Ingram got the KIA most Improved Player Award

Well deserved. Just announced on TNT. Well deserved.

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Originally Posted by 13 - 3

Well deserved. Just announced on TNT. Well deserved.

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I saw that. Congratulations to him; it is an award that is well-deserved.

Did I not call this!? Literally got attacked for thinking Ingram would be better than “trash” and turn into a decent NBA player. Bright future ahead for this kid and our team!! Well deserved BI!!

Yea I got attacked by about 3 posters in particular for expressing how good Ingram would be. At least one was willing to admit how wrong he was.

This is why you can't assess value based on analytics alone. Or think you're some kind of expert in evaluating talent, while devaluing the opinions of others based purely on analytics.

it was a hand full of us that said ingram would be good for us....you have to use the eye test in some evaluating over the stats because stats tell half truths.......i think 2 other posters and myself were the only posters who stood on that ledge and said ingram would ave 20pts for us......

congrats to the big dawg for making that jump and earning the award....

on a side note....i knew guardianangel and nichols would be on this thread not letting posters forget lol......im with yall....

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Originally Posted by 6warddude

it was a hand full of us that said ingram would be good for us....you have to use the eye test in some evaluating over the stats because stats tell half truths.......i think 2 other posters and myself were the only posters who stood on that ledge and said ingram would ave 20pts for us......

congrats to the big dawg for making that jump and earning the award....

on a side note....i knew guardianangel and nichols would be on this thread not letting posters forget lol......im with yall....

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:hihi::2thumb2:

Crazy thing is Ingram is only 1 year older than Trey Young.

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Originally Posted by Nichols

Yea I got attacked by about 3 posters in particular for expressing how good Ingram would be. At least one was willing to admit how wrong he was.

This is why you can't assess value based on analytics alone. Or think you're some kind of expert in evaluating talent, while devaluing the opinions of others based purely on analytics.

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Originally Posted by 6warddude

it was a hand full of us that said ingram would be good for us....you have to use the eye test in some evaluating over the stats because stats tell half truths.......i think 2 other posters and myself were the only posters who stood on that ledge and said ingram would ave 20pts for us......

congrats to the big dawg for making that jump and earning the award....

on a side note....i knew guardianangel and nichols would be on this thread not letting posters forget lol......im with yall....

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Haha you 2 helped me not feel alone on the Ingram island. Not only was it a handful that said he would simply be a good NBA player it was a handful that didn’t consider him trash and nothing more at 20 years old. I’m happy he proved us right but more importantly we have a star player for the future that is just tapping into his potential. Anybody that actually watched and followed this kid knew the potential he had being right on the brink of breaking out. I can’t wait to see these young guys develop!

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Originally Posted by GuardianAngel25

Haha you 2 helped me not feel alone on the Ingram island. Not only was it a handful that said he would simply be a good NBA player it was a handful that didn’t consider him trash and nothing more at 20 years old. I’m happy he proved us right but more importantly we have a star player for the future that is just tapping into his potential. Anybody that actually watched and followed this kid knew the potential he had being right on the brink of breaking out. I can’t wait to see these young guys develop!

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:thumbup:

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Originally Posted by GuardianAngel25

Haha you 2 helped me not feel alone on the Ingram island. Not only was it a handful that said he would simply be a good NBA player it was a handful that didn’t consider him trash and nothing more at 20 years old. I’m happy he proved us right but more importantly we have a star player for the future that is just tapping into his potential. Anybody that actually watched and followed this kid knew the potential he had being right on the brink of breaking out. I can’t wait to see these young guys develop!

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I was also on the Ingram train and had to "debate" the fact that he would be a good shooter.

I'll go even further. He puts on about 10 - 15 more lbs, he'll be a better player than Anthony Davis.

Congrats! Very happy for him.

Much deserved. There's a significant drop off, but he's starting to live up to the Durant comparison.

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Originally Posted by luckyman

I was also on the Ingram train and had to "debate" the fact that he would be a good shooter.

