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Thread: AD trade scenarios...

  1. #1926
    Quote Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN View Post
    So you think that we would win exactly the same number of games?
    Nah, I think he's saying that if we won a different number of games, it just wouldn't matter because they'd be running the lottery again and we could always luck out from a different position.
    Zion ''The Earthquake'' Williamson

  2. #1927




    This twitter account has 53 followers.

    ''per sources''.

    Sounds legit.

  3. #1928
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post


    Have you ever heard of the concept of arguing in good faith? I have to ask, since you seem extremely determined to avoid doing it at all costs.
    This is hilarious coming from the person that made this comment...

    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Trade AD in February, you don't get Zion.
    Saying we wouldn’t have gotten Zion if we traded AD in February is literally unprovable and unknown.

    By your same logic and the theories of time travel - you change one thing, you change everything.

    If your point is that ultimately it doesn’t matter because we got Zion, I don’t disagree!

  4. #1929
    Quote Originally Posted by NMThreeMVP View Post
    This is hilarious coming from the person that made this comment...



    Saying we wouldn’t have gotten Zion if we traded AD in February is literally unprovable and unknown.

    By your same logic and the theories of time travel - you change one thing, you change everything.

    If your point is that ultimately it doesn’t matter because we got Zion, I don’t disagree!
    Already accepted the fact that I phrased it poorly, and re-clarified. My point was that if you change anything you have to re-run the lottery again, and since the odds of us getting Zion the first time were so miniscule and we lucked out, the odds of us running it all over again and STILL getting Zion are so miniscule as to be considered, for practical purposes, pretty close to 0%.

  5. #1930
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Already accepted the fact that I phrased it poorly, and re-clarified. My point was that if you change anything you have to re-run the lottery again, and since the odds of us getting Zion the first time were so miniscule and we lucked out, the odds of us running it all over again and STILL getting Zion are so miniscule as to be considered, for practical purposes, pretty close to 0%.
    Do you believe in God?

    What about destiny?

    What about Adam Silver?

  6. #1931
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    I'm saying those deals worked out pretty well in the long run.

    I've never ''discounted'' the idea that Ball or Ingram could get better. We have had this argument dozens of times on this board. Every single time, whether it's with you, or 13-3, or GA25, or whichever bad-faith arguer decides not to bother actually reading what I've written before flipping their lids, I have to explain YET AGAIN that I totally understand that Ingram, or Ball, or Kuzma, or Josh Hart, or Moe flippin' Wagner, COULD end up improving in the future. In fact, MULTIPLE TIMES I have clarified that I expect certain improvements from certain players (I EXPECT Ingram to improve as a rebounder, for example).

    I've also said that IF we were to end up with those players I would desperately hope that they prove me wrong and play well, because I want this team to be good, and I would be HAPPY to be wrong in those circumstances.

    Please, please, I am begging you, argue with things I've actually said, or for approaches I've actually taken, rather than just making up stuff to get upset with.
    At the time they were traded, did you think Buddy or Oladipo had a ceiling as a player, higher than Lonzo or Ingram have now?

  7. #1932
    Quote Originally Posted by NMThreeMVP View Post
    Do you believe in God?

    What about destiny?

    What about Adam Silver?
    Don't believe in God, don't really believe in destiny, don't think Silver rigged it.

    I accept I could totally be wrong on that last one: maybe Silver did rig it. But I don't think so.

  8. #1933
    Quote Originally Posted by NMThreeMVP View Post
    At the time they were traded, did you think Buddy or Oladipo had a ceiling as a player, higher than Lonzo or Ingram have now?
    Buddy? I don't remember. I don't think I was super high on him, but I can't remember whether I thought he was going to settle and improve, or whether I thought he was just gonna stay being kinda meh.

    Oladipo though, definitely. I totally believed that he had disappointed due to playing alongside Russ, who was on his triple-double-quest and didn't care about teammates or winning, and I argued that he was a much, MUCH better player than he was being given the chance to show. Then he went to Indiana, and it turns out I was right on that one.

