Pels Off season thread

To be fair, his teammates are pretty trash except for Garland.

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

To be fair, his teammates are pretty trash except for Garland.

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Not really the point, I don't think. Watching Cavs games is painful because Sexton dominates the ball so much yet misses so many wide open opportunities. When Garland is on ball the team immediately looks better despite having the same lacklustre personnel because despite being younger and having less experience prior to the NBA, he's already become a significantly better creator for others who is far more willing as a passer. Sexton either has painfully poor vision, or is unwilling to trust a team offense over himself at this point in his career.

Combine that with the fact that he is defensively appalling (Sexton ranked 425th in the league in D-EPM this year and 238th in D-Raptor) and that he's due big money at the end of this year, I wouldn't want to acquire him.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Not really the point, I don't think. Watching Cavs games is painful because Sexton dominates the ball so much yet misses so many wide open opportunities. When Garland is on ball the team immediately looks better despite having the same lacklustre personnel because despite being younger and having less experience prior to the NBA, he's already become a significantly better creator for others who is far more willing as a passer. Sexton either has painfully poor vision, or is unwilling to trust a team offense over himself at this point in his career.

Combine that with the fact that he is defensively appalling (Sexton ranked 425th in the league in D-EPM this year and 238th in D-Raptor) and that he's due big money at the end of this year, I wouldn't want to acquire him.

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you obviously have stats etc. on your side, but I would still like to see about him doing what it takes to fit in here.... just my opinion though....perhaps I am way off base ....

Sexton is a case of someone gotta show out on a bad teams..

Bradley Beal could want out per Bleacher Report. Doubt we could get him but maybe we can get in a three way with Boston and get Jalen Brown. Brown is Good on offense and Defense, young and on a decent contract.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Not really the point, I don't think. Watching Cavs games is painful because Sexton dominates the ball so much yet misses so many wide open opportunities. When Garland is on ball the team immediately looks better despite having the same lacklustre personnel because despite being younger and having less experience prior to the NBA, he's already become a significantly better creator for others who is far more willing as a passer. Sexton either has painfully poor vision, or is unwilling to trust a team offense over himself at this point in his career.

Combine that with the fact that he is defensively appalling (Sexton ranked 425th in the league in D-EPM this year and 238th in D-Raptor) and that he's due big money at the end of this year, I wouldn't want to acquire him.

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The defense is more troubling to me than the offense. Flank him with Zion and Ingram and I have a hard time imagining he’s an unwilling passer. Maybe he is. Who knows. But we gotta make it harder fir teams to get to the rack.

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

The defense is more troubling to me than the offense. Flank him with Zion and Ingram and I have a hard time imagining he’s an unwilling passer. Maybe he is. Who knows. But we gotta make it harder fir teams to get to the rack.

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I think there's a conversation to be had about whether it's an unwilling passer or an incapable passer. It could be that he's perfectly willing to make passes but just has poor feel as a passer, or poor vision that means he misses a lot of passers other players would hit.

Definitely agree though. Perimeter defense is a big priority for this team going forward; it's why I'd be so happy to get someone like OG Anunoby if they came up. I know it's unlikely Toronto would move him (why would they?) but if he ever did go up for sale I'd be a big fan. Similarly why I'm positive about a Lowry move, potentially: he still plays defense and he still puts the effort in, and it's effective.

Anybody willing to admit they have watched fewer than 5 Sexton NBA games in their life? Or, are we going to pretend that we watched him play, when in reality all the assertions about his game are coming purely from stats?

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Anybody willing to admit they have watched fewer than 5 Sexton NBA games in their life? Or, are we going to pretend that we watched him play, when in reality all the assertions about his game are coming purely from stats?

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LOL I thought the exact same thing. Most probably had no idea he even existed until this offseason.

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Originally Posted by As I See It

LOL I thought the exact same thing. Most probably had no idea he even existed until this offseason.

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I am sure many knew him because he played in the SEC and was a top 10 pick. But I know people havent watched him since he came into the league. They look at the stats and then have this strong opinion one way or the other.

