Tatum & Zion Possibility?

[Pelicanidae]

Interesting. I also found this-




Getting the #1 pick is probably the only think that gets the Lakers a spot back at the table for AD.

That gives us pretty much a 20% chance of getting Zion, which I think is pretty reasonable. I think after the lottery, when we know who has what, that will all solidify into something much more real. If NYC gets the #1 pick, for example, I think we probably have a 50% chance of getting Zion.

Agreed on LA as well. If they have Zion, they can have AD. Or at least, they have a very good reason to be in consideration again. Short of that, the 12th pick and Ingram isn't gonna do it.

[Mythrol]

To be crystal clear so everyone understands:

We do not have to wait until the start of the new NBA year to agree to a trade with Boston or anyone else.

Once the team's season is over they can discuss and agree to trades at any time, even if the trade cannot be **executed** until the new NBA year and the start of free agency.

Even a trade with NYK would probably be agreed upon before the draft but not executed until later because they can't include DSJ until the start of the new NBA year.

[Tinman]

To be crystal clear so everyone understands:

We do not have to wait until the start of the new NBA year to agree to a trade with Boston or anyone else.

Once the team's season is over they can discuss and agree to trades at any time, even if the trade cannot be **executed** until the new NBA year and the start of free agency.

Even a trade with NYK would probably be agreed upon before the draft but not executed until later because they can't include DSJ until the start of the new NBA year.

We know that. It's just very unfortunate that our MAJOR local media is still peddling this July 1 garbage.
A Trade can be made & executed immediately after said team(s) season is over, so long as all players are under contract with current team for next year minus the specific in season trade restrictions .

[Mythrol]

We know that. It's just very unfortunate that our MAJOR local media is still peddling this July 1 garbage.
A Trade can be made & executed immediately after said team(s) season is over, so long as all players are under contract with current team for next year minus the specific in season trade restrictions .

That would require 5 minutes worth of effort. You can't expect local media to do that... Sigh

[RobertM320]

FWIW, just heard on the radio this evening on the way home. Chris Broussard and Rob Parker The Odd Couple) had Caron Butler on the show. Both he and Broussard say they're hearing from their sources that KD to the Knicks is basically a done deal. So if the Knicks get KD, and Kyrie decides to leave and join him, where does that leave us regarding AD? Boston may not want him with Kyrie gone, NYK may not be able to take him along with KD and Kyrie.

[Pelicanidae]

FWIW, just heard on the radio this evening on the way home. Chris Broussard and Rob Parker The Odd Couple) had Caron Butler on the show. Both he and Broussard say they're hearing from their sources that KD to the Knicks is basically a done deal. So if the Knicks get KD, and Kyrie decides to leave and join him, where does that leave us regarding AD? Boston may not want him with Kyrie gone, NYK may not be able to take him along with KD and Kyrie.

The Knicks can take him along with KD and Kyrie. That trio is the entire basis of all of the Knicks talk since AD asked for the trade. The Knicks have barely $36m on their books for next season. They would obviously be required to swap essentially $27m of that for AD. So that will not actually add much to their current on-payroll salary. The salary cap for next season is $109m. That means they would have $73m left (assuming pure cap, no extra payments), which means they could theoretically offer KD and Kyrie both $30m contracts, while still trading for AD, and still not have actually met the cap.

Any trade that we do will have been already agreed before July 1st. Teams cannot sign players in free agency until July 6th. Kyrie CANNOT leave until July 6th. We will have already completed the trade by that point, and it's highly likely that Kyrie will be waiting to make his decision until after he sees where AD goes. Unless Kyrie tells Boston in certain terms that he is 100% leaving, then his decision makes ZERO impact on the trade for us.

[Tinman]

FWIW, just heard on the radio this evening on the way home. Chris Broussard and Rob Parker The Odd Couple) had Caron Butler on the show. Both he and Broussard say they're hearing from their sources that KD to the Knicks is basically a done deal. So if the Knicks get KD, and Kyrie decides to leave and join him, where does that leave us regarding AD? Boston may not want him with Kyrie gone, NYK may not be able to take him along with KD and Kyrie.

FWIW- Nothing! KD is as fickle as a pickle. Once again, the media throwing out their trial balloons, trying to wish it into fruition.
Not to mention, Broussard, Parker & Butler = Curly , Larry & Moe.