  9. #1934
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! kinglio21093's Avatar
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    Y'all see Brandon Ingram's Instagram story?

  10. #1935
    Quote Originally Posted by kinglio21093 View Post
    Y'all see Brandon Ingram's Instagram story?
    Nah not everyone is on instagram. Do share though


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #1936
    Quote Originally Posted by kinglio21093 View Post
    Y'all see Brandon Ingram's Instagram story?
    Nope, what is it?

  12. #1937
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sleeper View Post
    Nah not everyone is on instagram. Do share though


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I maybe grasping at straws but it's certainly interesting given the timing.

    It's just a picture that says "U Don't Owe Anyone ****"

  13. #1938
    Quote Originally Posted by kinglio21093 View Post
    I maybe grasping at straws but it's certainly interesting given the timing.

    It's just a picture that says "U Don't Owe Anyone ****"
    Could be relevant. Could also be unrelated, or it could be his commentary on the Durant thing (you don't owe anyone to play, look, Durant played when he wasn't healthy and now see what happened), but it's worth noting anyway.

  14. #1939
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! JJackisangry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinglio21093 View Post
    I maybe grasping at straws but it's certainly interesting given the timing.

    It's just a picture that says "U Don't Owe Anyone ****"
    Now this is the gossip I live for. Good work detective

  15. #1940
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Could be relevant. Could also be unrelated, or it could be his commentary on the Durant thing (you don't owe anyone to play, look, Durant played when he wasn't healthy and now see what happened), but it's worth noting anyway.
    Hilariously enough, I’d believe there could be something behind this before I’d believe in 99 percent of media speculation. I love when the social media detective squad is let loose

  16. #1941
    Quote Originally Posted by JJackisangry View Post
    Hilariously enough, I’d believe there could be something behind this before I’d believe in 99 percent of media speculation. I love when the social media detective squad is let loose
    Remember, AD is still working out with Jrue and Frank Jackson.

    AD to resign in NOLA?!?!?!?!???!!!

  17. #1942
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Remember, AD is still working out with Jrue and Frank Jackson.

    AD to resign in NOLA?!?!?!?!???!!!
    YEESSSS MORREEE!!!!! I LIVE FOR THE PSYCHOANALYSIS

  18. #1943
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    I can't believe Alonzo Trier's spacing isn't doing it for them
    Last edited by NMThreeMVP; 06-11-2019 at 08:06 PM.

  19. #1944
    Quote Originally Posted by NMThreeMVP View Post

    Not surprising to anyone. We had the leaks from Woj that pretty much confirmed this when he said that Griff is asking other teams to get a third team involved to sweeten deals.

    Knicks have promising young players in Robinson and Trier, but Knox, Ntilikina, and DSJ are not viewed highly around the league. If the Knicks want this deal, they'll have to try and flip Knox and Ntilikina into a decent player, or into a high value pick.

  20. #1945
    Am I nuts for thinking that maybe Orlando could be a team to consider as a third party in the NYC deal?

    They were pretty high on DSJ around draft time from all reports. They were linked to him multiple times earlier this season when he was being shopped by Dallas, and they still desperately need a lead guard (their current full time starting PG is DJ Augustin, who is 31, barely 6'0 tall, and is on the decline).

    If that's true, maybe they could be roped in to provide the additional draft capital for an AD trade? Maybe re-rout DSJ and a future pick (possibly a Dallas pick) to Orlando in exchange for #16 and one of their young guys?

    Maybe I'm just pipe-dreaming here, they probably wouldn't be that interested and I'm not sure why of the Magic young bigs I'd want. Mo Bamba? Jonathan Isaac?

