2014 Playoffs - Geaux CP3

Koufas costs more than Withey and is always dead on offense. Save the cash and the asset (PJax).

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

We have a big that weighs 260, is an above average rebounder, and who isn't dead on offense?

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Withey will put weight on and I am pretty confident he can get to 250-260. He looks very promising moving forward. I've been saying this about him since we drafted him. Give him time. Remember we had this convo back on last day of FA and you were calling for Tyler zeller and thought it was funny that I said withey can be our answer moving forward at center. I'd say he's doing just fine so far. Just needs to add some weight.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

Koufos is dead on offense.

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Based off one playoff game? Lol. He has a career 53% FG. A career 65% from 0-3ft. That's almost 9% higher than Withey. While having 10% higher DRB and 6% higher TRB %. Even if you looked at Witheys per36 Koufos has him bear by nearly 4 rebounds and 4 points.

I'm not saying we should give the guy a max or anything. But for PJax and scraps? Heck yeah.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

Koufas costs more than Withey and is always dead on offense. Save the cash and the asset (PJax).

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Exactly. There are not the big body centers as there were back in the day. The game has changed drastically. I can only think of 1-2 that need to be accounted for and thats Howard and gasol. We don't need to get a guy just cause he he weighs 260+. Cause honestly I think that's all he'd be adding is the big body. Could we use him? Yea, but not for the sake of giving up assets,

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

Based off one playoff game? Lol. He has a career 53% FG. A career 65% from 0-3ft. That's almost 9% higher than Withey. While having 10% higher DRB and 6% higher TRB %. Even if you looked at Witheys per36 Koufos has him bear by nearly 4 rebounds and 4 points.

I'm not saying we should give the guy a max or anything. But for PJax and scraps? Heck yeah.

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Ok first of all a guys fg% doesn't prove whether he is any good on offense or not. Especially when he hardly is used on that side of the ball. Also, withey is a rookie. He's not exactly blowing him out of the water for having 5 more years of nba experience. I know withey is older for being a rookie but he's still just that. Also, per36 is not a viable stat to compare these 2. Neither of them are viable candidates for the per36 stat. Koufos on his career doesn't even average half of that 36. So, it's meaningless.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

Withey will put weight on and I am pretty confident he can get to 250-260. He looks very promising moving forward. I've been saying this about him since we drafted him. Give him time. Remember we had this convo back on last day of FA and you were calling for Tyler zeller and thought it was funny that I said withey can be our answer moving forward at center. I'd say he's doing just fine so far. Just needs to add some weight.

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I think people are confused. I like Withey a lot. My wanting Koufos has nothing to do with Withey. He fills a void on our team for cheap.

He has 25-30 pounds on Withey, is less than 1 yr older, and is more efficient around the basket and rebounding. I view him as a cheap upgrade. Maybe one day in 2 years or more Withey is that player, but if given the chance I take the guy now if I can get him for cheap.

Honestly I'd rather move Ajinca and still develop Withey while having Koufos.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

I think people are confused. I like Withey a lot. My wanting Koufos has nothing to do with Withey. He fills a void on our team for cheap.

He has 25-30 pounds on Withey, is less than 1 yr older, and is more efficient around the basket and rebounding. I view him as a cheap upgrade. Maybe one day in 2 years or more Withey is that player, but if given the chance I take the guy now if I can get him for cheap.

Honestly I'd rather move Ajinca and still develop Withey while having Koufos.

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Oh ok well I'm misunderstanding you then. I thought u meant for him to replace withey. You want him to replace frenchie? Ehh idk I think frenchie has been coming along pretty good if he can cut down the fouling. I'm not gonna put up too much of a defense for him tho, lol

I know withey needs to improve his conditioning this off season for sure. He gets winded pretty quick.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

Oh ok well I'm misunderstanding you then. I thought u meant for him to replace withey. You want him to replace frenchie? Ehh idk I think frenchie has been coming along pretty good if he can cut down the fouling. I'm not gonna put up too much of a defense for him tho, lol

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Frenchie is a better player now than Withey but for this team I want Withey because he's younger. Koufos in my eyes gives us a chance to do that because he has so much NBA experience but is still young. He can take the abuse while Withey packs on weight.

However I'm not nearly as confident that Withey can hit 260 pounds. If he could hit 250 I'd be ecstatic. The sad fact is we happen to have nothing but rail thin bigs. Steamer was hot trash. Koufos is only like 100x better for only costing about 600k more. Heck he'd cost less than Jordan Hill will this summer I bet.

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I think overall the playoffs are going to be real good. I'm not really rooting for anyone, since the Pels are not in, but I do want GSW to take down the Clippers. Also my darkhorse for the second season is Washington.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

Frenchie is a better player now than Withey but for this team I want Withey because he's younger. Koufos in my eyes gives us a chance to do that because he has so much NBA experience but is still young. He can take the abuse while Withey packs on weight.

