L✨ (@LAWard_) February 18, 2021

My argument is basically this. Ingram's getting paid $28m, if it's fair to get hyperbolic and whiny about the 20 year old's defense when he's 30 or 40 games into his career (he's improved over the last 10 or so quite a lot) then it's fair to get on the 5 year vet max contract guy for consistently committing a one-man killing spree against our own offense.

[redrum]

The Pels made the right trade, but this team misses Jrue's lockdown D. The guards made Dame's life too easy.

[PELICANSFAN]

Stan Van Gundy on final #Pelicans possession: "We tried to get into a two-man game with our two best players (Zion and Ingram). Didn't get much out of it. We got two shots down the stretch, probably not the ones we'd like to get."

— Jim Eichenhofer (@Jim_Eichenhofer) February 18, 2021

Is Stan covering his mistake with this? Watching that last play it looked nothing like a designed two many game with BI and Zion. Zion did not appear to be part of the play at all.

[PELICANSFAN]

The Pels made the right trade, but this team misses Jrue's lockdown D. The guards made Dame's life too easy.

Part of Jrue's success was the way he played Dame. Our plan a lot of times was to pick him up at half court and double him often to try and get the ball out of his hands. We did not play him that way tonight.

[AUSSIE_PELICAN]

Why y’all scared to ask for more when people suck? Y’all had no problem being on Zion’s ****** when his defense was horrendous. What’s different with these other players?

— L✨ (@LAWard_) February 18, 2021

My argument is basically this. Ingram's getting paid $28m, if it's fair to get hyperbolic and whiny about the 20 year old's defense when he's 30 or 40 games into his career (he's improved over the last 10 or so quite a lot) then it's fair to get on the 5 year vet max contract guy for consistently committing a one-man killing spree against our own offense.

It's not even about accepting that your not the guy, but realizing that if it isn't your night and somebody else is having a better game, give them the $%$#% ball.
2 games ago it was Hart who was having a great game. Its recognizing this is a team sport and not trying to be the savior every time.

[Pelicanidae]

Stan Van Gundy on final #Pelicans possession: "We tried to get into a two-man game with our two best players (Zion and Ingram). Didn't get much out of it. We got two shots down the stretch, probably not the ones we'd like to get."

— Jim Eichenhofer (@Jim_Eichenhofer) February 18, 2021

Is Stan covering his mistake with this? Watching that last play it looked nothing like a designed two many game with BI and Zion. Zion did not appear to be part of the play at all.

That's what it seems like to me. The only way that you can believe they were trying to run a 2 man game with Zion involved is if you believe Ingram went 100% AWOL and choseto just freeze Zion out, cause the play did not look a thing like Zion was supposed to be involved.

So either Stan's covering his own mistake by pretending they ran something they didn't, or he's being honest and Ingram just decided it was Ingram Time. Your choice. Who knows, maybe both?

[luckyman]

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/cl...mID=1610612740

Literally the NBA official stats site.

Players - Clutch - Traditional, set the year to 2019-20, Team set to New Orleans Pelicans, change it from ''per game'' to ''total'' (cause otherwise it looks like Ingram only took like 2 shots in the clutch, hard to contextualise), and there you go. 33.3% shooting, 25% from 3, -118 +/-, et cetera.

My bad on a few of the numbers though: if you want the AST% and stuff you have to change it from ''Traditional'' to ''Advanced'', which re-set the year to this year and I didn't realise. If you change it to 2019-20 the AST% isn't 4.5% (that's this year) it's 20.0%, and the AS/TO isn't 0.17, it's the slightly better 0.89. TS% goes from 39.2% (again, that's this year) to 45.1%.

All of those numbers are still pretty bad, but just trying to be clear.

Lol of course.

Last year clutch numbers...

Lebron James 35% floor, 16% 3 pt, AST% 57%, TS% 44%
James Harden 36% floor, 25% 3 pt, AST% 31%, TS% 59%
Damian Lillard 40% floor, 33% 3 pt, AST% 39%, TS% 56%
Brandon Ingram 33% floor, 25% 3 pt, AST% 20%, TS% 45%
Kawhi Leonard 39% floor, 14% 3 pt, AST% 28%, TS% 54%

So some of those "pretty bad" numbers are the same or better than some maxed out seasoned vets. And that was during his 1st true breakout year. So obviously, as I said, he has to adjust to being played more aggressively this year.

But you do you.

[As I See It]

At what point in the second half did Bledsoe come of the game. I see he only played 23 minutes and JJ was in late in the game offensively.

[luckyman]

No, that possession was bombed when the coach called the play for BI. The ball should have gone straight into Zion's hands and let he and JJ work together for a final shot. Instead the ball went to BI for ISO ball and he ate up the clock and threw it out when he did not get the look he wanted. Lonzo rushed a shot so not sure if he thought it was later in the clock or not. It appeared everyone was standing around waiting for BI to take the shot. Not sure how he air-balled the final shot when it got back to him.

How was that play called for BI when he didn't touch the ball until AFTER a rebounded Lonzo miss? A shot he didnt have to take. Did I miss something?

[Pelicanidae]

Lol of course.

Last year clutch numbers...

Lebron James 35% floor, 16% 3 pt, AST% 57%, TS% 44%
James Harden 36% floor, 25% 3 pt, AST% 31%, TS% 59%
Damian Lillard 40% floor, 33% 3 pt, AST% 39%, TS% 56%
Brandon Ingram 33% floor, 25% 3 pt, AST% 20%, TS% 45%
Kawhi Leonard 39% floor, 14% 3 pt, AST% 28%, TS% 54%

So some of those "pretty bad" numbers are better than some maxed out seasoned vets. And that was during his 1st true breakout year. So obviously, as I said, he has to adjust to being played more aggressively this year.

But you do you.

Lmao at you deciding to prove your point that Ingram is actually good in the clutch by listing him in a lineup where he has the 2nd worst TS% and by far the worst AST%. Like, the only guy with a worse TS% is worse by only 1% and has an AST% almost 3x Ingram's. Everyone else, he's worse than in both TS% and AST% by a minimum of 8%.

Gotcha.

And that's before we realise that Ingram's actually been even worse than that so far this year, as mentioned before; 39%TS and 4.5%AST this season so far in clutch minutes.

[Pelicanidae]

How was that play called for BI when he didn't touch the ball until AFTER a rebounded Lonzo miss? Did I miss something?

Ingram caught the ball on the inbounds, he's the one who drove it and then passed it out to Lonzo when he couldn't get a shot he liked. Then Lonzo bricked it, we got an OREB and Ingram took the fadeaway from there.

[AUSSIE_PELICAN]

How was that play called for BI when he didn't touch the ball until AFTER a rebounded Lonzo miss? A shot he didnt have to take. Did I miss something?

https://twitter.com/FearTheBrown/sta...68170741043201

[Fedupfan]

He touched it first. Got the ball with 13 seconds and got completely clamped. Then passed out cause he was locked up and forced a bad shot on Zo. Got the ball back and missed a wide open JJ twice while looking at the floor thinking he was going to do his best Kobe impression. You need the replay?