Pelicans 240

Assuming its Temple out and EJ gets that 15th roster spot, what do you guys have for the 240 when everyone is healthy? I will go first:

BI - 33
Herb - 32
CJ - 32
Zion - 32
Jonas - 28
Nance - 21
Trey - 19
Jose - 16
Hayes - 15
Graham - 12

Next in line: Naji, then Kira, then Daniels, then EJ, then Willy

I think Graham gets some token minutes to see if he can build back his value and play well in a limited role with just catch and shoot looks. If he can't hang, Naji, Kira, and Daniels get a crack at it. And, by the end of the season, Daniels could just straight up swipe those minutes.

Where the team appears vulnerable is if CJ goes down and you gotta soak up his minutes with either small guards or guys who cant shoot. If I had to make a deal, it would be taking Hayes and Graham and getting Burks or Beasley. Trey can eat up more backup 4 minutes, and/or you can let EJ play as a 10th man. That would be my move, if it was available.

Generally agree, though I think Daniels will hop over Kira in the pecking order largely because I don't think Kira will be ready to play until January-ish and Devonte' will prove himself unsatisfactory pretty early.

On the back up to CJ front, Is there any worth in returning Josh Hart to the fold under the MLE? Or did I miss the part where we don’t have the full one?

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

On the back up to CJ front, Is there any worth in returning Josh Hart to the fold under the MLE? Or did I miss the part where we don’t have the full one?

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Why would you, would be my question? I know he's technically the right size to be a CJ replacement but we all know he plays more like a 3 or a 4, and I wouldn't want him cutting into minutes for Herb, Trey, or even potentially roadblocking Daniels.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Why would you, would be my question? I know he's technically the right size to be a CJ replacement but we all know he plays more like a 3 or a 4, and I wouldn't want him cutting into minutes for Herb, Trey, or even potentially roadblocking Daniels.

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It's more of an esoteric, the team doesn't feel whole without Hart, type situation

Stop with the Hart stuff. He was nice but his time here is done and he wants to get his money, as he should. Wish him well elsewhere, we just got a much higher upside Hart in Daniels

As for Kira, team actually thinks he will be ready by camp. His rehab has gone well

Did this a few days ago

BI: 34
CJ: 33
Zion: 32
Herb: 32
JV: 28
Trey: 22
Nance: 20
Jose: 17
Jax: 12
Devonte: 10

The only other thing I want the team to do this offseason is trade Jax. Just dont want him taking up minutes, coaches time at practice, etc. We know what we have and he doesnt fit in the long term plans. We ideally trade him and Temple for 1 guy.

I'm just ready to see this team with all its pieces start playing together. With the depth of this team I doubt they rush Kira back (even if he is healthy) so I could see Daniels taking some of his minutes early on.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Stop with the Hart stuff. He was nice but his time here is done and he wants to get his money, as he should. Wish him well elsewhere, we just got a much higher upside Hart in Daniels

As for Kira, team actually thinks he will be ready by camp. His rehab has gone well

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Agree that he should secure the bag, but emotions play a massive part in sportsball and sportsball fandom

You're not gonna change my mind :)

Mac, will Kira be available for Summer league?

Unlikely. Too early to put him into real action, but they think he will be ready for camp and still think he can be an important piece long term. Hasn’t been written off, short or long term

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Originally Posted by AusPel

Agree that he should secure the bag, but emotions play a massive part in sportsball and sportsball fandom

You're not gonna change my mind :)

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You can want what you want. You can want KD here. I am just here to tell you reality

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Unlikely. Too early to put him into real action, but they think he will be ready for camp and still think he can be an important piece long term. Hasn’t been written off, short or long term

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I'm sure this has got you excited with all those cards locked up in a safe somewhere :D

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

You can want what you want. You can want KD here. I am just here to tell you reality

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I'm not stupid, I don't realistically see a path where we re-acquire Hart

But to dream is to be human

How do we open up a roster spot for EJ?

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Originally Posted by Upper Decker

How do we open up a roster spot for EJ?

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Through the magic of trades

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Originally Posted by AusPel

Through the magic of trades

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Sure. But how would that work with salaries? If we send out Graham, don't we have to get a guy back with a similar salary. Then we're back in the same place - with 15 guys!

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Originally Posted by AusPel

I'm not stupid, I don't realistically see a path where we re-acquire Hart

But to dream is to be human

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''A man's reach should exceed his grasp''

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Originally Posted by Upper Decker

Sure. But how would that work with salaries? If we send out Graham, don't we have to get a guy back with a similar salary. Then we're back in the same place - with 15 guys!

