If we pick Burke…?

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06-18-2013, 06:25 AM
kclaboy504

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. West

If only EG could stay healthy... If only Aminu could shoot the 3... If only Lopez rebounded in double figures...

All completely possible in the realm of things, but I sure wouldn't bet on any of them happening. But this is a Trey Burke thread. I was asked directly my opinion of a situation that involved Burke, so I answered. I don't really feel like debating the merits of trading Gordon again.

Yet u wanna bring over granger...the irony.
06-18-2013, 06:26 AM
kclaboy504

Quote:

Originally Posted by HornetGuru

i think both the pelicans and the clippers do it, they get someone who is considered cp3 like to learn behind cp3 and the pelicans get bledsoe, the defensive oriented PG the pelicans want to pressure the opponents PG and fits monty's system.

thing that sucks though if we could have burke on a rookie salary for 4 years but we would have to pay bledsoe prob 8 million a year for 4 years.

I know many might disagree with me but I'd rather Burke over Bledsoe.
06-18-2013, 06:27 AM
da ThRONe

Quote:

Originally Posted by morsatun

So if that is the case, what is the answer to the other questions?

Honestly I do not know. My guess is the simple solution we try to keep the better players and trade the lesser ones. Personally I think Vasquez isn't as good as the numbers he put up and has the highest trade value so he would be the player I shop around the hardest. I do think some teams like Roberts he was consistently on some top rookie boards last year. I think you have to keep at least one of Vasquez or Roberts and trade the other.

As far as Vasquez agreeing to back up Burke he has no choice.
06-18-2013, 07:00 AM
Eman5805

Quote:

Originally Posted by kclaboy504

I know many might disagree with me but I'd rather Burke over Bledsoe.

Each other's strength is the other's weakness.

Burke is great at offense, but his defense will be suspect until proven otherwise with questions about his athleticism. Bledsoe has unquestioned athleticism, great defense, but his offense is suspect.
06-18-2013, 08:10 AM
RaisingTheBar

1 is Burke ready to start in the NBA straight away? Day 1 starter
If the answer is yes, then do we keep Vasquez as backup or trade Vasquez and trust Roberts? I wouldn't be upset with keeping GV for a year while letting his contract end, or trade him. Either way is fine with me. Roberts is good depth on a small contract. He shouldn't see the floor between Burke and Rivers
If the answer is yes, would Vasquez agree to be Burke's back up? Doesn't matter what he agrees to, he doesn't have a choice
If the answer is no, can Vasquez really refuse given the fact that he has a year left in his contract? He is not the type of person to do that, we could give him 5 mins a game and he would play his *** off for those 5 mins
If the answer to question 1 is no, then again do we keep Vasquez to start at the beginning and then transition into Burke? Or do we look for an additional upgrade for the PG position? At most it would be GV starting for the first month of the season, but IMO Burke is a day 1 starter.
06-18-2013, 08:13 AM
MichaelMcNamara

I guess I don't understand: If Burke is this good and a sure fire Day one starter, why don't the Magic take him at #2?
06-18-2013, 08:15 AM
RaisingTheBar

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I guess I don't understand: If Burke is this good and a sure fire Day one starter, why don't the Magic take him at #2?

Who said they won't? The true priorities of teams are not what you and I may think. They may not value the PG position as much as SG or vice versa.
06-18-2013, 08:19 AM
MichaelMcNamara

I guess I am saying under the scenario that he gets to 6, which is the point of this thread.

I just see such a glaring long term need for the Magic at PG. I hope they consider him more, because if they pass on him and people on this board are right, it will be Marvin Williams/CP3 all over again.
06-18-2013, 08:24 AM
da ThRONe

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaisingTheBar

Who said they won't? The true priorities of teams are not what you and I may think. They may not value the PG position as much as SG or vice versa.

How many teams passed up on Steph Curry or Rajan Rondo for that matter. Just because the Magic have a need and pass has no barring on what type of player Burke is day 1 or day 1000.
06-18-2013, 08:31 AM
BIGBREED

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe

How many teams passed up on Steph Curry or Rajan Rondo for that matter. Just because the Magic have a need and pass has no barring on what type of player Burke is day 1 or day 1000.

Agreed!
You can't judge a player's talent just bcuz a team pass on him w/ their selection!
06-18-2013, 08:45 AM
aas3452

If its up to me, I'll keep everyone on the team unless a good trade comes along. Having 4 quality guards(gordon, vasquez, rivers & burke) creating and facilitating for everyone is a luxury not all teams have.
06-18-2013, 08:50 AM
RaisingTheBar

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe

How many teams passed up on Steph Curry or Rajan Rondo for that matter. Just because the Magic have a need and pass has no barring on what type of player Burke is day 1 or day 1000.

I think you quoted the wrong person.
06-18-2013, 08:53 AM
da ThRONe

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaisingTheBar

I think you quoted the wrong person.

No I was furthering your point.
06-18-2013, 08:55 AM
MonsterMash

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I guess I am saying under the scenario that he gets to 6, which is the point of this thread.

I just see such a glaring long term need for the Magic at PG. I hope they consider him more, because if they pass on him and people on this board are right, it will be Marvin Williams/CP3 all over again.

I mean the Magic need everything. They've got a nice forward and center, but can use depth there, desperately need a go-to scorer, need a pg to eventually take it from Nelson. As far as position scarcity goes, PG 'is' the easiest position to find at least a passable starter in.

I don't think Burke would drop out of the top 5 except for the fact that only one team ahead of us really needs a pg. Charlotte and Phoenix both are tied to Walker and Dragic via draft status and money, Wash has Wall, Cle has Irving. That to me creates a little value with Burke and is more the reason he drops to 6 than anything to do with him.
06-18-2013, 08:58 AM
RaisingTheBar

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe

No I was furthering your point.