And yes, he does put up big stats on a bad team, but he had no choice but to be on a bad team. I'd rather he put up good stats than bad ones. Have we already forgotten that Devin Booker used to be called a good stats/bad team guy? Perhaps the leagues worst defender. That was 2, 3 years ago.

All these general statements as people become experts without watching because they have access to stats

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I am sure many knew him because he played in the SEC and was a top 10 pick. But I know people havent watched him since he came into the league. They look at the stats and then have this strong opinion one way or the other.

And yes, he does put up big stats on a bad team, but he had no choice but to be on a bad team. I'd rather he put up good stats than bad ones. Have we already forgotten that Devin Booker used to be called a good stats/bad team guy? Perhaps the leagues worst defender. That was 2, 3 years ago.

All these general statements as people become experts without watching because they have access to stats

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Sexton is someone I would take a chance on if he also allows us to maintain much of our future assets. Any idea if Griffin has any serious interest?

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Anybody willing to admit they have watched fewer than 5 Sexton NBA games in their life? Or, are we going to pretend that we watched him play, when in reality all the assertions about his game are coming purely from stats?

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All I’ve got on him is the Alabama games back LSU. Briefly thought he was on the Pistons a few weeks back.

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Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

Sexton is someone I would take a chance on if he also allows us to maintain much of our future assets. Any idea if Griffin has any serious interest?

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What is "serious interest?"

He has interest in a ton of guys. But not all are available. And of the ones that are, the asking prices right now are a little high. Everyone wants to buy. Anybody even considering selling is posturing that they wont sell and if they do, it will cost more than most want to spend. The teams that bring their asking prices down will make trades but right now, costs are stupid

Seller’s market all around. Houses. Cars. NBA players. Billionaire rockets.

I just saw another one of those videos of Steven Adams shooting threes and honestly, I know it won't happen, but if he came into the season as a stretch big all of a sudden I would be unable to contain my laughter. It's just such a silly concept and I love it.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Some people watch a lot of basketball *shrug* not sure what else to tell you.

Hell, even if you only ever watch Pelicans games and nothing else (in which case, I'm sorry for your suffering) you see Sexton play at least a few times a year :hihi:

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Yeah, and I am sure during those games, the Pelicans fan is intently watching him and scouting him.

I know its the internet and here there is a pressure to have a take. You cant possibly say "I dont know" -- but I admire the people who do when they genuinely dont

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Yeah, and I am sure during those games, the Pelicans fan is intently watching him and scouting him.

I know its the internet and here there is a pressure to have a take. You cant possibly say "I dont know" -- but I admire the people who do when they genuinely dont

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Nah, there's plenty of stuff I don't know. For example, I have very little clue on what's going on in Orlando or Detroit, and I only have a passing knowledge of the Wolves at this point as well. I just feel comfortable in my familiarity with Sexton enough to have a few opinions.

I also feel like the Cavs are slightly different in terms of public attention compared to most losing teams without megastars, because I feel like they're still in the news a lot due, in part, to Kevin Love's ongoing drama there. So maybe some people watch them more than you might expect just to find out what's going on. That's purely speculation on my part though.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Nah, there's plenty of stuff I don't know. For example, I have very little clue on what's going on in Orlando or Detroit, and I only have a passing knowledge of the Wolves at this point as well. I just feel comfortable in my familiarity with Sexton enough to have a few opinions.

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And how confident are you that other people in this thread who have an opinion of Sexton have watched him? Because, keep in mind, I never directed my comment towards you specifically

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

What is "serious interest?"

He has interest in a ton of guys. But not all are available. And of the ones that are, the asking prices right now are a little high. Everyone wants to buy. Anybody even considering selling is posturing that they wont sell and if they do, it will cost more than most want to spend. The teams that bring their asking prices down will make trades but right now, costs are stupid

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I had seen reports that he was very "gettable" so assumed he could be a realistic target. Are you saying that the asking price is currently too high?