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You can theoretically just dump a guy into open space, though I'm not sure which teams have the spare cash or who would take him rn

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Originally Posted by Upper Decker

Sure. But how would that work with salaries? If we send out Graham, don't we have to get a guy back with a similar salary. Then we're back in the same place - with 15 guys!

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Unless you can send to a team with the capacity to absorb

It is gonna be tough. But as Mac said, eat Temple's contract to open a spot. Maybe eat Billy's

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Originally Posted by Upper Decker

Sure. But how would that work with salaries? If we send out Graham, don't we have to get a guy back with a similar salary. Then we're back in the same place - with 15 guys!

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You can’t just dump Graham. He would cost assets to get off. Most likely is a Temple dump or waive, followed by Jax

Other option is to sign EJ to a two way now, knowing you will sign him to a real contract at the end of the year a la Jose

Don’t need to do it all today

I'm guessing you can't waive guys with greater than 1 guaranteed years left on their deal

Actually stretch and waive, forgot about that

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

You can’t just dump Graham. He would cost assets to get off. Most likely is a Temple dump or waive, followed by Jax

Other option is to sign EJ to a two way now, knowing you will sign him to a real contract at the end of the year a la Jose

Don’t need to do it all today

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I was going to ask what the plan would be if we couldn't find anyone to give Graham, Temple, or Hayes to. Seems a Temple waive is the cleanest way to handle it. What I don't want is to have to give up a future first just to get off of one of those guys.

What I'd be more open to is using a future first to flip Graham and Temple into a useful role player.

They wouldn’t. Like I said, at worst you can just sign EJ a two way for now with an agreement with hat you will take care of him as soon as you clear a roster spot. There is no ticking clock here

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Originally Posted by DarkHornet

I was going to ask what the plan would be if we couldn't find anyone to give Graham, Temple, or Hayes to. Seems a Temple waive is the cleanest way to handle it. What I don't want is to have to give up a future first just to get off of one of those guys.
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Dude, we're not the Knicks

*thanks God*

I'd still like to bring in another experienced guard that can shoot and play atleast decent defense, but I guess we'd have go move Jax in order to do that.

I'm guessing if EJ looks good early on, we'll move Jaxson at the deadline and EJ will take those minutes moving forward. Will be nice to have a stretch big that can play defense. I'm still shocked he was available at 41. I was wanting to trade back into the late first to get him in.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

They wouldn?t. Like I said, at worst you can just sign EJ a two way for now with an agreement with hat you will take care of him as soon as you clear a roster spot. There is no ticking clock here

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And all he's got to do is look at Jose to know we'll keep our word.

Really hope we can dial back Jonas usage, because I'm really afraid he's going to start breaking down at an exponential rate sooner than later. I rather bite the bullet and dump Hayes for 5 in FA as our sole move. Someone that can keep the ship afloat if he goes down for the season.

I think Temple and Willie stay. A roster isn't going to be 15 hungry players all fighting for minutes...it needs an old vet or two at the end happy to just be there. So I think we end up seeing Graham and Kira shipped out....maybe Hayes.

I also think Dyson will get in sooner than expected because CJ and BI can stand to take some games off and he's the perfect prototype to fill in for them once he's game ready. I wouldn't be surprised to see him getting playing time early on and healthy minutes 40 games in.

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Originally Posted by Taker597

Really hope we can dial back Jonas usage, because I'm really afraid he's going to start breaking down at an exponential rate sooner than later. I rather bite the bullet and dump Hayes for 5 in FA as our sole move. Someone that can keep the ship afloat if he goes down for the season.

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I think the hope should be that he plays under 30 minutes a night, as the central priority. With Zion back and knowing that both he and Nance and function as Cs in small-ball units, especially against bench units, that should be very plausible even if we move Jax. If we keep Jax then of course there's him there. If we need another guy I'd really rather we experiment a bit with EJ in PJ Tucker-ish situations than give them to Hernangomez but I'm partly resigned to Green at least trying the vet first.

Plus, I see this team as being able to (assuming good health from everyone) really gun for 50 wins. In that case, I wouldn't be surprised if guys like JV could sit a few games towards the end of the season.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

I think the hope should be that he plays under 30 minutes a night, as the central priority. With Zion back and knowing that both he and Nance and function as Cs in small-ball units, especially against bench units, that should be very plausible even if we move Jax. If we keep Jax then of course there's him there. If we need another guy I'd really rather we experiment a bit with EJ in PJ Tucker-ish situations than give them to Hernangomez but I'm partly resigned to Green at least trying the vet first.

Plus, I see this team as being able to (assuming good health from everyone) really gun for 50 wins. In that case, I wouldn't be surprised if guys like JV could sit a few games towards the end of the season.

