BI or Zion: Who do you want the Pelicans to trade for Scoot?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

Jayson Taysom

---

New favourite player, Jayson Taysom

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

New favourite player, Jayson Taysom

---

We have a very popular football player named Taysom Hill. Football training season is in high gear.

Sue me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

That's a misleading and very illogical way to go about it. In a merry go round, which of those team's #1 option would remain so on a different contender??

Is Jayson Taysom a #1 option on the Nuggets, Bucks, Warriors, Sixers, or Lakers? He'd remain so only on the Heat. But you'd have some folk who'd still prefer Jimmy Butler (not me).

Is Jimmy Butler the #1 option on any of those teams outside of maybe the Celtics? And his team that actually made the finals.

Is Steph the #1 option for the Nuggets, Lakers, Bucks, or 76ers?

Also BI has been in the worst situation of anybody on that list. So that really throws off the comps.

He's the one that's on a team still trying to build through the draft and has had his sidekick not play At ALL the last 2 years. How did that work out for Lebron?

When that was the case for Denver, even with a still better roster, how far did Jokic get?

---

Comment wasn't about how FAR they would get. The comment was that BI would be the #1 option on those teams. No he wouldn't.

There's a hierarchy. Giannis would probably be the #1 on any team. Jokic would probably be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks. Tatum may be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks and Nuggets. As you move each step lower, the player would be the #1 on fewer and fewer of those teams. My point still remains, BI would be the #1 on NONE of them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

We have a very popular football player named Taysom Hill. Football training season is in high gear.

Sue me.

---

I just found it funny, don't take it seriously :hihi:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RobertM320

Comment wasn't about how FAR they would get. The comment was that BI would be the #1 option on those teams. No he wouldn't.

There's a hierarchy. Giannis would probably be the #1 on any team. Jokic would probably be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks. Tatum may be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks and Nuggets. As you move each step lower, the player would be the #1 on fewer and fewer of those teams. My point still remains, BI would be the #1 on NONE of them.

---

Jokic > Giannis imo

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Jokic > Giannis imo

---

I'd agree. I didn't pay much attention to who I listed. Was just trying to make the point. BI wouldn't be #1 on any of those teams.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RobertM320

I'd agree. I didn't pay much attention to who I listed. Was just trying to make the point. BI wouldn't be #1 on any of those teams.

---

Yeah I mean, my opinions on BI are well known at this point so I don't have much to add there, just wanted to go on the record with my ''as of right now, Jokic is the best player alive'' take.

I don't believe for a second that a Scoot Henderson trade is dead. Until the 14th pick is made, all bets remain on the table. There is whole lot of posturing going on and apparently, somebody's read. "The Art of the Deal". Walk away and make them call you back to the table.

Lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by As I See It

I don't believe for a second that a Scoot Henderson trade is dead.

---

Quoting from Shamit's latest substack post:

Quote:

---

I expect trade chatter to pick up within the next few days. Teams will be wrapping up their pre-draft workouts, if they have not finished already, and front offices will begin finalizing plans for Thursday night. Expect to hear more concrete details from Charlotte soon.

Speaking of Thursday, I do not expect any potential Henderson deal to be made prior to then. In fact, this may end up being a decision made on the clock.

---

So yeah, no reason to expect the deal to be dead but also no reason to expect any move to happen for at least a few days. Both sides are probably waiting to see how things play out with other deals, see how other teams are reacting to things like the Beal situation, and both the Portland news and the MJ Hornets sale might change things slightly. Gonna be a few days at least.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RobertM320

Comment wasn't about how FAR they would get. The comment was that BI would be the #1 option on those teams. No he wouldn't.

There's a hierarchy. Giannis would probably be the #1 on any team. Jokic would probably be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks. Tatum may be the best player on any of those teams except the Bucks and Nuggets. As you move each step lower, the player would be the #1 on fewer and fewer of those teams. My point still remains, BI would be the #1 on NONE of them.

---

My comment wasn't about haw FAR they would get either. My point on that comment was it's hard to judge when the team you play on has too many issues. Plus BI has barely played himself.

Also, by what logic is the best player not the #1 option?? Not everybody is putting Tatum above players like Steph, Lebron, or Embiid. I'm not. And some may not even put him in front of Butler.

And even if you want to put BI at the back of the list, that still doesn't mean he isn't a #1 option on a contender. It's all relative and today's NBA has many contending worthy teams between each conference.