  21. #1946
    The Knicks would have to trade DSJ, Knox and trier, for an all star, but who would that all star be? Would the wizards trade Beal for that? Then you draft Barrett and land Mitchell Robinson als, and get the Dallas pick next year

    Wonder if we could get oladipo instead of Beal for that, love his defense

    Jrue
    Beal or oladipo
    Barret
    Zion
    Robinson

    Dallas pick next year

  22. #1947
    Quote Originally Posted by HornetGuru View Post
    The Knicks would have to trade DSJ, Knox and trier, for an all star, but who would that all star be? Would the wizards trade Beal for that? Then you draft Barrett and land Mitchell Robinson als, and get the Dallas pick next year
    That's not necessarily true. Griff was fairly clear that the all-star would become less necessary if the depth of the supporting cast or the quality of the picks increased. Similarly, the quality of the picks becomes less important if there's a legit, full on all-star on the table.

    The Knicks could pretty easily, I think, offer the deepest pick-based trade out of anyone. They could, if they wanted, offer their own picks in 2019, 2020, 2022, and the Dallas 2021 and 2023, without even having to make any moves. Only Boston could really come close to that, but they only have one pick from another team for future years (the Memphis 2020/2021 pick). They could also bolster the strength of their player core by packaging one or two of those picks with someone like Knox for another solid roleplayer, or a young player with high upside, while still maintaining probably the best set of picks.

    In terms of players, Boston is the clear favourite there: Tatum and Brown are the two best prospects from any of the major teams, so the fact that they don't really have the best draft capital is less of a problem.

    LA falls somewhere in the middle. Their players aren't as good as Boston's, but they're better than most of the Knicks guys (Ingram and Ball are better than Knox and Ntilikina, for example), but their array of picks is clearly inferior to New York's as well. So that's a kind of tricky position for them.

  23. #1948
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicanidae View Post
    Not surprising to anyone. We had the leaks from Woj that pretty much confirmed this when he said that Griff is asking other teams to get a third team involved to sweeten deals.

    Knicks have promising young players in Robinson and Trier, but Knox, Ntilikina, and DSJ are not viewed highly around the league. If the Knicks want this deal, they'll have to try and flip Knox and Ntilikina into a decent player, or into a high value pick.
    How do we know Robinson and Trier have any value around the league? Both had somewhat serious off court red flags coming into the league. Robinson also fouls at a rate that would embarrass Ajinca.

    The reason I wanted the Knicks deal back in February was about accumulating the draft pick with the highest probability of getting Zion. Now that we have Zion, I don't really see anything of value in the Knicks package unless you love RJ.

  24. #1949
    Quote Originally Posted by NMThreeMVP View Post
    How do we know Robinson and Trier have any value around the league? Both had somewhat serious off court red flags coming into the league. Robinson also fouls at a rate that would embarrass Ajinca.

    The reason I wanted the Knicks deal back in February was about accumulating the draft pick with the highest probability of getting Zion. Now that we have Zion, I don't really see anything of value in the Knicks package unless you love RJ.
    I really find it kind of embarrassing when people bring up Robinson's foul rate as if that's somehow some huge point. He's a 20 year old big. He fouls. So do pretty much all of them.

    Per 100, Mitchell Robinson averages 7.7 fouls.
    In his rookie year, Draymond Green averaged 7.6 fouls per 100. Rudy Gobert, 6.9. DeAndre Jordan, 6.5.

    Rookie Andrew Bynum fouled 8.7 times per 100. Rookie Mark Eaton, 7.5. Rookie Ben Wallace, 7.1.

    Rookie bigs with defensive games foul a lot. It's fine.

    About Trier? I don't know. I can imagine he'd have some value, since he was a double digit scorer who shot very well from 3, which is pretty much always something people are on the lookout for. Can't guarantee it though, haven't heard anything about him being sought after or about him being disliked.
    Last edited by Pelicanidae; 06-11-2019 at 09:19 PM.

  25. #1950
    Quote Originally Posted by da ThRONe View Post
    Knicks were going to be trash with or without Davis and that's where we should have traded him.
    This is beyond stupid.

    You cannot sit here and still say we should have traded AD at deadline when by not trading him we won the lottery. No one can actually believe that.
    Last edited by Mythrol; 06-11-2019 at 09:14 PM.

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