Draft Prospects Discussion

firstly we will have to stay with those picks...

I just don't see 3 young players in our roster next season...
I would like to, but I do not believe

I would love to trade back into the draft and grab Valentine. His 3 point shot has improved a lot and if he can have that going in the NBA the guy can be a star. He mite not be an elite athlete but neither is Harden or Ginobli. Valentine is one of the most complete players who is NBA ready that I have seen in a long time. Him coming off the bench in a Ginobli or early Harden type role is the type of things we need to be serious championship contenders. Man just hitting on two players in this draft would be so huge for this franchise going forward. This is one of my favorite drafts I have seen in a while. If we walk away with Simmons or Ingram we can be great for a long long time.

Now that the fun (or non fun) of the deadline has passed lets turn our attention to the next opportunity to improve the roster. Who would you like to grab in the draft? Who are some guys you'd like in free agency?

My Thoughts:

Draft:

this years draft is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT. This organization has tried to skip steps by trading draft picks away and taking on young vets (Essentially avoided the develop young players step). In theory, it doesn't sound like a bad idea but it hasn't panned out. With max salaries increasing and with non-max players getting max money, the draft is more important than ever for small market teams.

If we don't land in the top 2 in the lottery, Jamaal Murray would be my pick at this time. The kid has a terrific feel, can shoot it, and is pretty solid attacking the rim, He can play both guard spots so he and Jrue would make a nice 1-2 combo. He will need to add some strength and body needs to develop a bit.

Free Agency

This is assuming we can't dump Asik. I don't think anyone will take him off our hands.

1. DO NOT resign Ryan Anderson unless the deal is significantly less that the rumored 15-20 mil/year. I like the guy but he is not worth that money.

2. Harrison Barnes should be our main target. IMO he is great fit for this roster. He's a solid offensive player that can make an open three, is an above average defender, has great length and athleticism. He will command pretty big $ (My guess is $18-20 mil/year) , so we will have to make some small moves to our roster to make it work. Obviously other teams will be after Barnes, including Golden State who would be the easy favorite to keep him if they don't go after Durant as has been rumored. My hope is the Gentry connection and playing alongside AD and Jrue will make him strongly consider the Pels.

3. I would look to sign a guy like Miles Plumlee. Not a great player, but better than Asik and better fit for our system. He gets up and down the floor better and he can catch. He won't cost a fortune.

Roster after Draft and Free Agency
Starters: Dynamic, unselfish unit. 1-4 are good shooters and willing passers. Would be very hard to defend. Murray will experience some growing pains but I think his overall make up allows Gentry to throw him in the fire right off the bat.
1. Jrue
2. Murray
3. Barnes
4. AD
5. Plumlee

2nd Unit -- This unit is a good fit for Tyreke and Asik. It allows both to do what they do best. Floor spacers allow Tyreke to have room to attack the rim and Asik will be around the rim for easy dump-offs and offensive rebounds.
1. Tyreke
2. BDJ
3. QPON
4.Cunninham
5. Asik

Thoughts?

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Originally Posted by Hoopsguy

Now that the fun (or non fun) of the deadline has passed lets turn our attention to the next opportunity to improve the roster. Who would you like to grab in the draft? Who are some guys you'd like in free agency?

My Thoughts:

Draft:

this years draft is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT. This organization has tried to skip steps by trading draft picks away and taking on young vets (Essentially avoided the develop young players step). In theory, it doesn't sound like a bad idea but it hasn't panned out. With max salaries increasing and with non-max players getting max money, the draft is more important than ever for small market teams.

If we don't land in the top 2 in the lottery, Jamaal Murray would be my pick at this time. The kid has a terrific feel, can shoot it, and is pretty solid attacking the rim, He can play both guard spots so he and Jrue would make a nice 1-2 combo. He will need to add some strength and body needs to develop a bit.

Free Agency

This is assuming we can't dump Asik. I don't think anyone will take him off our hands.

1. DO NOT resign Ryan Anderson unless the deal is significantly less that the rumored 15-20 mil/year. I like the guy but he is not worth that money.

2. Harrison Barnes should be our main target. IMO he is great fit for this roster. He's a solid offensive player that can make an open three, is an above average defender, has great length and athleticism. He will command pretty big $ (My guess is $18-20 mil/year) , so we will have to make some small moves to our roster to make it work. Obviously other teams will be after Barnes, including Golden State who would be the easy favorite to keep him if they don't go after Durant as has been rumored. My hope is the Gentry connection and playing alongside AD and Jrue will make him strongly consider the Pels.

