If we did a 3 team deal with the Suns, I'd want TJ Warren. They could have Ingram if they want him, I don't care.
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If we did a 3 team deal with the Suns, I'd want TJ Warren. They could have Ingram if they want him, I don't care.
Basketball.
Would Nets give up Russell and LeVert for AD if they were hoping to get Kyrie?
Would you say Toronto feels stupid right now?Originally Posted by Darkhorse985
I'm going to throw in a dark horse pick here, I thought of them a while ago but I'm bringing it back up given these new Nets related moves. I DO NOT THINK THIS IS LIKELY. I'm not saying ''this is gonna happen!''. I'm just throwing the idea out cause I think it's interesting.
Atlanta Hawks get:
- Anthony Davis
- E'twaun Moore
New Orleans Pelicans get:
- John Collins
- Kent Bazemore
- Miles Plumlee
- #10 from Dallas, #17 from Atlanta, 2020 Atlanta FRP (top 3 protected), 2022 Atlanta FRP (unprotected)
Yes, or no? I don't really like it that much, but the salaries work, the #10 pick and #17 pick could easily be Chuma Okeke (who I'm pick on) and Bol Bol, Bazemore gives us another vet who can soak up SF minutes, and it gets Atlanta off Plumlee's big awful deal while we wouldn't care about it because we're not exactly running around in FA anyway.
They don't HAVE Russell. He's a FA.
Well dang, missed that one. 0% chance they trade for AD now then.
It would have to be a S&T, which means we would have to miss out on the ability to take draft-centric offers from other teams, and D-Lo would have to agree to come here. All very risky.
Contributor
Risky to the point of us not even bothering to go that way. Hell. If we really want Russ, we can just go after him ourselves after we've traded AD. Throw a hefty amount to keep the Nets from matching and losing out on getting Kyrie or Durant, while knowing that we have Zion on a rookie contract.
The best assets the Nets had under contract before this trade
LeVert
Allen
Dinwiddie
Harris
17th pick
Kurucs
27 pick
future picks
The best assets the Nets have after the trade
LeVert
Allen
Dinwiddie
Prince
Harris
Kurucs
27 pick
future picks
Not sure how they're out of the AD sweepstakes because of this deal, which won't even be officially completed until July 1.
Thanks for making it clear. I totally overestimated what happened.
I'd do that trade.
I don't want to make Boston, LA or the Knicks relevant.
I also don't think the players coming from LA or Boston will accept playing second fiddle.
All the guys from the Brooklyn will do that.
You can then package pick 27and the 2 Pels 2nds to move up to the late teens or early 20's.
A team of:
Dinwiddie/Jackson/2019 pick
Holiday/Harris/Moore
Prince/Levert/Hill
Zion/Williams/Wood/Diallo
Allen/Okafor
Then trade Moore, Hill and expiring like Diallo, Wood or Okafor by Feb 2020 if they don't pan out for the future.
LeVert is a much better player than Prince. Not sure if you really intended to slot Prince in as the starter.
I think for me, and I accept that this is personal standards only and nobody else has to agree, here's what I'm looking for:
1) A way of gaining a high value player. That can be by directly acquiring that player, with Tatum for example, or it can be through getting a pick with a high likelihood of producing that player, like the #3 pick for either RJ or Culver.
2) Multiple picks extending into the future. Dream scenario would give us at least two picks (our own + 1) in every draft for the next 5 years. Obviously that's optimistic, but it's the general idea.
3) At least two pretty young players who project well, and who don't make each other redundant. So getting back two ballhandling, slashing shooting guards, for example, wouldn't be great. The Knicks, for example, provide Mitchell Robinson and Allonzo Trier, both of whom are 23 or younger, both on rookie contracts with multiple years left, and both with one very projectable skill: Robinson as rim protector and rebounder, Trier as shooter. Boston could provide Smart and Brown: a 1 guard and a 2 guard who can play some 3, one of whom is an excellent defender and the other who can shoot and defend as well.
I think that's why the Knicks appeal to me so much. They can give (at least theoretically) RJ, their 2020 FRP, the Dallas picks for 2021 and 2023, and their own 2022 pick, along with Robinson and Trier. That's the star, the roleplayers with good contracts, and the future picks extending out for several years.