However I'm not nearly as confident that Withey can hit 260 pounds. If he could hit 250 I'd be ecstatic. The sad fact is we happen to have nothing but rail thin bigs. Steamer was hot trash. Koufos is only like 100x better for only costing about 600k more. Heck he'd cost less than Jordan Hill will this summer I bet.

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Yea I can agree with it for the most part. I'm just not of the mindset that we need a big to take that punishment you speak of cause there aren't many bigs that are dishing it out in today's nba.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

Yea I can agree with it for the most part. I'm just not of the mindset that we need a big to take that punishment you speak of cause there aren't many bigs that are dishing it out in today's nba.

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Sure. If we are talking about spending 9M or something a year, I agree. Koufos is literally 3M. He's 2M cheaper than Rolo and he gives us a big body when we do play those teams.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

Sure. If we are talking about spending 9M or something a year, I agree. Koufos is literally 3M. He's 2M cheaper than Rolo and he gives us a big body when we do play those teams.

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We played Howard with ryno and did just fine. We play Howard 4x, gasol 4x. Gasol is more of a finesse big man anyways. Although he can do both. If your talking about replacing frenchie with Koufos then I could Probably get on board but I just don't see the need to pay all 3 of those guys and we have Davis too? Nah, I'm good on paying all 3.

The arguments against Koufos, make me lol.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

We played Howard with ryno and did just fine. We play Howard 4x, gasol 4x. Gasol is more of a finesse big man anyways. Although he can do both. If your talking about replacing frenchie with Koufos then I could Probably get on board but I just don't see the need to pay all 3 of those guys and we have Davis too? Nah, I'm good on paying all 3.

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You act like paying all three is some sort Eric Gordon like sin. If you could pull Koufos for Jackson/Ely you'd barely be paying 8.5 million for Davis, Ajinca, Koufos and Withey. Less than what Gortat is probably gonna make this offseason. You also flip a 5'9 SG for some muscle your team lacks. How is this even a question?

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The Brooklyn Nets are looking legit. The next round will be interesting.
Today: Miami Heat vs. Charlotte Bobcats
The Heat had swept the Bobcats in the regular season.
The Bobcats had never won a playoff game.
It looks like a sweep.
Big Al will have big numbers against the Heat.
But LeBron made 37.7ppg while shooting 62.9% from the field against the Bobcats this season.
At least they are not embarrassing the Hornets name. ….. They’ll start next season.
And the Clippers except of CP3 and Redick, the other guys should start playing basketball.
Happy Eastern Pelicans fans!!!

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Originally Posted by DefensiveMind

You act like paying all three is some sort Eric Gordon like sin. If you could pull Koufos for Jackson/Ely you'd barely be paying 8.5 million for Davis, Ajinca, Koufos and Withey. Less than what Gortat is probably gonna make this offseason. You also flip a 5'9 SG for some muscle your team lacks. How is this even a question?

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Withey Koufos
59%. 54% TS%
53%. 53% eFg%
56%. 23% FTR
8%. 13% ORB%
17%. 21% DRB%
13%. 17% TRB%
6%. 4% BLK%
6%. 4% AST%
11%. 12% TOV%
12%. 17% USG%
122. 111 ORTG
108 103 DRTG
.128. .134 WS/48

So with this here. It is easy to see why I think there is no need to give up any assets for him. Withey already trumps him in a few categories including the widest margin of them all in offensive rating. Yea Koufos has a better rebounding rate but I'm pretty confident with more pt and nba experience he will match or exceed those numbers by Koufos. Not like they are dramatically better anyways. So, ws\48 shows they are already affecting the bottom line(winning)about the same. I think we are just fine with frenchie/withey/Davis at the center spot. This team needs a 3&D SF In the worse way and it'll improve every other position on the team by itself. Withey currently weighs 235 I believe. So, I don't think there is any problem getting him to 245 By next season. So, like I said there's no need for Koufos cause he weighs an extra 15-20lbs cause there's not a bunch of bruising big men in today's nba. Besides Howard and that's only 4 games of our season and I think we did just fine against him this season.

Joel Meyers on commentary in the HOU-POR game. Cool.

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Originally Posted by Sovereign

Joel Meyers on commentary in the HOU-POR game. Cool.

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With Chris Webber, too! I am rooting for this announcing crew more than either team actually playing.

I'm rooting for Portland in this one.

I can't stand Howard or Harden.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

I'm rooting for Portland in this one.

I can't stand Howard or Harden.

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I hear ya but my sister and brother are Houston natives and my little nephew is a huge rockets fans. Sooooooo as much as I hate both those guys. I have to root for my little nephew to be happy.

Shaq just called out Howard. Love it when people realize that Dwight isn't "great.'

Joel Meyers on TNT. I knew we had one of the better guys calling our games 82 times a year.