3. I would look to sign a guy like Miles Plumlee. Not a great player, but better than Asik and better fit for our system. He gets up and down the floor better and he can catch. He won't cost a fortune.

Roster after Draft and Free Agency
Starters: Dynamic, unselfish unit. 1-4 are good shooters and willing passers. Would be very hard to defend. Murray will experience some growing pains but I think his overall make up allows Gentry to throw him in the fire right off the bat.
1. Jrue
2. Murray
3. Barnes
4. AD
5. Plumlee

2nd Unit -- This unit is a good fit for Tyreke and Asik. It allows both to do what they do best. Floor spacers allow Tyreke to have room to attack the rim and Asik will be around the rim for easy dump-offs and offensive rebounds.
1. Tyreke
2. BDJ
3. QPON
4.Cunninham
5. Asik

Thoughts?

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Seems to be well thought out...just for the sake of discussion, would you still go with Murray if say Dunn was still available? Personally, I'm thinking Dunn. Murray, or Hield...

I don't have a true argument against Dunn per se. Think he has a chance to be a really good player. Big pg, skilled, potentially a stud on ball defender. He is best with the ball in his hands so I don't think he is as good of a fit next to Jrue as Murray. Also, His shooting scares me.

Just my personal opinion/philosophy here: the more guys you have who can shoot the ball the more dangerous you are as a team and the more dangerous AD becomes due to the spacing on the floor. Obviously the warriors are the perfect example of this but I don't think what they have can be replicated unless the good lord creates another Steph.

I think a Jrue/ Murray backcourt would be more similar to what Portland has now in Lillard and CJ....maybe not quite as dynamic offensively but very good and better defensively.

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Originally Posted by ramsters60

Seems to be well thought out...just for the sake of discussion, would you still go with Murray if say Dunn was still available? Personally, I'm thinking Dunn. Murray, or Hield...

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Keeping Ryno destroys our top 7 window IMO. we will pick 8-12

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Originally Posted by Silverfoxx

Keeping Ryno destroys our top 7 window IMO. we will pick 8-12

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The lottery is still a thing.

In fact, if the last 10 years make a trend, the sweet spot is right there from 6th to 9th.

Smbd mentioned Valentine.
The fact that in January he is projected at no 15 does not mean that he will not go up...
There is great decrease of talent after 7-8th pick.
I see Valentine even in top 10.

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

The lottery is still a thing.

In fact, if the last 10 years make a trend, the sweet spot is right there from 6th to 9th.

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I just don't believe in luck. I believe in God and Destiny. But not luck. Placing your faith in luck is never a good thing. History shows us that 8-12 range stays the same, and rarely jump in the lottery. So I'll prefer to be a realist and accept our fate, instead of getting our hopes up high on "luck". Best case scenario I'm wrong and its a pleasant surprise lol.

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Originally Posted by pawel

Smbd mentioned Valentine.
The fact that in January he is projected at no 15 does not mean that he will not go up...
There is great decrease of talent after 7-8th pick.
I see Valentine even in top 10.

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The problem with Valentine is his lack of lateral quickness. He has real trouble to stay in front of the players he guard. For example Michigan state hide him on SF on the collegiate level. It won't be possible in NBA.
Now if this is only a conditionning issue, it's not a problem. Izzo and his staff doesn't push hard on the conditionning and focuses more on developping their players skills and IQ (I call it the KU-reversed). So big part of the scouting shoudl revolve around determining if his lack of speed is due to this point or to his very own limitations.

ButIMO, a player with unlimited range and great BB IQ is at the top of our list of need.

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Originally Posted by Silverfoxx

I just don't believe in luck. I believe in God and Destiny. But not luck. Placing your faith in luck is never a good thing. History shows us that 8-12 range stays the same, and rarely jump in the lottery. So I'll prefer to be a realist and accept our fate, instead of getting our hopes up high on "luck". Best case scenario I'm wrong and its a pleasant surprise lol.

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Your premise misses out on one factor. That luck isn't always good. The ball bounces many ways.

We'll see how things turn out in time.

I'm curious how you guys think Stefon Moody would fit on our roster with one of those 2nd round picks. Don't know much about him, just a few games I saw him in he seems like a baller.

I actually like moody more than Heild especially in the second round. Instant offense for both and both I think are bench players so second round and Moody for me.