I'll go even further. He puts on about 10 - 15 more lbs, he'll be a better player than Anthony Davis.

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I completely agree. In today’s NBA I think Ingram is a more valuable player because of his ability to create for himself at all times and having the ability to create for others. As Ingram gets older I think he will naturally put on 10 lbs which is enough for me. Most importantly is he continues to get stronger. The weight and strength will do wonders for him when driving in the paint allowing him to take on the contact better and now getting moved so far off of his spot. The surgery he went through and time off he was forced to take with no activities whatsoever hurt him in this area. Ingram and Zion alone is a duo you build a team around. Lucky for us is we have a lot of great pieces already to go with these guys. On youth alone we lost 10+ games last year we should have won. This team is a lot better then our record showed and I could easily see us making a jump into the 50+ win team group in the next year or 2.

Congrats to BI. I was skeptical of him and not going to lie I wanted Tatum but once Lakers got 4th pick I figured it was a forgone conclusion. Glad to be proven wrong.

Lonzo should have got the award.

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Originally Posted by Lonzo4MVP

Lonzo should have got the award.

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No Lonzo will win the MVP....MIP is too small of a challenge.

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Originally Posted by 13 - 3

Well deserved. Just announced on TNT. Well deserved.

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Well deserved :clap:

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

No Lonzo will win the MVP....MIP is too small of a challenge.

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He won't be getting MVP on a squad that has Zion and Ingram on it..

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Originally Posted by luckyman

I'll go even further. He puts on about 10 - 15 more lbs, he'll be a better player than Anthony Davis.

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I've had to admit this year that I was wrong about Ingram: he took a huge step forward that I didn't think he was likely to take at all, and I'm happy to have been wrong.

But come on, really?

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

I've had to admit this year that I was wrong about Ingram: he took a huge step forward that I didn't think he was likely to take at all, and I'm happy to have been wrong.

But come on, really?

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Yes

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Originally Posted by luckyman

Yes

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Just out of curiosity, where did you rank Ingram overall this year, roughly? Top 20 player? Top 30? 40?

Dunno...haven't worked out any list.

Ill guesstimate top 30.

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Originally Posted by luckyman

Dunno...haven't worked out any list.

Ill guesstimate top 30.

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Okay. I would probably say top 40 but yeah the evaluations aren't too far off for us there. Just wondering.

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Originally Posted by 13 - 3

Well deserved. Just announced on TNT. Well deserved.

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I LIKE BI A LOT BUT WE CAN NOT OVER PAY HIM. 25,000,000 - 28,000,000 AYEAR NO MORE!!! IF NEW YORK PAY HIM MORE BYE BYE!!!

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Just out of curiosity, where did you rank Ingram overall this year, roughly? Top 20 player? Top 30? 40?

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TOP 30!!! HE DID MAKE THE ALL STAR TEAM!!! BUT SMALL FORWARD TOP 6 OR 8

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Originally Posted by dmarrero

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I LIKE BI A LOT BUT WE CAN NOT OVER PAY HIM. 25,000,000 - 28,000,000 AYEAR NO MORE!!! IF NEW YORK PAY HIM MORE BYE BYE!!!

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He will get a max deal that is estimated to be in the 5 year/$158 million range if the cap stays the same. Starts around $27 million in the first year.

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Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

He will get a max deal that is estimated to be in the 5 year/$158 million range if the cap stays the same. Starts around $27 million in the first year.

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If I remember correctly, his deal could span anywhere from 4 yrs/$124m to 5yrs/$201m depending on a variety of factors (for the largest possible figure, he would have to make an All-NBA team to trigger the Rose Rule).

The difference there is so huge that it totally changes the entire conversation. His highest paid year on the 4yr/$124m deal (which is a 4 year 25% max with 5% annual increases) would be $33.5m in 2023-24. That's a lot, but it's a totally understandable price for a player who will be 26 or 27 at the time, and will probably be around a 25ppg scorer on strong efficiency in todays NBA.