We just did this a few years ago, and BI has done nothing but prove me right with his play on the court.

All that's going to happen is that will continue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

My comment wasn't about haw FAR they would get either. My point on that comment was it's hard to judge when the team you play on has too many issues. Plus BI has barely played himself.

Also, by what logic is the best player not the #1 option?? Not everybody is putting Tatum above players like Steph, Lebron, or Embiid. I'm not. And some may not even put him in front of Butler.

And even if you want to put BI at the back of the list, that still doesn't mean he isn't a #1 option on a contender. It's all relative and today's NBA has many contending worthy teams between each conference.


We just did this a few years ago, and BI has done nothing but prove me right with his play on the court.

All that's going to happen is that will continue.

---

I listed the top 4 teams in each conference. If you didn't finish in the top four, you WEREN'T a contender. BI would NOT have been the #1 option on any contender this season. To be the #1 option, you're implying that if you replaced that team's CURRENT #1 option with BI, they would be better. That doesn't apply to any of the eight teams.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RobertM320

I listed the top 4 teams in each conference. If you didn't finish in the top four, you WEREN'T a contender. BI would NOT have been the #1 option on any contender this season. To be the #1 option, you're implying that if you replaced that team's CURRENT #1 option with BI, they would be better. That doesn't apply to any of the eight teams.

---

Finishing in the top 4 has never delegated who's a contender and who's not.

Some teams have injury problems until the playoffs. Some dont get hot until post all-star break. Some years are simply more competitive than others where the top 6 might be considered contenders.

So let's stop making up our own definitions.

And player A doesn't have to be better than player B to remove a team from contention. Most would consider Tatum better than Butler. Make the swap and does Boston suddenly become a non-contender?

Replace Tatum with BI for Boston, are they suddenly a non-contender? He might even be a better fit for their lack of playmaking.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

Finishing in the top 4 has never delegated who's a contender and who's not.

Some teams have injury problems until the playoffs. Some dont get hot until post all-star break. Some years are simply more competitive than others where the top 6 might be considered contenders.

So let's stop making up our own definitions.

And player A doesn't have to be better than player B to remove a team from contention. Most would consider Tatum better than Butler. Make the swap and does Boston suddenly become a non-contender?

Replace Tatum with BI for Boston, are they suddenly a non-contender? He might even be a better fit for their lack of playmaking.

---

Now you're moving the goalpost with fit. Obviously fit changes thing. We're just talking pure talent. In none of those cases is BI the #1 option on the team. Can he be the #1 option on A team? Yes. If you send him to Charlotte, Houston, Indiana, Chicago, Utah, he's #1.

And when people talk about TRUE contenders in a given season, there's rarely more than 4-5 teams that have a legit shot. This year was actually an outlier where you had 8-9. I gave you the top 4 IN EACH CONFERENCE. Eight total. There's not more than that. Actually, I left out SAC and put GS in instead. Doesn't change the facts.

Even if BI is a low tier 1, the argument is there he's a high tier 2. So if you have two of those (we do) then that's pretty special. I think most would agree, BI/Zion is at least potentially a considerably higher ceiling than Tatum/Brown. I think the two of those should be enough to get a chip. What do you have around them?

That being said, it's hard to win if you don't see the floor and all the other craziness going on. I'm a bit pro on the Scoot trade idea still...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RobertM320

Now you're moving the goalpost with fit. Obviously fit changes thing. We're just talking pure talent. In none of those cases is BI the #1 option on the team. Can he be the #1 option on A team? Yes. If you send him to Charlotte, Houston, Indiana, Chicago, Utah, he's #1.

And when people talk about TRUE contenders in a given season, there's rarely more than 4-5 teams that have a legit shot. This year was actually an outlier where you had 8-9. I gave you the top 4 IN EACH CONFERENCE. Eight total. There's not more than that. Actually, I left out SAC and put GS in instead. Doesn't change the facts.

---

I'm not moving any goalposts. I'm using your exact same argument nobody asked for.

You put BI on Boston, he's the #1 option and Boston remains a contender. Thats pretty straight forward and simple.