I am starting to be more excited about our two second round picks (mid-late 30s) than our 9-12th pick

I am trying to find second favourite player for 9-14 range
1st is Valentine

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Originally Posted by pawel

I am starting to be more excited about our two second round picks (mid-late 30s) than our 9-12th pick

I am trying to find second favourite player for 9-14 range
1st is Valentine

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Luwawu. I had a vision.

I want either Dunn/Hield/valentine or Murray before him but no guarantee they are still available when we pick.


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Originally Posted by tdcreator

I actually like moody more than Heild especially in the second round. Instant offense for both and both I think are bench players so second round and Moody for me.

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Yeah, that's what I was thinking, I really like his aggressiveness and offense. I think in Gentry's system he could instantly help with spacing

Pascal Siakam could be our Dale Davis type in the 2nd round. We do need a protector
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...DC&FORM=VRDGAR

jrue holliday
jamal murray
marvin williams
anthony davis
Gestus ezeli

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Originally Posted by pawel

I am starting to be more excited about our two second round picks (mid-late 30s) than our 9-12th pick

I am trying to find second favourite player for 9-14 range
1st is Valentine

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what are the two second round picks again? are they like 37 and 40?

Right now it is 36th (Denver's) and 40th (worse of NOP and SAC )

It is useful to see tankathon.com website...

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Originally Posted by pawel

It is useful to see tankathon.com website...

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Wow thanks!

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Originally Posted by pawel

It is useful to see tankathon.com website...

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I visit that site every other day haha. I was watching Kris Dunn videos on there, and Silverfoxx you're right about this kid. He has all the makings of an all-star PG. If we landed the number two pick and I was the GM, I would have a tough time deciding between Ingram and Dunn.

I love Dunn but for this team we have to go Ingram at #2. We need a wing so badly it's not funny. Say we can't land a good FA and draft is our only option we have two very capable SGs with BDJ/QPon. This team has been looking for a wing the past decade plus.

1. Simmons
2. Ingram
3. Dunn
4. everyone else.

In other news, how Johnny Jones still has a job is beyond me. Granted, I haven't been able to watch as many games as I'd like, but oi friggin' vey. They might play themselves out of an NIT bid.

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Originally Posted by GuardianAngel25

I love Dunn but for this team we have to go Ingram at #2. We need a wing so badly it's not funny. Say we can't land a good FA and draft is our only option we have two very capable SGs with BDJ/QPon. This team has been looking for a wing the past decade plus.

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I agree with you about our desperate need for a SF. It's definitely the biggest need on the team, has been for a long time. Ingram has the potential to be an all-star caliber SF, so I would love to add him to this team. With that being said, we need a vocal leader on this team. We need someone who consistently plays with passion and intensity and Dunn is that kind of player. Ingram seems more reserved and laid back, kinda like AD. They can get fired up during certain moments and games, but we need someone to bring that consistently. Maybe we could take Ingram and AD will grow into that role. He's still extremely young, so I could see AD becoming that guy in a year or two. I think both have all-star potential, but I like Dunn's personality a little bit more. I still might take Ingram over Dunn, but right now it's a toss up for me. Ben Simmons is the prize of this draft, but if we landed the number 2 pick, I'd be equally excited about either Dunn or Ingram.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

In other news, how Johnny Jones still has a job is beyond me. Granted, I haven't been able to watch as many games as I'd like, but oi friggin' vey. They might play themselves out of an NIT bid.

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Sad to say, but they're more inconsistent than either NO team. Stomp Kentucky and should've beaten OU, then lose to Bama and get crushed by Arkansas. Really can't figure this LSU team out. If we lose one more game, I think we can kiss the tourney bid goodbye.

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Originally Posted by RUFshreve

I agree with you about our desperate need for a SF. It's definitely the biggest need on the team, has been for a long time. Ingram has the potential to be an all-star caliber SF, so I would love to add him to this team. With that being said, we need a vocal leader on this team. We need someone who consistently plays with passion and intensity and Dunn is that kind of player. Ingram seems more reserved and laid back, kinda like AD. They can get fired up during certain moments and games, but we need someone to bring that consistently. Maybe we could take Ingram and AD will grow into that role. He's still extremely young, so I could see AD becoming that guy in a year or two. I think both have all-star potential, but I like Dunn's personality a little bit more. I still might take Ingram over Dunn, but right now it's a toss up for me. Ben Simmons is the prize of this draft, but if we landed the number 2 pick, I'd be equally excited about either Dunn or Ingram.

