Found the stat you're looking for @adaniels33
— Shamit Dua (@FearTheBrown) November 28, 2021
BI's EFG% after amount of dribbles pic.twitter.com/RzFkGWwvq8
November 27th - New Orleans Pelicans @ Utah Jazz - 5-16
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11-28-2021, 03:20 PMragincaucasian
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11-28-2021, 04:30 PMEman5805
That would suggest they aingrsm is much, much better when someone else sets the table for him. That’s clear just from watching. He’s not quick enough to get space without being clever.
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11-28-2021, 05:50 PMragincaucasianHe gets himself into impossible predicaments by dribbling down into the paint and then having no idea how to pass out of it. Not a knock on him, it's just not his game and he doesn't have the basketball IQ or self awareness to just NOT DO THAT.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eman5805
Like dude...just do what you are good at. Movement behind screens, catch and shoot midrange and 3's. Thats it. Not a facilitator, not a ball handler. He should not ever be putting the ball on the floor, ever.
It's on the coaching staff to amplify his strength and minimize his weaknesses, and I haven't seen much of that from them. -
11-28-2021, 08:10 PMluckyman
All player's shooting will go down with increased dribbles. The more you dribble the more the defense can bring help. And more likely you'll be shooting off balance or rushed. There will be precious few players who's shooting goes up the harder they have to work for their shot.
And I don't know if anyone is paying any attention to anything else, but lots of wings are struggling with their shot.
Jayson Tatum is shooting even worse than BI and just turned in a 2 -16 night, yet Boston still won. Last time the Pelicans played the Clips, Paul George was 8 - 26. Before their game tonight his last two games were 7 - 23 and 5 - 19.
I already mentioned Khris Middleton is not looking like himself this year with a 42/33/85 shooting split.
The league is allowing more hand checking and bumps this year and are swallowing their whistles. So if I see BI go 8 - 22 and the Pelicans still win, I'm not going to birch about it. That seems fairly common in the league this year.
BI has blown by many defenders, right there on screen for all to see, yet you still have people claiming he's too slow? What are you looking at? That ain't it.
It's still early and lots of players are still adjusting to this new NBA. And Zion coming back in the next few weeks should also help scatter the defense. -
11-29-2021, 08:29 AMEman5805
Yeah. But Ingram is slow. That is right there for all to see. He blows by people who over commit and he uses big honking strides to get in front of them. I.e. being clever. There's no shame in it. We can't all be freaks of nature.
I don't care about his shot volume. Someone has gotta take them. -
11-29-2021, 10:16 AMHerbJonesFanDidn't watch a lot of Ingram before this year, but my comp for him is a bigger version of D'Angelo Russell. He will score points, make plays for others every once in a while. But he doesnt make your team much better. Below average defense. Not high effort at any time other than when he is trying to get his own shot. Not using his length to get boards. He will always get his points, and he has skill of course. But he cant carry a bad roster and he honestly doesnt make a good roster great or a great roster elite. He gets his team empty points and little to nothing else. Bigger D'Angelo RussellQuote:
Originally Posted by Eman5805
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11-29-2021, 10:23 AMml waveYou didn't watch a lot of Ingram, yet you have detailed analysis of D'Angelo Russell? Curious!Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbJonesFan
Anecdotally, I've seen BI get some out of position rebounds this year that I haven't noticed before. I agree with you that with his length he should be rebounding, hopefully that is something that sticks. -
11-29-2021, 03:21 PMHerbJonesFanHonestly, I don't think I even saw 5 Pelicans games before this year. But I have seen a lot of Russell, mostly in LA and Brooklyn. I don't both watching Timberwolves games. But yeah, he is the first person that came to mind as I started watching Ingram. Mostly because I never really notice him throughout the game unless he is messing up, but then at the end of the game he has like 20 or 25 points and I am surprised by that because he felt so inconsequentialQuote:
Originally Posted by ml wave
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11-29-2021, 04:01 PMWowowowowWhat was your opinion of Zach Lavine his first year as a Bull?Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbJonesFan
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11-29-2021, 05:21 PMluckymanExcept this isn't true at all. The NBA is not college. Most if not all NBA players have to be clever. Especially the ones that have to deal with multiple defenders and walls.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eman5805
Hardly no NBA player will just blow by an NBA defender in a straight line unless it's a big center. Especially when we are talking about 6'7"+ wings.
Even Zion uses his wide body and leverage to get his shot off, which still gets blocked a few times per game.
Ingram isn't a slow player and his blow bys are legit. He's not like Malcolm Brogdon.
It's like Ingram is the basketball version of Jamies Winston or Aaron Brooks in these parts. So wierd. -
11-29-2021, 06:02 PMEman5805Why is there even an argument? Clearly you’re agreeing with me. Ingram doesn’t have a quick first step. He has a long one. He can cover ground well as he’s not unathletic. He isn’t twitchy at all. Relatively slow foot speed. But smooth and coordinated. Sometimes struggles turning that corner if his long strides don’t compensate. These were knocks out of college.Quote:
Originally Posted by luckyman
Dude is a very good player. But the less he needs to create the better. Moments like the first Utah game were optimal. Made the right play in the moment. -
11-29-2021, 07:47 PMHerbJonesFanThat he was empty calories but super explosive. So, there was room for growth. Ingram is a limited athlete so the ceiling is lower. Lavine was like a 10 athlete with 6 skill and now he made that skill a 9, so he is awesome. Ingram is like a 6 athlete with 8.5 skill. You don't become a better athlete. Sure, he can get the skill to a 9 or maybe in a dream world a 9.5, but there is no world where he can improve as much from age 22 to 25 like LaVine did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowowowow
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11-30-2021, 11:01 AMml waveIn LA only his rookie year, because his second year Ingram was also on the team...then weirdly back on the D'Angelo Russell scouting train when he went to Brooklyn? Very unusual NBA viewing habits!Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbJonesFan
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11-30-2021, 11:35 AMFuncrusherthere is no such thing as empty calories in the NBA, barring just stat padding, which players do. Your description of Ingram could be applied to Demar Derozan and it would read like a common take of the past decade. But obviously Demar has bloomed as a player even later than one might expect, and he's done it largely just improving on the things he's already good at. That's the template for Ingram, and there's more to him than just "athleticism" and "skill" layed out in abstract terms. No he's not suddenly going to become a world class athlete, but he doesn't have to. As long as he continues to grow in his strength areas (shooting, passing, handle) and even in some swing areas, (decision makeing) etc. he can reach a reasonably high ceiling, and it's not as though he hasn't already set that precedent in his career beforeQuote:
Originally Posted by HerbJonesFan