It was also relayed to me, via league sources, that the Pelicans did quietly hold some exploratory trade talks a year ago involving Zion Williamson during the 2022 offseason before agreeing to sign him to a five-year max rookie scale contract extension worth nearly $195 million. 8 hours ago – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

We kinda knew this... right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DroopyDawg

It was also relayed to me, via league sources, that the Pelicans did quietly hold some exploratory trade talks a year ago involving Zion Williamson during the 2022 offseason before agreeing to sign him to a five-year max rookie scale contract extension worth nearly $195 million. 8 hours ago – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

We kinda knew this... right?

---

Yeah, if you recall Zion signed the extension shortly after the Kd trade saga kicked off.

I can easily imagine that Griff made some calls at around that time to see what it would've taken to get durant, and I have no doubt that Zion's name would've come up.

Shamit posted similarly on twitter, I guess in response to Stein.

https://thespun.com/nba/new-orleans-...-with-pelicans

If this report is true, Zion doesn't want to be here and he's just biding time. He's never been a good fit for the culture the team is trying to build, and that's okay. Time to move off of him. Sometimes things just don't work out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dr. Sting

https://thespun.com/nba/new-orleans-...-with-pelicans

If this report is true, Zion doesn't want to be here and he's just biding time. He's never been a good fit for the culture the team is trying to build, and that's okay. Time to move off of him. Sometimes things just don't work out.

---

Old news. It's already been addressed: it's not really true, and it's become increasingly less true recently. Pels sources are reporting that he seems more bought in and closer to the team than ever at the moment - he's one of the few Pels players who have stuck around in NOLA through the offseason so far, and to quote Shamit:

Quote:

---

It was relayed to me by someone close to the situation that Williamson appears more bought into New Orleans than ever before. There seems to be a sense that he genuinely wants to be in New Orleans

---

When asked about the Windhorst quote directly, Shamit says:

Quote:

---

I do think the characterization of "no relationship" is inaccurate, but I don't think Windhorst is completely lying either. The truth is likely in the middle. What I do know is that there seems to be a greater effort from Zion's end to be involved lately.

---

When there's smoke, there's usually fire.

But folks continue to tell you to not believe your 'lying eyes'.

```

Tell me. other than the Pelicans, is there another team that has dealt with so much 'drama' over the last four years?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by luckyman

I'm not moving any goalposts. I'm using your exact same argument nobody asked for.

You put BI on Boston, he's the #1 option and Boston remains a contender. Thats pretty straight forward and simple.

---

Are you saying replacing Tatum with BI, or BI and Tatum together? With Tatum, BI is not the #1. Replacing Tatum, of course he is.

My take on this whole thing is the law of averages has got to catch up as far as health goes, if we get 55 or better games out of both Zion and BI. If we do we are top 3 in the west. Selling low is always a bad move so I'm for keeping Z for one more yr at least. I like Scoot but, we are a pretty young team but not a big window cap-wise, is it wise to have to count on a rookie to come in and start quickly? Yes we need a PG, one that can come in and start. I would think a vet would be better for this team because it looks like Daniels is at least 2yrs away from that if he ever is

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by djrnno

My take on this whole thing is the law of averages has got to catch up as far as health goes, if we get 55 or better games out of both Zion and BI. If we do we are top 3 in the west. Selling low is always a bad move so I'm for keeping Z for one more yr at least. I like Scoot but, we are a pretty young team but not a big window cap-wise, is it wise to have to count on a rookie to come in and start quickly? Yes we need a PG, one that can come in and start. I would think a vet would be better for this team because it looks like Daniels is at least 2yrs away from that if he ever is

---

BI is ascending as a playmaker and "point forward", so I dont see pg as a huge need unless it's one the caliber of Chris Paul. BI also has vastly improved as a clutch player. One of the best in the league last year. That again dampens the need for a pg.

Then you have to expect both Dyson (year 2) and Jose (year 3) to get better at that position.

So 'needs' look like big>>shooter>>pg in my opinion.

And if you still desperately want a pg and want to draft for need, you can go the much more attainable Cason Wallace route.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by As I See It

When there's smoke, there's usually fire.

But folks continue to tell you to not believe your 'lying eyes'.

```

Tell me. other than the Pelicans, is there another team that has dealt with so much 'drama' over the last four years?

---

Generally, where there?s smoke there?s fire. But this is the NBA. The conversation is dominated by pundits whose job is to play fantasy basketball with the 8-10 elite franchises. Zion could buy a plot at the Metairie Cemetery and they?d still be creating stories about him wanting to leave.