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Good post, Dunn reminds me of a slightly less athletic, but better defensive john wall.

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Originally Posted by HornetGuru

Good post, Dunn reminds me of a slightly less athletic, but better defensive john wall.

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Yeah, I can see that. I think pairing Jrue with Dunn would be lethal. I feel like Dunn has less bust potential than Ingram, but Ingram might have a little higher ceiling and plays a bigger position of need.

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Originally Posted by RUFshreve

I agree with you about our desperate need for a SF. It's definitely the biggest need on the team, has been for a long time. Ingram has the potential to be an all-star caliber SF, so I would love to add him to this team. With that being said, we need a vocal leader on this team. We need someone who consistently plays with passion and intensity and Dunn is that kind of player. Ingram seems more reserved and laid back, kinda like AD. They can get fired up during certain moments and games, but we need someone to bring that consistently. Maybe we could take Ingram and AD will grow into that role. He's still extremely young, so I could see AD becoming that guy in a year or two. I think both have all-star potential, but I like Dunn's personality a little bit more. I still might take Ingram over Dunn, but right now it's a toss up for me. Ben Simmons is the prize of this draft, but if we landed the number 2 pick, I'd be equally excited about either Dunn or Ingram.

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Yea I definitely agree. I would like Dunn just as much talent wise just Ingram gets the nod for need. Really though idc as long as the player is a hit. Dunn does have a little fire this team could use. I don't think it's any knock to AD at all but I doubt he ever becomes a vocal leader. I see AD with the same personality as Duncan. Some players have it and some players just don't.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RUFshreve

Yeah, I can see that. I think pairing Jrue with Dunn would be lethal. I feel like Dunn has less bust potential than Ingram, but Ingram might have a little higher ceiling and plays a bigger position of need.

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This is exactly right, ingram has a higher cieling, but only by so much, but dunn's floor far exceeds ingrams. If I had to take 1, I would take Ingram. Go big or go home.

A source close to the game told me that Hield is not going to translate into an NBA player. Thoughts?

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Originally Posted by IamQuailman

A source close to the game told me that Hield is not going to translate into an NBA player. Thoughts?

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Nobody knows anything about anything (except for the Spurs) until well after the draft. Unless your source is with the Spurs, I'll take it with a grain of salt.

I just don't believe in Ingram at all.

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Originally Posted by frankatank109

Nobody knows anything about anything (except for the Spurs) until well after the draft. Unless your source is with the Spurs, I'll take it with a grain of salt.

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Maybe it is, maybr it isn't. I can't say, unfortunately. But I will say the person that i received this information from is a superior basketball mind.

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Originally Posted by Silverfoxx

I just don't believe in Ingram at all.

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Mark Ingram has proven himself the last couple of seasons, though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by frankatank109

Nobody knows anything about anything (except for the Spurs) until well after the draft. Unless your source is with the Spurs, I'll take it with a grain of salt.

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I was going to say the same thing. The guy could say he's the next MJ and it would mean the same to me. I don't hold my own or anybody else's opinion to highly on most players. Guys like Simmons and AD are a little more clear then others. Those guys you can basically near guarantee will be great unless they just don't put the work in and that's on them. Most players are just so hit and miss it is crazy.

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Originally Posted by Silverfoxx

I just don't believe in Ingram at all.

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Don't know where you can get that from? What do you not like about his game? Kid just turned 18 and has just about everything you want in a player. Shooting 42% from 3pt after missing near everyone of his first 25 3pointers taken is crazy much less a newly 18 year old freshman. Dunn is on tv so little so I don't know how you can believe he is this can't miss prospect while Ingram has bust written all over him. Besides reading some stuff I don't know where you get that from. I'm a Duke fan and this kid is the real deal. He is a very similiar player to Paul George with his skill set and play style. Outside of Simmons being an amazing gifted passer Ingram is right there with him in near everything. His shooting is far superior while he has one of the best strokes in college basketball. If you think Simmons is scary and Ingram is going to be a bust I honestly don't know what you are watching and if that's the case the rest of the draft should make you terrified.