The idea that the Pels are going to give up assets to get off of bad assets that they took in through the AD and Jrue trades is more an indictment on just how ********ty a GM Griff is. I mean, make it make sense.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Anybody willing to admit they have watched fewer than 5 Sexton NBA games in their life? Or, are we going to pretend that we watched him play, when in reality all the assertions about his game are coming purely from stats?

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Wont pretend to know anything but anecdotes about Sexton. But I will say the Cavs making him available tells me everything I need to know. If they believed he was worth a max contract he wouldn't even be on the market, regardless of fit.

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Originally Posted by tdcreator

Bradley Beal could want out per Bleacher Report. Doubt we could get him but maybe we can get in a three way with Boston and get Jalen Brown. Brown is Good on offense and Defense, young and on a decent contract.

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March 17th, 1947. It was a crisp spring day. Some clouds in the sky. Birds could be seen flying lazily over Lake Pontchartrain. Ted Weems and his Orchestra could be heard on radios across America and it was the last known date that Bradley Beal did not want off of the Washington Wizards.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

The idea that the Pels are going to give up assets to get off of bad assets that they took in through the AD and Jrue trades is more an indictment on just how ********ty a GM Griff is. I mean, make it make sense.

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I keep seeing people on Twitter talk about us having to attach #10 to Bledsoe to ''get off his contract'' and I can't understand that line of thinking whatsoever.

Bledsoe is fundamentally a medium-large expiring deal. He only have $4m guaranteed for 2022-23. Why on God's green Earth would you have to attach a lottery pick to shed that contract? Surely some second rounders or a future first from the Lakers or Bucks would do it, if any picks were needed at all.

Obviously that changes if Bledsoe is just salary in a deal to acquire a legitimately good player, where the #10 is playing more of the value role instead of just compensating for a negative, but that's a very different picture to us ''getting off his contract''.

I hear people being surprised that Adams is working on his outside shooting. It's basketball, everyone in the league should be working on their shooting. If the asst. coaches are as good as I hear, and they did great with Lonzo, all of them should be good to great shooters. I think that regardless who they get at the 10th pick, they can teach them to shoot.

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

I keep seeing people on Twitter talk about us having to attach #10 to Bledsoe to ''get off his contract'' and I can't understand that line of thinking whatsoever.

Bledsoe is fundamentally a medium-large expiring deal. He only have $4m guaranteed for 2022-23. Why on God's green Earth would you have to attach a lottery pick to shed that contract? Surely some second rounders or a future first from the Lakers or Bucks would do it, if any picks were needed at all.

Obviously that changes if Bledsoe is just salary in a deal to acquire a legitimately good player, where the #10 is playing more of the value role instead of just compensating for a negative, but that's a very different picture to us ''getting off his contract''.

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Those people are reacting to a poor recap of what Woj said on a recent pod. The recap tweet left out the part where Woj said something good would come back to the Pels

They are not using 10 to dump him. Theyare attaching him to 10 and something of quality will come back. Or they will just move 10 w/o Bledsoe and move Bled at another time

NBA Central
@TheNBACentral
?
32m
The Pelicans have 'generated traction' with the Grizzlies in a deal that would send the 10th pick and Eric Bledsoe to Memphis for the Grizzlies' 17th pick, per
@JakeLFischer

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Originally Posted by Speakthetruth

NBA Central
@TheNBACentral
?
32m
The Pelicans have 'generated traction' with the Grizzlies in a deal that would send the 10th pick and Eric Bledsoe to Memphis for the Grizzlies' 17th pick, per
@JakeLFischer

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Meh. I guess this is ok if we are opening up room for Lowry.

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Originally Posted by Speakthetruth

NBA Central
@TheNBACentral
?
32m
The Pelicans have 'generated traction' with the Grizzlies in a deal that would send the 10th pick and Eric Bledsoe to Memphis for the Grizzlies' 17th pick, per
@JakeLFischer

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So we are moving the 10th pick and a partially guaranteed player to move back 7 picks? There obviously has to be more to this, or else this is just ******** poor management.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

So we are moving the 10th pick and a partially guaranteed player to move back 7 picks? There obviously has to be more to this, or else this is just ******** poor management.