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I'm glad I'm not the only one concerned about running Jonas into the ground. At time he was looking straight gassed and pushing himself hard in the 4th quarter playing 35-38 minute games carrying a lot of scoring and rebound responsibility. A year older don't make it easier and playing gassed is such a big injury risk.

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Originally Posted by Taker597

I'm glad I'm not the only one concerned about running Jonas into the ground. At time he was looking straight gassed and pushing himself hard in the 4th quarter playing 35-38 minute games carrying a lot of scoring and rebound responsibility. A year older don't make it easier and playing gassed is such a big injury risk.

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I have a fair amount of trust in Green to be reasonable with minutes. Last season our leading guy in MPG was Ingram and he only played 34 mpg through the regular season, which isn't at all excessive for a star player. If we can keep that 34 minute area as the highest minutes getter on the team this year and potentially give some guys games off towards the end of the year, I'd be feeling comfortable there.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

You can?t just dump Graham. He would cost assets to get off. Most likely is a Temple dump or waive, followed by Jax

Other option is to sign EJ to a two way now, knowing you will sign him to a real contract at the end of the year a la Jose

Don?t need to do it all today

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I read somewhere that they signed the 2nd two way to 5'10" Harper from last season. Not sure if true, but I guess he could be waived also.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

They wouldn?t. Like I said, at worst you can just sign EJ a two way for now with an agreement with hat you will take care of him as soon as you clear a roster spot. There is no ticking clock here

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Do you know how high they are on EJ?

So Mac, do you still think there isn't even a 1% chance this team wins a title in the next 3-4 years?
Providing Zion doesn't jump ship before then.

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

So Mac, do you still think there isn't even a 1% chance this team wins a title in the next 3-4 years?
Providing Zion doesn't jump ship before then.

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The odds of any team winning a championship in any year are sub-30% imo, even if they're a top tier team. Even if they won the chip the year before.

My personal view is that we have more than a 1% chance, but I certainly wouldn't bet on it happening. Even great teams can just never quite get there, and as promising as we are on paper right now we haven't actually seen this team play a single game.

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

So Mac, do you still think there isn't even a 1% chance this team wins a title in the next 3-4 years?
Providing Zion doesn't jump ship before then.

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I remember in the past, he said we had 0% chance of a title

Man, I really like Kira and thinks he has more of a future on this team than most think. He's only played 78 games and before the draft, he was the youngest player on the team. In a perfect world, I'd love to trade Graham and give his minutes to Kira.

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

So Mac, do you still think there isn't even a 1% chance this team wins a title in the next 3-4 years?
Providing Zion doesn't jump ship before then.

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Correct. I do not believe there is even a 1 percent chance. But who cares what I believe? If you do believe, ride that until the wheels fall off. Believe away. Who cares what I think?

For the start of the season :

BI - 33
Herb - 32
CJ - 32
Zion - 30
Jonas - 28
Nance - 21
Trey - 21
Jose - 16
Hayes - 15
Graham - 12

As the season move forward, I would anticipate either Kira or Daniels to take Graham's minutes away and may be decrease CJ's a bit to keep him fresh for playoffs. Also depending on his performance but Trey could take some minutes from Hayes and Nance to reach up to 28 per game.

It's very tricky to predict right now because training camp could be full of surprise since it's possible that one of the rookie outperfom veterans. The combination in 5vs5 should be wildly entertaining for the coaching staff. They have the opportunity to use as opponent a very good defensive team at any time and even unleash a crazy one with Jose/Daniels/Marshall/Herb/Nance(or TM3 or Marshall or even Lidell) just for the sake of testing offensive set against a top notch defensive team.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Correct. I do not believe there is even a 1 percent chance. But who cares what I believe? If you do believe, ride that until the wheels fall off. Believe away. Who cares what I think?

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Because you are cool

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

So Mac, do you still think there isn't even a 1% chance this team wins a title in the next 3-4 years?
Providing Zion doesn't jump ship before then.

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If it makes us all feel better, I seriously doubt MM really believes the Pels have less than a 1% chance to win a title, in the next 3-4 years. It just goes against what the "numbers" would say. If anything, seems to me, from what little time I've been here, that MM is a classic over-thinker...and any highly intellijent over-thinker, which I assume MM is...wouldn't throw that <1% number out there...unless it was just a spur of the moment comment. Probably didn't give it his normal "over-thinking" analysis. So, let's get fired up...we've got a much better than 1% chance to win it all in the next 3-4 years. (More like a 7.2% or so chance...according to THIS highly intellijent over-thinker)