Boston could be similar, and I'd be pretty happy with them giving up something like Tatum, Brown, Smart, #14, their 2020 pick, and the 2021 Memphis pick. It's unlikely they would give up ALL of that, but that's the goal you have in mind when negotiating with them.
Interesting this happened after the "Griffin is taking offers" news. Makes me wonder if the Nets were told "we've already been offered better, you're out" with the AD sweepstakes or of we said "we're not interested in any of these items" so they traded those items. That is all musings with zero facts.
It's also possible that Griff told them ''we've already been offered better, you'll have to add X'', and the Nets backed off, worried about Billy King'ing themselves again.
Yuck. That roster goes nowhere. I question if any of them could be top 50 NBA players (maybe Levert has an outside shot, but between his age, injury history, and needing to be paid next year, no thanks). None of those pieces have significant value to flip. And there's no significant future draft picks coming back. I hate it.
I don't care where AD goes. By the time it is time for us to contend, there's a good chance his situation will be different anyway.
Fine.
You believe you need 3 stars to win a title.
I believe it takes a great organisation, injury luck and a team who plays their roles.
Zion is the star and we won't be adding additional stars by trading AD. Pick 3 or Ingram or Tatum don't = star for me.
Jarrett Allen is a very good player who's a defensive beast. Still very young and a ton of room to grow. The Nets are certainly intriguing, but I don't know if they're looking to trade with us.
I think ideally you need both of those things unless you are really lucky. I also don't think Jrue is a star by the time that Zion is ready to compete. I also don't see anything from that package which eventually becomes an asset that gets you a star. We aren't getting these players in free agency, so we have to draft or trade for them.
I think the best deal gives you a combination of at least one guy who could become a second and/or third stars when Zion is ready to contend, have potential value around the league to be flipped for future draft capital, and offers future draft capital to give you flexibility in the future to add stars when Zion is ready to compete. To me, the Nets deal keeps you both star-poor and doesn't improve your draft capital relative to some of the better offers that have been proposed.
So do you think Ingram, pick 3 or Tatum become a star?
If they do, do you think that either Tatum or Ingram are happy to play second fiddle to Zion?
I just don't see where we get this second or 3rd star from trading AD.
Like you said no stars will come here, but that was then and now we have a competent organisation and an owner who will spend.
I just think the Brooklyn trade proposal is better than yuck.
I also see a lot of potential in Allen.
Yeah. The Nets and Clips, to me, just come across as "I really hate the Lakers.....how about this trade?" The only way they have a chance is if NY, LA, or Bos doesn't offer as much as we think they will. That Hawks trade Dae posted is intriguing.
I did kinda like Zubac, though. Was a little sad when LAL traded him. But that's not enough to make me like what LAC offers.
I think there are more realistic chances in those packages that you get your star directly. Even if not, those teams have more future picks or pieces that can be moved for future picks to get them indirectly. Now Nets don't even have their own picks in the future, so in addition to the worst players, you get the worst picks.
I think there's a chance (let's call in 30-40%) RJ Barrett becomes a star. I think he's also likely to put up counting stats, be at least a competent young wing, and be likely to have counting stats, so if the fit isn't great I think there's a good chance he's valuable in a future trade. And Knicks have their picks and Mavs picks.
I think there's a slightly better chance Tatum is a star and really good chance he is valuable on his next contract. And the Memphis pick will probably be somewhat valuable.
I'm less sold on Ingram, but I think there is star potential there and 2 other valuable things in that deal (#4 pick, Lonzo or what Lonzo can be traded for). Plus Lakers have their picks.
And I'm not worried about those guys and playing second fiddle or whatever. Most players who aren't jerks can make it work. If they do become stars and there is some friction, that's still one of those good problems (like Philly with Embiid and Simmons).
The future picks are different. Now the Nets cannot trade a future 1st before 2022. They also do not have their highest 1st this year and have replaced that with Prince. He is a good player with one year left on his contract.
Their best 3 assets are unchanged. I also think they can still trade the future pick, provided it lands in lottery. If it doesn’t land 1-14, it goes to Atlanta. If it goes to Atlanta in 2020, Pels get pick in 2022.
Last edited by NMThreeMVP; 06-07-2019 at 08:15 AM.
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