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Lmao relax. 10 through 17 in this draft is not a huge difference. Contract isn?t partially guaranteed until 2022 anyway.

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Originally Posted by As I See It

I'm pretty sure that last year the Pelicans re-signed Kenrich Williams, Frank Jackson, Zylan Cheatam, and Josh Gray and packaged them together to complete the Steven Adams trade.

Your point is well taken about GS's interest in this particular trade, but do they want four players to tie up almost 140MM in payroll?

Curry: 45.8MM
Thompson: 38.0MM
Green: 24.0MM
Wiggins: 31.6MM

I believe somebody will deal with Golden State.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

So we are moving the 10th pick and a partially guaranteed player to move back 7 picks? There obviously has to be more to this, or else this is just ******** poor management.

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Watch the next shoe to drop will be Adams and 17 for a Lowry sign and trade, 3 years $75 million.

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Originally Posted by iNolaNightmare

Lmao relax. 10 through 17 in this draft is not a huge difference. Contract isn?t partially guaranteed until 2022 anyway.

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Yeah that's not the point.

Asset management is asset management. Making smart moves that are careful on the margins is important, especially when you're trying to take that step up towards contendership. Small mistakes you've made in the past can come back to haunt you.

Now, I'm not saying this mistake would haunt us, but it's just bad practice. There's an argument - whether you personally think it's a strong one or not is besides the point - that due to his expiring contract, the presence of his Bird Rights, and his history of play that Bledsoe may even be a mild positive asset for a good team (one where he'd be motivated to play hard, that is). Taking a step down in the draft to dump someone who is arguably an asset is poor asset management, whatever else may also be true.

And that's regardless of whether you think there's a real step down between 10 and 17 in this draft, which I think there could be depending on a few variable guys whose names float around a bit.

The Kings, who hold the No. 9 pick in Thursday’s draft, may be the highest option for teams hoping to trade into the lottery. Sacramento and the Pelicans, who have the 10th selection, have been active in trade talks involving those picks, sources tell Fischer, as both teams are looking for veterans who will give them a better chance to make the playoffs next season. New Orleans, which is hoping to unload Eric Bledsoe‘s salary, has talked to the Grizzlies about a deal that would send the veteran guard and the lottery pick to Memphis in exchange for the 17th choice....Arthur Hill

Why? If this is true, I'm appalled...... "Here, we'll let you move up seven picks in the draft, Memphis and you can have Bledsoe, too". In other words, "Kick Me!!!"

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Originally Posted by iNolaNightmare

Lmao relax. 10 through 17 in this draft is not a huge difference. Contract isn?t partially guaranteed until 2022 anyway.

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10 to 17 in ANY draft is a huge difference.

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Originally Posted by As I See It

The Kings, who hold the No. 9 pick in Thursday’s draft, may be the highest option for teams hoping to trade into the lottery. Sacramento and the Pelicans, who have the 10th selection, have been active in trade talks involving those picks, sources tell Fischer, as both teams are looking for veterans who will give them a better chance to make the playoffs next season. New Orleans, which is hoping to unload Eric Bledsoe‘s salary, has talked to the Grizzlies about a deal that would send the veteran guard and the lottery pick to Memphis in exchange for the 17th choice....Arthur Hill

Why? If this is true, I'm appalled...... "Here, we'll let you move up seven picks in the draft, Memphis and you can have Bledsoe, too". In other words, "Kick Me!!!"

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Have Bledsoe too? The idea is to get off of Bledsoe. He is not an asset. Having said that, 10 to 17 is a pretty steep draft that would normally cost teams a good bit to move up.

An aside...

Evan Fournier and Rudy Gobert lead the French past 'Pop's Pansies', 83-76. Jrue Holiday led the American Team with 18/7/4 off the bench.

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Originally Posted by socbe7

10 to 17 in ANY draft is a huge difference.

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Something else has to be coming too? Bledsoe and the 10th out. Tyus Jones in? Valanciunas?

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Originally Posted by Pelicanidae

Yeah that's not the point.