I have seen you say he is not Durant because he can't shoot it like him and that's false. He is shooting the 3 better on almost the exact amount of shots per game. He started off slow to the season which he has completely come out of that slump and been dominating. Shooting like 43% from 3 after missing his first 25 and averaging around 22 ppg. He is a better defender then Durant also which is to be taken into account. Durant was a better rebounder then him and shooting was near equal. Not much seperates those guys when coming out. I'm not saying he is going to be as good as Durant but he has every bit of talent and an amazing skill set to be as good if not better. He has PG13 written all over him. Just turned 18 years old!

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Originally Posted by GuardianAngel25

I was going to say the same thing. The guy could say he's the next MJ and it would mean the same to me. I don't hold my own or anybody else's opinion to highly on most players. Guys like Simmons and AD are a little more clear then others. Those guys you can basically near guarantee will be great unless they just don't put the work in and that's on them. Most players are just so hit and miss it is crazy.

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I mean, why have this thread then?

Is Dunn DWade?

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Originally Posted by IamQuailman

I mean, why have this thread then?

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It's nice to see what everybody says and talk about guys but predicting someone won't be good and holding that opinion high is a little much. He could very well be 100% correct but time and time again the experts are proven wrong. some guys are just clear transitional talents and that's one thing. Guys like Heild are so difficult to predict if he is going to suck or be the next Ray Allen. It's just so hit or miss. I'm not saying I don't listen to it or take it into account but I'm sure you know what I mean.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

Is Dunn DWade?

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I think he is a Westbrook/Wall mix with his own little flair to he game. I try to watch him on my computer as much as I can stream and he has all the potential. He turns the ball over way too much which is a problem especially being a junior. His 3 point shot numbers look better then earlier on in his career but his mid range and ft is terrible for a junior. If he was a freshman I would be so concerned but as a junior it would be nice to see him progress more. When he gets to the NBA the only thing that will hold him back is turnovers and his shooting. If he can fix those he can be great. His skill set puts him on another level then that next group in the draft but I would put him in a class behind Simmons and Ingram.

So since everybody likes to go back and blame Dell for having guys get injured what about Dunn? He has some injury concerns so if Dell drafts him and he continually gets hurt that must be his fault right?

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Originally Posted by IamQuailman

A source close to the game told me that Hield is not going to translate into an NBA player. Thoughts?

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Definitely take that with a grain of salt. Hield is a basketball winner, not player. The guy has an alpha mindset that we do not currently possess on this team. If you're the big dog in college and have that lackadaisical look while playing, you will continue to be that in the professional league.

Hield is a winner.

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Originally Posted by IamQuailman

I mean, why have this thread then?

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I agree with this line of thinking. We should be able to criticize and question a player just as often as we laud and sing praise about a player. If the NBA draft is as hit and miss as posters here have postulated, which it is, then posts like Quail's are just as "absurd" as those like the majority of posters in this thread.

With that said, maybe providing some thoughts on why your source thinks Hield is not an NBA talent will help transition the thread further.

I saw Valentine play last night, in what was a very tough conference matchup vs OSU. I thought he came out amazing. He really was all over the court. I am not in love with him as our top pick, but if we made some trades and found him in the middle of the first, I would be game for him. He has a good head on his shoulders, and that can get you pretty far while the rest of your game is coming around (or going downhill as Andre Miller shows us).

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Originally Posted by NOLa.

Definitely take that with a grain of salt. Hield is a basketball winner, not player. The guy has an alpha mindset that we do not currently possess on this team. If you're the big dog in college and have that lackadaisical look while playing, you will continue to be that in the professional league.

Hield is a winner.

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So was Trey Burke

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Originally Posted by Hoopsguy

3. I would look to sign a guy like Miles Plumlee. Not a great player, but better than Asik and better fit for our system. He gets up and down the floor better and he can catch. He won't cost a fortune.

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You and me both brother. I would prefer Mason, but Miles is a fun kid to watch. I think given more min. than what he is getting up in Milwuakee, and teamed with a guy like AD at the pf spot, he could be better than what we have had at center since Chandler left. His defense isn't lock down, but he can still defend, and is quick enough to recover if his man pulls him away from the basket.

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Originally Posted by NOLa.

Definitely take that with a grain of salt. Hield is a basketball winner, not player. The guy has an alpha mindset that we do not currently possess on this team. If you're the big dog in college and have that lackadaisical look while playing, you will continue to be that in the professional league.

Hield is a winner.

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Coach's son, 1st in the gym and last out, scrappy, hustle guy?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by IamQuailman

Coach's son, 1st in the gym and last out, scrappy, hustle guy?

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

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Don't forget to mention his motor and team-first attitude.