I would do backflips
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If they get the 4th from the Lakers...
Holiday
Reddish
Ingram
Kuzma
Zion
Length, athleticism, spacing. Formula for modern NBA
You need 3+ shooters, 3 playmakers, and 4 defenders.
Just thinking out loud here but what about a 3 team trade with LA and Chicago that gets lavine in NO and Lonzo in Chicago ?? Or Lauri and we keep the 4th pick also
?, I was trying to reply to Pelicanidae response to mine, and it said a moderator had to approve the post. Is that only for long messages? Is there anyway to circumvent that. Thanks
The more I look at it the more I really don't mind NYK or Celtics. I'm good with either Tatum or Barrett.
The 4th pick really drops off for me. In a world where Ingram never gets a blood clot and Lonzo doesn't miss basically an entire season due to injury out of his first 2 seasons then I think the Lakers could make a compelling argument. But Ingram is going into a RFA year where we will be paying him after 1 season, Lonzo we have no idea if he's healthy - he comes with the headache of his dad - has already publicly stated he doesn't want to be here... I just can't get excited about the Lakers pieces.
Give me Barrett, DSJ, Knox, and the Dallas picks, etc or Tatum, Brown, Smart, Memphis pick, etc and I'm more than happy. Gives us plenty of young talent, the earliest we'd have to worry about big contracts is 2 years from now so we will have plenty of time to evaluate, and we still will have picks and tons of flexibility.
The Knicks are who we need to be talking too. We can draft R.J. Barrett, get a few small pieces from NY, draft capital, and a bigger piece from another team. Jrue Holiday can go too. That way we open up plenty of cap to go after free agents.
How about this:
BOSTON OUT- to memphis picks nbr 14 and 20 this year, return memphis's next yr's first. to pels harford, smart,brown and tatum total salary 57 mil
BOSTON IN- from nola AD, HILL and MOORE total salary 48.5 mil
BOST STILL HAS THEIR OWN PICK AND 9 MIL SALARY RELIEF.
MEMPHIS OUT: pick #2 this yr to NOLA
MEMPHIS IN: The three first round picks shown
NOLA OUT: 48.5 MIL VALUE PLAYERS SHOWN
NOLA IN: Memphis's #2 AND BOSTON PLAYERS VALUED AT 57MIL
Doubt CELTICS do this. Unless they see significant value in Moore. Brown, Tatum, Smart and Horford plus 3 first round picks???? I would be ecstatic if this happened but I don’t think Boston or Memphis do this. Memphis know Ja Morant is going to be a superstar.
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Steve Bulpett, the very long time Celtics beat writer, just posted an article:
Just posted:
— Steve Bulpett (@SteveBHoop) May 16, 2019
Danny Ainge staying put as Celtics' leader, with big decisions to come...
Sources here at NBA draft combine in Chicago saying Celts are still most attractive trade partner for New Orleans if Pelicans can't convince Anthony Davis to stay. https://t.co/Ez6En2nqyO
From the article:
David Griffin, who took over the team’s basketball operations last month, is planning to pitch Davis on staying put after a season that saw AD ask for a trade and say that, if that request wasn’t accommodated, he would opt out and leave as an unrestricted free agent in 2020.
There have been reports that Davis hasn’t moved from that stance, and if such is the case, sources here told the Herald the Pelicans will reach out to the Celtics as the most obvious trade partner. The Celts may still not be sure about a deal because it’s not known yet what the Pels will want in return for the All-Star, but there seems to be a belief that they’d be able to work things out.
It’s also within the realm of possibility that another team could jump into the picture, but it’s hard to see the Lakers as one of those teams. New Orleans sources said the team “won’t be doing business” with that club, with the bitterness from the Lakers’ attempt to engineer a Davis deal during the season still seething within the Pelicans’ organization.
It’s still unknown how much Irving’s decision will impact the Davis proceedings, but the Celtics seem ready to make their bid for AD whether Kyrie stays or goes.
[QUOTE=pelicanchamp;1488394]Doubt CELTICS do this. Unless they see significant value in Moore. Brown, Tatum, Smart and Horford plus 3 first round picks???? I would be ecstatic if this happened but I don’t think Boston or Memphis do this. Memphis know Ja Morant is going to be a superstar.
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I am more concerned if Memphis would deal then Boston. BOS gets AD, a usable piece in Moore, and still has their own first which lets them dump HILL if they choose, PLUS a bunch of salary relief. What value do you have on AD?
After much consideration, I like the idea of trading AD to the Knicks.