[RobertM320]

FWIW- Nothing! KD is as fickle as a pickle. Once again, the media throwing out their trial balloons, trying to wish it into fruition.
Not to mention, Broussard, Parker & Butler = Curly , Larry & Moe.

Which is why I said, FWIW. I've never been very impressed with the show, it was just the only sports thing on while I was driving home.

[Tinman]

Which is why I said, FWIW. I've never been very impressed with the show, it was just the only sports thing on while I was driving home.

Yeah, I gotcha. My FWIW-Nothing ! Was in regard to how I felt about their opinions.

[Taker597]

FWIW, just heard on the radio this evening on the way home. Chris Broussard and Rob Parker The Odd Couple) had Caron Butler on the show. Both he and Broussard say they're hearing from their sources that KD to the Knicks is basically a done deal. So if the Knicks get KD, and Kyrie decides to leave and join him, where does that leave us regarding AD? Boston may not want him with Kyrie gone, NYK may not be able to take him along with KD and Kyrie.

Just the media trying to make a New York team feel relevant.

[13 - 3]

Soon?

https://nbcprobasketballtalk.files.w...5-10-20-54.png

[Pelicanidae]

Soon?

https://nbcprobasketballtalk.files.w...5-10-20-54.png

Could be. Could also not be. This is a total non-thing.

[Mythrol]

Could be. Could also not be. This is a total non-thing.

I mean... I wouldn't call this a total non thing. They knew exactly what they were doing posting that.

That doesn't mean any type off deal is in place but they knew what was up.

[new city champ]

I've asked this before, but I'll resubmit the question as we move toward the end of the season:

Would you consider making a deal with the Knicks for Davis BEFORE the draft lottery is announced? In that scenario you'd get your preferred basket of players (Knox, et al) + 3 picks, one of which would be the first rounder this year.

In doing this deal you would assume the risk of NY's pick. It was a 14% chance of being number one overall and a better than 50% chance of being top three. I believe it cannot fall out of the top five or six.

So, even worst case, you downside is a top-5 pick to go along with Pels own pick and the upside is Zion + Pels pick (Coby?).

Why do it? If you don't believe the Knicks will trade you Zion in a deal for Davis and you are willing to roll the dice to try and get him. I think you'd also have to like the Knicks young players. I think you'd also have to have real concerns about the Celtics offering Tatum.

It's certainly a roll of the dice but you've hedged your downside pretty effectively with two pics in the top 6 + Knicks future picks + 3 prospects from Knicks roster. Upside is Zion, Coby, Knox, Robinson, Smith, Jr. and a pretty good jumpstart on our rebuild.

[13 - 3]

Could be. Could also not be. This is a total non-thing.

Tampering too

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2019/04/05/...boston-jersey/

This looks like a clear case of tampering. The Celtics used a player under contract with another team to promote themselves.

It’s also pretty harmless (and funny) – like many instances of tampering, some of which the NBA punishes teams for. There’s little consistency in the league’s standards on tampering, so I wouldn’t even guess how Boston will get treated here.

[Pelicanidae]

So, even worst case, you downside is a top-5 pick to go along with Pels own pick and the upside is Zion + Pels pick (Coby?).

Why do it? If you don't believe the Knicks will trade you Zion in a deal for Davis and you are willing to roll the dice to try and get him. I think you'd also have to like the Knicks young players. I think you'd also have to have real concerns about the Celtics offering Tatum.

It's certainly a roll of the dice but you've hedged your downside pretty effectively with two pics in the top 6 + Knicks future picks + 3 prospects from Knicks roster. Upside is Zion, Coby, Knox, Robinson, Smith, Jr. and a pretty good jumpstart on our rebuild.

Serious question, in what universe do the Pels pick Coby White with a top 7 pick? And how can I get out of that universe and go to somewhere better?

[new city champ]

Dissing Coby!

Just an option, though I think you're underrating him. But that's a different thread...

[Pelicanidae]

Dissing Coby!

Just an option, though I think you're underrating him. But that's a different thread...

As a more serious answer though, I'm not a fan of the idea. I do see that there are upsides to it (there is a chance, however miniscule, that the Knicks don't trade the pick if they get #1: in this case, they have no choice and it's done already, for example), but there are also massive downsides: what if the Knicks pick falls to #5 and whoever jumps up to #1 WOULD have been willing to trade with us, but can't now? Then we've essentially traded Zion Williamson for Cam Reddish*. That's a bad swap. It also prevents the Celtics from getting in on things, and as much as I don't think the Celtics have the undisputed best package, we'd be silly not to even give them a chance to make their case, especially in the scenario that has the Knicks picking at #4 or lower.