2 Harden Flops.... 2 of them in 3 minutes... I hate the flopping. I'm glad we don't have anyone on the team that does that.

This game has been crazy.

10 seconds left in the game down by two and Harden didn't even play for the shot. Immediately tried to get the foul call and when it didn't come put up an awful attempt. I liked him so much when he was in OKC but his game is completely built around getting calls. He's just annoying now. I'm happy Portland stole one. I hope it's a sweep.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

10 seconds left in the game down by two and Harden didn't even play for the shot. Immediately tried to get the foul call and when it didn't come put up an awful attempt. I liked him so much when he was in OKC but his game is completely built around getting calls. He's just annoying now. I'm happy Portland stole one. I hope it's a sweep.

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He is easily 1 of the most annoying players to watch. That was a horrible call at the end tho where Howard got called for a foul to give Portland 2 fts instead of Howard shooting 2 to take the lead.

To add to that. This was a horrible officiated game on both sides. These nba refs really need to get better for the better for the game.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

To add to that. This was a horrible officiated game on both sides. These nba refs really need to get better for the better for the game.

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Yeah, the Clippers-Warriors game was also terribly officiated. Hope they step up their game for sure...but at least GS and POR won.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

10 seconds left in the game down by two and Harden didn't even play for the shot. Immediately tried to get the foul call and when it didn't come put up an awful attempt. I liked him so much when he was in OKC but his game is completely built around getting calls. He's just annoying now. I'm happy Portland stole one. I hope it's a sweep.

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Yeah, I can't imagine anyone being a fan of Harden outside Houston and OKC. His "game" is completely built around hitting 3s and drawing contact.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

To add to that. This was a horrible officiated game on both sides. These nba refs really need to get better for the better for the game.

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Yep. The Howard no travel which got Rolo fouled out was awful. LMA was just stupid on that moving screen. Then the Harden jump into Batum for the two FTs later. Portland had some calls too for sure, like the Howard foul out was a bad one. But man, I like Lilliard so much more than Harden now. He goes for the throat and has ice in his veins, he takes the big shot. Harden flops and tries to jump into players without even attempting to hit the shot to win the game. It's almost embarrassing what basketball has become for some players compared to the 90s.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

Yep. The Howard no travel which got Rolo fouled out was awful. LMA was just stupid on that moving screen. Then the Harden jump into Batum for the two FTs later. Portland had some calls too for sure, like the Howard foul out was a bad one. But man, I like Lilliard so much more than Harden now. He goes for the throat and has ice in his veins, he takes the big shot. Harden flops and tries to jump into players without even attempting to hit the shot to win the game. It's almost embarrassing what basketball has become for some players compared to the 90s.

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As much as I believe Lilliard is overrated, I cannot deny that he is an extremely clutch player. He looked very explosive to the basket too...he needs to attack more often. He would become a far more efficient player that way. Great games nevertheless by him and LMA.

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Originally Posted by PelsFan2313

As much as I believe Lilliard is overrated, I cannot deny that he is an extremely clutch player. He looked very explosive to the basket too...he needs to attack more often. He would become a far more efficient player that way. Great games nevertheless by him and LMA.

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Oh sure, I'm not talking about how bad or good of a player he is. But a guy who takes and hits the big shot and does it with no fear on his face, I like. This game just stood out so much to me the difference between Harden and Lilliard.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

Oh sure, I'm not talking about how bad or good of a player he is. But a guy who takes and hits the big shot and does it with no fear on his face, I like. This game just stood out so much to me the difference between Harden and Lilliard.

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I find it insane that I already consider Lilliard as one of top 5, top 10 clutch shooters in the league. The dude is a second-year player. He lives for these moments.

Lillard is a beast. Period,

Patrick Beverly. Best perimeter defender in the league? I don't think anyone is even close to his level.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

Lillard is a beast. Period,

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thank you. There is nothing overrated about this guy. I'll trade anybody on this team not named AD for him in a heartbeat.

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Originally Posted by UptownFuz504

thank you. There is nothing overrated about this guy. I'll trade anybody on this team not named AD for him in a heartbeat.

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I'm not sure I'd move Jrue for him. Maybe that seems a bit crazy to some but we didn't get to really see Jrue play this year. Yes Lillard is a better shooter but honestly that's the only thing he's better than Jrue at and that's not even by a huge margin. Jrue actually shot a better FG% and they were both 39% from 3pt. When you combine how bad Lillard is on defense and the fact that Jrue has a WAY high assist % (39% compared to 25%) along with better rebounding, overall assists, steals, blocks. . .the argument is a lot closer.

For this team as constructed, I would personally prefer Jrue I think.

Called it way back. The Rockets are going no where with Harden and Howard. One plays no D. The other doesn't have his head screwed on right.