I was of the mind that we should try to convince AD to stay now that Zion is here, but despite the great player that AD is, a fresh start is also an attractive proposition. Bringing RJ Barrett to New Orleans would be huge. Its an opportunity to rebuild the team around two elite rookie talents who already have great chemistry playing together. It could also be a difference maker for Zion to really buy into having a career in New Orleans instead of trying to skip town like CP3 and Anthony Davis. The idea of Zion not being excited to play in New Orleans would be immediately put to bed if he were paired Barrett.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9jrzFzq7Pg
Jrue is the absolute perfect mentor that you want to pair with so much young talent.......and why would we try to shed contracts if most of our team would be on rookie contracts for a few years. Lump in Hill with AD, though. That would be cool.
Hey Mythrol, you don't like Kuzma? Really asking everyone. I prefer the Celtic and Knicks offer to LA but one of the reasons I actually still like the LA deal a little bit is Kuzma but every time I see people discussing their deal they mention Ball and Ingram and leave Kuzma out of their posts.
You weren't asking me, but I'll answer anyway. I'm not a huge Kuzma fan. He's decent, but not great. He has good size and versatility, and a decent handle, but his shooting regressed from decent to terrible in his second year, he turns it over a lot for a guy who doesn't playmake for others, he's a mediocre rebounder, and he can't defend.
Kuzma does not play defense and is not a great shooter. IMO, he has just filled a stat sheet on a bad team. He would be a nice 3rd piece in a trade, but not someone that would make or break a deal.
Part of it is that, but there's also the ceiling question. I think Kuzma he's a solid player, and will probably continue to be at least a decent player for a while, but I don't see star in him at all. Given that Lonzo has no offensive game whatsoever and doesn't want to play here, and Ingram has the health issue, for me Kuzma really would have to have star potential to make the LA deal worthwhile, and he doesn't. Because NY can offer a pick that means Barrett, and Boston can offer Tatum, they both have the potential to put a possible future star on the table, and that puts them over LA immediately.
Let’s see:
Win ASAP: Boston
Tatum, Brown, Smart, Rozier, first 2 1st round picks or all them)
C: Okafor(Maybe try to sign Vucevic)
PF: Zion, Randle
SF: Tatum, Brown
SG: Jrue, Moore
PG: Smart, Rozier(maybe bring in Kemba or Payton)
Best haul(IMO): Lakers
Ingram, Kuzma, Ball, Hart, Wagner, Hunter(with the 4th pick), 2020 1st
C: Okafor, Wagner(maybe sign Vucevic)
PF: Zion, Kuzma
SF: Ingram, Hunter(I love this kid’s potential)
SG: Jrue, Moore, Hart
PG: Ball, (maybe bring back Payton or sign Kemba)
Long term rebuild: Knicks (probably trade Jrue as well in this scenario)
Knox, Smith Jr, Robinson, RJ Barrett(with 3rd pick), 2020 1st, 2021 1st & Dallas 1st,
C: Robinson, Okafor
PF: Zion, Randle(maybe)
SF: Knox
SG: Barrett, Moore
PG: Smith, Payton(maybe)
Don’t do too good and build something special through the draft in the next couple seasons with all those picks. Hopefully get another 1st and young players for Jrue as well
Just ran through a comparison of most of the players that are being discussed in trade talks. I didn't include Ingram for two reasons: the first is that Basketball Reference only allows you to pick 6 players total, so I stuck to 2 players per team (Knicks, Lakers, Celtics). The second is that when it came to who to cut from the Lakers package, Ingram's health is the biggest question mark so I decided to leave him off rather than Ball or Kuzma.
But when comparing the Mitchell Robinson, Kevin Knox, Kyle Kuzma, Lonzo Ball, Jayson Tatum, and Jaylen Brown, I was surprised to see how much Robinson dominates the field.
Per 36, he averages more rebounds than anyone else, more blocks than anybody else (in fact, more blocks than everyone else added together), and is second in steals. He's a comparatively low scorer, scoring less than everyone else except Lonzo, but that's largely due to the fact that he takes by far the fewest shots: he actually has by far the highest FG%, at basically 69%. His net rating is off the charts, having a higher Offensive Rating than Jayson Tatum (the guy in second place) by +33, and he also has the best Defensive Rating (-1 to the guy in second place). That gives him an absurd +34 net rating.
He also has the highest VORP, the best BPM, the best DBPM, the best OBPM, the most total Win Shares (despite playing on the Knicks!!!), the most WS/48, and by far the highest PER.
Mitchell Robinson is a boss.