It's safer, sure, because we have a deal locked in and we know what we'll be getting, but it still contains SOME risk because we don't know what the pick would be, and that's a problem. If the pick ends up at #1, it's a steal. If the pick ends up at #5, it's a horrible trade. And this is the kind of move where you don't take coin-flip chances. Wait until after the lottery when you can bargain properly and know what you're getting.


*I don't actually think Reddish will get picked at #5, it was just an example of how bad it could be.

[PELICANSFAN]

I think you'd also have to like the Knicks young players.

That would be huge. Who would they like that much from the Knicks? Robinson? Knox has been unimpressive.

[Pelicanidae]

That would be huge. Who would they like that much from the Knicks? Robinson? Knox has been unimpressive.

I do love Robinson though. I think he's got huge upside. Best case scenario for him is Rudy Gobert.

[new city champ]

Like Robinson as well. Knox is a 19-year-old on a bad team who has been allowed to be something of a volume shooter. Still he's 35% from behind the arc and has flashed a nice all around game as a one-and-done rookie. His overall FG % has been bad though. I think you'd also want to grab DSJ, if for nothing other than trade bait down the road. He's only 21 and also has good upside potential.

I'm with you in that if I was the Knicks I'd trade Zion in a deal to get Davis. I just have concerns that Knicks won't want to part with that marketing bonanza if they get him + it feels more and more like Kyrie is going to bolt which may pull Tatum out of any deal with Celts. Considering hedges to keep from getting caught in a cross wash...

[msusousaphone]

I could see Dallas trading Zion for AD. Cuban likes to win, now. Cuban likes to win now and ge likes the sure things. I think it's like a 60/40 they keep Zion but it is certainly reasonable enough to keep them in a thread discussion.

I highly doubt we trade for lotto balls. Like Mythrol said, there's enough teams who might be interested where we will wait to see who lands where before trading.

Knox. Wow. His stock dropped so fast.

And yes, the Knicks would absolutely choose AD over Zion if they land the superstars.

If Kyrie bolts to NYK, Boston would want to get AD not just to have him but also to prevent an Eastern conference team from becoming the next superpower. I think Tatum stays on the table for that reason. I've been beating this drum to death but teams are not just lining up to get AD, they also want to insure rivals don't get him.

[Pelicanidae]

True about Cuban, I didn't actually think of that. I've been just working on the premise of a sensible rebuild, but Cuban (who is always trying to make The Big Move, like you say) could easily think that after a year, Doncic is way ahead of schedule and try to fast-forward the rebuild by trading for AD. It's not impossible.

Edit: Just want to add that I do personally think Doncic + AD is a playoff duo in the West. Bottom tier, sure, like 8th or 7th seed, but still.

[Tinman]

I've asked this before, but I'll resubmit the question as we move toward the end of the season:

Would you consider making a deal with the Knicks for Davis BEFORE the draft lottery is announced? In that scenario you'd get your preferred basket of players (Knox, et al) + 3 picks, one of which would be the first rounder this year.

In doing this deal you would assume the risk of NY's pick. It was a 14% chance of being number one overall and a better than 50% chance of being top three. I believe it cannot fall out of the top five or six.

So, even worst case, you downside is a top-5 pick to go along with Pels own pick and the upside is Zion + Pels pick (Coby?).

Why do it? If you don't believe the Knicks will trade you Zion in a deal for Davis and you are willing to roll the dice to try and get him. I think you'd also have to like the Knicks young players. I think you'd also have to have real concerns about the Celtics offering Tatum.

It's certainly a roll of the dice but you've hedged your downside pretty effectively with two pics in the top 6 + Knicks future picks + 3 prospects from Knicks roster. Upside is Zion, Coby, Knox, Robinson, Smith, Jr. and a pretty good jumpstart on our rebuild.

No

[tacosman]

Whoever gets the #1 pick will take Zion... if for nothing else he'll sell tickets. They're not trading the pick but its fun to dream.

this.....

this forum continues to run with these fantasies of us somehow getting zion. Zion williamson at this moment is the single most valuable commodity in the entire nba. That doesnt mean he will be the best player next year(or even close)....but all things considered(salary, hype, marketing, etc) he is the most valuable asset.

whoever wins the lottery is 100% guaranteed to not trade that pick.