By comparison, his highest paid year on the 5yr/$201m deal (a 5 year, 30% max with 8% increases) is something like $46m in 2024-25. That's insane that's so much money. That's top 5 or 10 player in the NBA money. I'd feel a lot less comfortable giving him that kind of paycheque.

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Originally Posted by dmarrero

TOP 30!!! HE DID MAKE THE ALL STAR TEAM!!! BUT SMALL FORWARD TOP 6 OR 8

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I would easily put him in the top 6 and I don’t think anybody can argue him being outside of that. For me he is in my top 4. Go look at the guys who are ahead of him and they are all 30+ years old. Ingram is 22 and the future of the SF position in the NBA. By the time he is 25 he should be the best SF in the NBA. I think in the next 2 seasons he can jump into the top 3 passing up Butler. Lebron, Kawhi, Butler, Ingram, Tatum, and Middleton are my top 6. There is nobody after the top 6 who is on Ingrams level. Personally I’m putting Ingram over Middleton especially on who I would want going forward. Lebron 35 y/o, Kawhi 29 y/o, Butler 30 y/o, Middleton 29 y/o, and Ingram who just turned 23 y/o.

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Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

He will get a max deal that is estimated to be in the 5 year/$158 million range if the cap stays the same. Starts around $27 million in the first year.

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He’s worth every bit of it and more if that’s what his max calls for. When you look at other players who have gotten the max he is definitely deserving of it. He is now an all star at 22 years old and literally just tapped into his potential. People forget he is coming off of an off-season where he wasn’t even allowed to jog much less work on his game and continue where he left off with the Lakers. He defied most people expectations and had one of the best seasons of any wing in the NBA. Not only is he to be paid for what he has shown but what he is expected to show as well. That is no question a max. People get so hung up in what a max salary was 5 years ago and don’t take into consideration how much the salaries have jumped up. The numbers sound scary but they are no different then when the max was 20 million and still account for the same % of the cap.

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Originally Posted by luckyman

Dunno...haven't worked out any list.

Ill guesstimate top 30.

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He’s is definitely in the top 30. Top 40 is an insult. Very good case of putting him in the top 20. When you factor in age he is probably in the top 15 players to build a team around.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

If I remember correctly, his deal could span anywhere from 4 yrs/$124m to 5yrs/$201m depending on a variety of factors (for the largest possible figure, he would have to make an All-NBA team to trigger the Rose Rule).

The difference there is so huge that it totally changes the entire conversation. His highest paid year on the 4yr/$124m deal (which is a 4 year 25% max with 5% annual increases) would be $33.5m in 2023-24. That's a lot, but it's a totally understandable price for a player who will be 26 or 27 at the time, and will probably be around a 25ppg scorer on strong efficiency in todays NBA.

By comparison, his highest paid year on the 5yr/$201m deal (a 5 year, 30% max with 8% increases) is something like $46m in 2024-25. That's insane that's so much money. That's top 5 or 10 player in the NBA money. I'd feel a lot less comfortable giving him that kind of paycheque.

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5 years from now, that actually won't be what top 5 or 10 players will be making. Considering how players of lesser value are getting paid.

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Originally Posted by Nichols

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5 years from now, that actually won't be what top 5 or 10 players will be making. Considering how players of lesser value are getting paid.

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It's true that the exact numbers of the deals will be slightly different in a couple of years but I think it's unlikely for the salary cap to grow enough in the next 4 or 5 years to stop $45m in a season from being a gargantuan paycheque.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

It's true that the exact numbers of the deals will be slightly different in a couple of years but I think it's unlikely for the salary cap to grow enough in the next 4 or 5 years to stop $45m in a season from being a gargantuan paycheque.

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Oh it most definitely is gargantuan lol.. But I guess I'm just saying it probably won't seem as substantial in 5 years in relation to what everyone else is making.