They'd be the perfect guys to put on our team, though. They would all be subservient to the greatness that is the Brow.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

I'm not sure I'd move Jrue for him. Maybe that seems a bit crazy to some but we didn't get to really see Jrue play this year. Yes Lillard is a better shooter but honestly that's the only thing he's better than Jrue at and that's not even by a huge margin. Jrue actually shot a better FG% and they were both 39% from 3pt. When you combine how bad Lillard is on defense and the fact that Jrue has a WAY high assist % (39% compared to 25%) along with better rebounding, overall assists, steals, blocks. . .the argument is a lot closer.

For this team as constructed, I would personally prefer Jrue I think.

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No way. Lol..holiday for Lillard with no hesitation. Lillard and Davis pairing would be devastating for the league. I drool just thinking about it. Stats aren't always the end all be all especially the % stats. Lillard is impossible to contain on the perimeter.

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

No way. Lol..holiday for Lillard with no hesitation. Lillard and Davis pairing would be devastating for the league. I drool just thinking about it. Stats aren't always the end all be all especially the % stats. Lillard is impossible to contain on the perimeter.

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Lillard is what Eric Gordon should be. Imagine we could have a Lillard type player and keep Holiday.
Yeah that's right Lillard and Davis in one team would dominate the league.

lot of the media saying Vogel could lose his job if the pacers lose this series, what do you guys think of this whole thing with the pacers? also would love vogel here... just saying, not trying to get into whole fire monty thing

Man I am sorry but I cannot cheer for cp3. I will always hate the way he forces his way out west too. I hate buddy buddy basketball. Chris Paul and especially his brother were attention wh***s who couldn't wait to get to LA. I hope they never win anything and as karma is building it looks as if he won't.

Plus I rather holiday over lillard all day. Lillard blows on defense

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Originally Posted by kclaboy504

I hear ya but my sister and brother are Houston natives and my little nephew is a huge rockets fans. Sooooooo as much as I hate both those guys. I have to root for my little nephew to be happy.

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I'd have to find something else to make them happy :hihi:

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Originally Posted by pelicans_82-0

Lillard is what Eric Gordon should be. Imagine we could have a Lillard type player and keep Holiday.
Yeah that's right Lillard and Davis in one team would dominate the league.

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He'd have to learn how to pass first. His assist % actually went down from his rookie year. Tyreke has a 5% higher assist % this year. Jrue 15%. Lillard would add one skill that we don't have and that's the last shot guy. People forget how he was taken to task on defense by Jrue And Tyreke. His usage is higher which is exactly what we don't need.

I really like Lillard and the attitude he plays with but when you take everything into account including the fact that Jrue and Lillard are 1 month apart in age and I don't think it's as clear cut as people make it. I wouldn't expect Portland to want to trade for Jrue. I think each is a good fit for their team.

Lillard will give you 30 but he'll allow the opposing guard to do the same he's Brian Roberts on D he also is not a true pg.

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Originally Posted by Mythrol

He'd have to learn how to pass first. His assist % actually went down from his rookie year. Tyreke has a 5% higher assist % this year. Jrue 15%. Lillard would add one skill that we don't have and that's the last shot guy. People forget how he was taken to task on defense by Jrue And Tyreke. His usage is higher which is exactly what we don't need.

I really like Lillard and the attitude he plays with but when you take everything into account including the fact that Jrue and Lillard are 1 month apart in age and I don't think it's as clear cut as people make it. I wouldn't expect Portland to want to trade for Jrue. I think each is a good fit for their team.

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Jrue and Lillard are both great players. There is no doubt.
The sad thing is that we have that type of player in our roster.
I don’t know, but there is maybe a possibility that Eric Gordon is playing bad on purpose to lower his trade value and can go to a team without this team is giving up too much.
Lillard can play sg too, like e.g. Westbrook or Dragic.
Hypothetical our starting lineup could look like:
Holiday
Lillard or Harden
Evans
Anderson
Davis
By the way Eric Gordon had more potential than Harden (this why I listed Harden).
However it is great to see Lillard playing well in his first playoff game.
Portland vs. Houston …
Wow it is astonishing how D12 is playing against mediocre defense now.
I can remember the Orlando Magic D12 was dominant.

I don't have to hate CP to hate the Clippers. I hate Blake Griffin, DJ, and Barnes for acting like punks on the court. I hate Paul and Griffin for flopping all over the place. I hate their announcers who believe everything the Clippers do should be front page headline news. I hate their entitled fans for talking trash year round and, ironically, always complaining about the refs (you couldn't find a clippers fan 5 years ago as well.). Add that to the fact that I get to root against Chris Paul. I hold nothing against him for leaving: I'm glad he left since it resulted in our getting AD, but the "I left for wining bulls***" is just that. Not many teams I despise, but the Clippers are one I just can't stand. Go Warriors!

This Grizz Thunder game is pretty darn good.