Asset management is asset management. Making smart moves that are careful on the margins is important, especially when you're trying to take that step up towards contendership. Small mistakes you've made in the past can come back to haunt you.

Now, I'm not saying this mistake would haunt us, but it's just bad practice. There's an argument - whether you personally think it's a strong one or not is besides the point - that due to his expiring contract, the presence of his Bird Rights, and his history of play that Bledsoe may even be a mild positive asset for a good team (one where he'd be motivated to play hard, that is). Taking a step down in the draft to dump someone who is arguably an asset is poor asset management, whatever else may also be true.

And that's regardless of whether you think there's a real step down between 10 and 17 in this draft, which I think there could be depending on a few variable guys whose names float around a bit.

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Like of all the draft assets we obtained when acquiring Bledsoe?

Yes, asset management and the fringes are important. One moment you have a war chest to send Christopher Columbus across the ocean to the new world, the next your on the corner begging for change to cross the street and get a Subway sandwich.

The point is, there has to be a second move dependent on that first move happening, or else Griff is just wizzing away assets we accumulated in the AD/Jrue trades. Don’t wizz away those assets or all you are left with is your wang in your hand and stories of what could have been if you had planned things better.

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Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

Have Bledsoe too? The idea is to get off of Bledsoe. He is not an asset.

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He is an asset; he has a value. Might not be to this team, but make no mistake, he has a value.

Remember, one man's trash is another man's treasure. (See Solomon Hill)

So we get rid of Bledsoe which is nice, but I'm not too crazy about going that far down.

Cleaning his mess with more mess

Memphis better be sending something else back with the 17th pick. I don't care if a second move is contingent on the first, if that first move sucks. 10 and Bledsoe for 17, in a vacuum, is terrible management from the FO.

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Originally Posted by As I See It

He is an asset; he has a value. Might not be to this team, but make no mistake, he has a value.

Remember, one man's trash is another man's treasure. (See Solomon Hill)

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Dude. We had to use an asset to dump Hill. Bledsoe is not an asset. Woj said himself he is not viewed as an asset.

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

Something else has to be coming too? Bledsoe and the 10th out. Tyus Jones in? Valanciunas?

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the teams picking 13, 14, 16 (and 18), and 19 (and 21) all have interest in moving up to 10 too. Griff is gonna get value for trading down

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Originally Posted by iNolaNightmare

Dude. We had to use an asset to dump Hill. Bledsoe is not an asset. Woj said himself he is not viewed as an asset.

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Dude. You're wrong. Does he have a positive value? The answer is a resounding yes. Might not be the value you like; but he has a value.

And by the way, I don't want him on my team either.

I'd keep Bledsoe on the bench for a year and then eat the 3MM buyout rather than being suckered into this silly trade. If I'm trading 10, it will be for something of like or better value.

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Originally Posted by As I See It

Dude. You're wrong. Does he have a positive value? The answer is a resounding yes. Might not be the value you like; but he has a value.

And by the way, I don't want him on my team either.

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What is your definition of 'positive value'?

Because by the standard definition, I dont think anybody on earth (including the 30 GMs) would agree

Easiest way to determine a guys value (positive or negative) is to look at his current contract and ask if he would get the same, more, or less on the open market.

If Bledsoe was a FA this offseason, he might get some offers in the 2/10-12 range. Maybe.

He will make 18 mil next season, and basically have 3 mil in dead money after that. Basically, making him a 1 yr/21 mil contract. That would make him a negative asset, by almost any definition. Adams, similarly is a slight negative asset, as there is no universe where he could get 2/35 this offseason

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

What is your definition of 'positive value'?

Because by the standard definition, I dont think anybody on earth (including the 30 GMs) would agree

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He wouldn't be in the NBA if someone (Milwaukee) didn't value him in the first place. Most act like he's garbage; I disagree. He's a malcontent with an attitude that never wanted to be here. Get rid of him, but as filler or some other means. I'm not tying a lottery pick to him to get rid of his behind with a negative return coming back to us. That would be compounding a negative.