If it makes you all feel better, I would give Memphis, Minny, Detroit, and many other teams a 0 percent chance in the next 5 years. All very good teams, with very good players and perceived bright futures. I just dont believe that many new teams will crash the party. Money, markets, and other intangibles will rule the day and you need to get 1-in-a-million lucky like the Bucks did with Giannis to win one in a small market. Now, if the Pels get another top 3-5 pick next year, I am willing to consider bumping it up to 3%. Get #1 next year, and I will bump it up to 100%

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

If it makes you all feel better, I would give Memphis, Minny, Detroit, and many other teams a 0 percent chance in the next 5 years. All very good teams, with very good players and perceived bright futures. I just dont believe that many new teams will crash the party. Money, markets, and other intangibles will rule the day and you need to get 1-in-a-million lucky like the Bucks did with Giannis to win one in a small market. Now, if the Pels get another top 3-5 pick next year, I am willing to consider bumping it up to 3%. Get #1 next year, and I will bump it up to 100%

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Sadly, I'm content with my 7.2%. Above all else, I'm just a numbers guy. I just plug the numbers in...and see what comes out. I try not to let my own personal hopes & prayers affect my bottom line opinion.

Speaking on not winning a championship, I don’t think it’s that big a deal to not win one. Let’s enjoy having a good team that the city can get behind and vice Versa. Enjoy the moment and let the good times roll.

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Originally Posted by coreylaron

Speaking on not winning a championship, I don’t think it’s that big a deal to not win one. Let’s enjoy having a good team that the city can get behind and vice Versa. Enjoy the moment and let the good times roll.

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EXACTLY!!!! This is my whole point - not to be a debbie downer, but basically to say that once you eliminate that goal of winning a championship from your mind, then you can enjoy the other steps more. Winning 55 games and going deep in the second round means you went something like 62-32 that year. Almost 2 out of every 3 times your team played, you left super happy. You left super optimistic about what they could be/do. You loved the fight and hustle. And heck, probably even loved how they played in 15 of the 32 losses and just felt they got robbed or unlucky.

Thats a lot of joy, fun, and happiness produced. Take joy in the journey, not just the ultimate destination

As someone who grew up in Louisiana but not New Orleans and recently moved to the city, I underestimated how fun it is to live in the same city as your favorite sports team. Always been a Pelicans and Saints fan but it was the community around the team and a shared love that was fun. I would love a title but I would much rather be what the Grizzlies have been the last 10-15 years than what the Lakers have been the last 8.

Winning a championship is like a trade proposal, sure it COULD happen. Odds are there's almost no shot.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

EXACTLY!!!! This is my whole point - not to be a debbie downer, but basically to say that once you eliminate that goal of winning a championship from your mind, then you can enjoy the other steps more. Winning 55 games and going deep in the second round means you went something like 62-32 that year. Almost 2 out of every 3 times your team played, you left super happy. You left super optimistic about what they could be/do. You loved the fight and hustle. And heck, probably even loved how they played in 15 of the 32 losses and just felt they got robbed or unlucky.

Thats a lot of joy, fun, and happiness produced. Take joy in the journey, not just the ultimate destination

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I want to generally agree here.

I do feel more optimistic than you about us potentially winning a chip (though I do acknowledge fully that its far from guaranteed and even if we're a 'championship calibre' team, there are plenty such teams that never ended up actually winning a chip for one reason or another), but even if we don't that's not the end of the world.

Hypothetically, if this team with the core as currently constructed (Zion + CJ + BI + Herb + Trey + Dyson, for example) all achieve their potential together and over the next 5 years win 50 games a season, make the playoffs every year, and hit the WCF twice, are we disappointed even if there's no championship in that time? Maybe a small bit, but overall no: I'd be very pleased with that stretch. Extremely happy. There would be many good times to be had. Of course a championship is the perfect cherry on top but I don't think it would be worthless without a ring.

If you believe Zion is the next superstar and that he truly is committed to being here and taking his health seriously, which indications are that he is now, then we absolutely have a better than 1% chance.

MM also once said that we would never have a real culture here and that he thought Griff's attempt to build that culture would prove futile, but look what happened.

MM is a smart dude, who provides valuable and interesting info, but some of y'all get too hung up on his opinions. It legit bothers yall when he doesn't agree with you. It's just one fans opinion, nothing more.

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Originally Posted by RUFshreve

If you believe Zion is the next superstar and that he truly is committed to being here and taking his health seriously, which indications are that he is now, then we absolutely have a better than 1% chance.

MM also once said that we would never have a real culture here and that he thought Griff's attempt to build that culture would prove futile, but look what happened.

MM is a smart dude, who provides valuable and interesting info, but some of y'all get too hung up on his opinions. It legit bothers yall when he doesn't agree with you. It's just one fans opinion, nothing more.

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Correct. If you all believe, believe. I will be right, but dont stop believing! :)