2012 - 2013 Finals

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smittywerb

I never said it was impossible, but you can bet that the field isn't even. And that "good organization" remark isn't always true. Heck, I wish we could form our own Big 3, I wish we could overpay for players and don't have to worry about the consequences, I wish we could do a lot more things that won't happen.

---

It always true. Obviously you need to land a superstar, but still, good drafting, trades, etc goes a long way.

I agree 100% Kurgan. I still haven't forgotten what happened to us in Game 7. Most painful basketball loss I've ever experienced. The Spurs did that. That's why I don't root for them except against OKC who tried to steal our team and badmout the region in the process.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicans78

Doesn't matter how a team was formed. Lebron and Wade joined up to take on the Celtics who already had their big 3 formed with KG, Pierce, and Allen plus a very good PG in Rondo.

---

Dude, yes it does. If all the superstars were to do what Lebron-Wade-Bosh did and join up on 4-5 teams, would you still hold their rings to the highest standard? If CP3-Howard-Melo-Durant all structured their contracts to sign to one team in the future and went on to win 7 rings, would you consider all of the them top 5 players?

Like I said, I give more respect to organizations and players who use strategic trades and other management moves to build their superstar teams (like the teams you named, ya know how the Lakers signed Kareem and drafted Magic and built around those 2), than superstars plotting to join the same team in 4 years in the making. I'm BIG on legacy.

EDIT: Even in the 80's it wasn't just the Celtics and Lakers even though they took the most rings. You had Dr.J take one, the Pistons went to 2, Jordan was putting up comp, even Wilkins' team was putting up comp, and other teams also. But today, outside of the Heat, are there any other teams you consider in their tier, I'm not just saying give them comp, but do you consider them on the same level as the Heat?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicans78

It always true. Obviously you need to land a superstar, but still, good drafting, trades, etc goes a long way.

---

And how HARD is that for a team that can't go over the lux tax because it will cripple them for years to come? How EASY is that for a team who has the market and money to just pay for who they want and trade away all of their draft picks. It's to the point where teams no longer care about draft picks because they have the money to get what player they want.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smittywerb

Dude, yes it does. If all the superstars were to do what Lebron-Wade-Bosh did and join up on 4-5 teams, would you still hold their rings to the highest standard? If CP3-Howard-Melo-Durant all structured their contracts to sign to one team in the future and went on to win 7 rings, would you consider all of the them top 5 players?

Like I said, I give more respect to organizations and players who use strategic trades and other management moves to build their superstar teams (like the teams you named, ya know how the Lakers signed Kareem and drafted Magic and built around those 2), than superstars plotting to join the same team in 4 years in the making. I'm BIG on legacy.

---

Kareem forced a trade to the Lakers. He wanted to go to a bigger market. He wanted to go to either the Lakers or Knicks at the time.

Superstars won't be able to do that anymore once the new luxury taxes kicks in.

And the Heat did use strategy. They had enough cap space to sign all 3 guys. If Riley wasn't there, that big 3 wouldnt have happened. They then surrounded them with quality role players.

You're definition of legacy is different than other people. Lebron is backing up it with his performances. The numbers add up for him. His production hasn't decreased since he went to Miami. Wade and Bosh's have and neither are superstars right now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smittywerb

And how HARD is that for a team that can't go over the lux tax because it will cripple them for years to come? How EASY is that for a team who has the market and money to just pay for who they want and trade away all of their draft picks. It's to the point where teams no longer care about draft picks because they have the money to get what player they want.

---

You're obviously forgetting how the new luxury tax will work. Its gonna cripple any team, not just the small markets.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicans78

Kareem forced a trade to the Lakers. He wanted to go to a bigger market. He wanted to go to either the Lakers or Knicks at the time.

Superstars won't be able to do that anymore once the new luxury taxes kicks in.

And the Heat did use strategy. They had enough cap space to sign all 3 guys. If Riley wasn't there, that big 3 wouldnt have happened. They then surrounded them with quality role players.

You're definition of legacy is different than other people. Lebron is backing up it with his performances. The numbers add up for him. His production hasn't decreased since he went to Miami. Wade and Bosh's have and neither are superstars right now.

---

- Kareem had ALL the right to do that. He and O brought a ring to Milwaukee, freaking MILWAUKEE. He was at the end of his career and wanted to go out with a bang, the Bucks couldn't give him that. It's not like he left in his prime and jetted like superstars do now.

- I don't know, things will always be able to be worked around, it's just how long will it take.

- And the Heat didn't use strategy. At the olympics, Lebron, Wade and Bosh discussed playing for each other, found a team willing to construct its contracts to sign all 3 and build a team, and there you have it. There weren't any draft picks involved, or any trades where the Heat gave up talent. No, they gutted their roster because they KNEW that those 3 were coming there. You have to read more into the story, it wasn't just a coincidence. It was planned.

- And I understand that Lebron is what you said because he IS the best player in the league. But when we look back at his legacy and compare him to Jordan and the others, who he played with WILL come up in the discussion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pelicans78

You're obviously forgetting how the new luxury tax will work. Its gonna cripple any team, not just the small markets.

---

I have no trust in anything that isn't 100% a hard cap. It's not going to cripple teams like the Lakers when they are making 300 million dollar TV deals, it's just going to make them spend more money.

The best comparison I can make is the Cowboys, before the hard cap, the Cowboys had an all-star squad with Irvin, Aikman, Smith, and a whole lot of good players. Once the hard cap was put in place, where have they have been?