He is indeed. Some Knicks fans don't even want to give up Robinson for AD
I know we have talked to Culver and Reddish, but have we spoken with RJ yet?
Is Robinson really that good or is he just another Tyson chandler who has great offensive ratings because all he does is dunk? Granted, that’s not a terrible thing, Tyson was an elite defender and rebounder.
Like could Robinson be Tyson, or Clint cappella or better?
everyone here keeps assuming that the NY deal gets us Barrett, I'm not so sure he doesn't go at #2 to Memphis. We would still get Ja but he is not RJ which is why I think we should do the Boston deal which could possibly work out where we can move to #2 and get him
We need a legit 5 for Zion. So, I think as much we loved Tatum and all those picks. NY got the one nice piece that we kind of need. I think Robinson is a huge need to put Zion in the position to succeed.
Granted... I think the best foot forward is to get the best trade offer for AD without trying to include Hill as a expiring dump. Eat his contract instead losing trade assets.
To me it comes down to Boston and the Knicks. The Lakers have good young players that are injured way too often. Lonzo has missed alot of time in his first 2 seasons, and Ingram has a clotting issue. Only player from LA that we can count on is Kuzma, and the #4 pick can net us a guy like Cam Reddish. The extra draft picks that we' get for next year and beyond would probably land outside of the lottery, so future picks won't matter much other than use them as assets ala Boston.
White the Celtics couldn't offer a high draft pick they can however send us a few good young players in Tatum, Brown and possibly Rozier (they have to include picks too). I think Kyrie stunted the development of Tatum and Brown (and Rozier) so they didn't do as well this past season as they did in last year's playoffs. The lineup could be young, long and athletic:
PG Jrue (yeah I know he's not a PG but he can do it)
SG Jalen Brown
SF Jason Tatum
PF Zion
C ? (Either Okafor or as someone else mentioned possibly going after Vucevic)
I think the Knicks can offer the best package of them all. Getting the #3 pick could land us RJ Barrett, who was the #1 recruit coming out of high school a year ago. Pair him with his good buddy Zion along with other long athletic guys like KNox and Mitchell Robinson... it'll be too much fun watching these guys out on fast breaks:
PG Jrue
SG RJ Barrett
SF Knox
PF Zion
C Mitchell Robinson
I'd love to get Mitchell Robinson (from Chalmette btw)
I’d take Dennis Smith Jr in a package with the Knicks too. I have a feeling about that guy. He plays with intensity.
Report: Pelicans owner Gayle Benson would trade Anthony Davis to Lakers only ‘over my dead**body’ https://t.co/EaryIBMXuR
— Kurt Helin (@basketballtalk) May 17, 2019
Look I love Jrue but if we trade AD for all these youngsters I think we need to ask Jrue do you want to stay here and mentor these guys because we’re not winning a title any time soon with new guys . If Jrue says I’d rather go compete for a championship then we trade him I don’t think he wants to play with a bunch or rookies . I honestly think we could get a couple of nice assets with trading Jrue that would fit out new (Zion) time line . Nobody WANTS to trade Jrue but by the time this team is really ready to win Jrue will be in his 30s so why not trade him for assets that fit our time line it only makes sense .
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One thing that occurred to me because of a podcast I listened to is maybe bringing Jaylen and Tatum and keeping both of them isn't the best move. Tatum liked being the top option in 2018, then Kyrie comes back and he didn't do so well. Maybe he won't like being 3rd at best with the potential to be #2 only once Jrue has declined or retired or whatever.
I still think that's the 2nd best option as I'm really, personally high on Mitchell Robinson.
I'm starting to think the Knicks have the best package also from the standpoint that they have tons of cap space. Possibly we can better get out from under some salary because they could absorb it. It could help us have even more flexibility if we choose to include Hill and/or Moore in the trade.
It sounds very much like the Lakers are not a contender.
Jackie MacMullan of ESPN:
We have been told, I think, through channels – most of us have heard this same scuttlebutt – that Gayle Benson has basically told him, “To the Lakers, over my dead body.”
http://www.espn.com/espnradio/play?id=26717626
That "over my dead body" line is starting to blow up. Based on everything else with this story I have to assume they just blatantly made it up.
It's crazy, they are "quoting" a reporter who got second hand information from a rumor and presenting it like it is Mrs. Benson's exact words. This LA media is dangerous.
C: Robinson, Okafor
PF: Zion, Knox
SF: Barrett, Hill
SG: Jrue, Moore
PG: Smith, Frank
Maybe: Payton
We definitely needs some shooter and overhaul the bench with these draft picks.