I was about to say WTF fellow Burker! :hihi:
06-18-2013, 09:05 AM
Bee-Fense

I think if Burke goes to us his numbers will look better than if he went to another team. New Orleans has been very friendly to point guards' numbers over the years, especially recently, and I think Burke might end up averaging 9 assists for us if we do take him.

I also think he's probably the best passer in this draft and the best I've seen at running the pick n roll in a while. I have very little doubt he'll be good offensively.

Defensively, he's going to be horrible to start. But here's the thing: so is every other young point guard. Kyrie Irving is absolutely horrible on defense right now, yet he's still considered a top 10 point guard and one of the top 2 young guys to have. Defense is technically 50% of the game, but for point guards, I think offense matters more. Put it like this, I'm taking Kyrie Irving over Avery Bradley any day of the week and I think anyone else is too.

Plus Burke actually showed moments where he can be a good defender and has a really good wingspan, so I don't think he's completely destined to be a bad defender.
06-18-2013, 09:08 AM
UNO Gracias

I hope we draft Burke or trade for Rondo. I don't want to go into next season with GV as our best option and Rivers and Roberts backing him up. That might enduce vomiting.
06-18-2013, 09:18 AM
da ThRONe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee-Fense

I think if Burke goes to us his numbers will look better than if he went to another team. New Orleans has been very friendly to point guards' numbers over the years, especially recently, and I think Burke might end up averaging 9 assists for us if we do take him.

I also think he's probably the best passer in this draft and the best I've seen at running the pick n roll in a while. I have very little doubt he'll be good offensively.

Defensively, he's going to be horrible to start. But here's the thing: so is every other young point guard. Kyrie Irving is absolutely horrible on defense right now, yet he's still considered a top 10 point guard and one of the top 2 young guys to have. Defense is technically 50% of the game, but for point guards, I think offense matters more. Put it like this, I'm taking Kyrie Irving over Avery Bradley any day of the week and I think anyone else is too.

Plus Burke actually showed moments where he can be a good defender and has a really good wingspan, so I don't think he's completely destined to be a bad defender.

This is the part I think gets overlooked. The ability is there the question is will he improve everything from his technique to his conditioning to be able to do so consistently. What I hear about Burke I think the answer is yes.
06-18-2013, 09:33 AM
PELICANSFAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe

How many teams passed up on Steph Curry or Rajan Rondo for that matter. Just because the Magic have a need and pass has no barring on what type of player Burke is day 1 or day 1000.

Exactly. How is that a judgement of how good a player will be?
06-18-2013, 09:35 AM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

Exactly. How is that a judgement of how good a player will be?

Its not. I never said it was. I said if they do pass and this board is right, they will be kicking themselves like ATL did. That's all
06-18-2013, 09:38 AM
Nightshade

First time poster.

I think if we draft Burke we keep GV. When you look at GV's college ape and skill set I believe he gets moved to SG and he'all do fine there he was successfully in college playing off the ball and defensively he would be better playing the 2. River last season did much better and looked more comfortable at PG playing on the ball.

Draft in Burke would solidify our back court and give Monty a lot of versatility.

PG Burke, Rivers, Roberts
SG Gordon, Vasquez
06-18-2013, 09:57 AM
PELICANSFAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Its not. I never said it was. I said if they do pass and this board is right, they will be kicking themselves like ATL did. That's all

Must have misunderstood. This sounds like you are questioning those who think he is good-

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I guess I don't understand: If Burke is this good and a sure fire Day one starter, why don't the Magic take him at #2?
06-18-2013, 10:03 AM
MichaelMcNamara

And then when asked a follow up, my next reply was.....
06-18-2013, 10:11 AM
MonsterMash

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee-Fense

Plus Burke actually showed moments where he can be a good defender and has a really good wingspan, so I don't think he's completely destined to be a bad defender.

A good example is in the tournament, he shut down Nate Wolters in the first round game, and Wolters is a decent NBA prospect. That was also a very poor offensive effort for Burke, which brings a different question - if he can sustain that type of defensive effort to go with his stronger offensive games. He might have struggled defensively more because he carried such a heavy offensive load. Either way, its a positive sign that he at least seems to have potential to be more than a matador on the defensive end.
06-18-2013, 10:19 AM
Purple Haze

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe

I think Burke IQ and shooting allows him to start day one. He's continue to add muscle from his freshman year to now. If we take him might as well let him take his lumps. Trey is the kid that is motivated by failure and doubters so I'm not worried about easing him in.

Agreed. We're rebuilding, right? Let him take his lumps and build from there. As for the other questions, I think nolaslim nailed it. We trade Vasquez and have Rivers back up Burke.
06-18-2013, 10:22 AM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonsterMash

A good example is in the tournament, he shut down Nate Wolters in the first round game, and Wolters is a decent NBA prospect. That was also a very poor offensive effort for Burke, which brings a different question - if he can sustain that type of defensive effort to go with his stronger offensive games. He might have struggled defensively more because he carried such a heavy offensive load. Either way, its a positive sign that he at least seems to have potential to be more than a matador on the defensive end.

I watched every second of that game, and while Nate Wolters shot poorly, he got by Burke almost any time he wanted. I understand how the box score looks, but I would be willing to watch that game again - have us all watch it with an open mind if someone can find video of it. I am telling you, Wolters, a 2nd round pick at best, got past him at will.

Don't believe me, let's find the video and really watch it
06-18-2013, 10:23 AM
Purple Haze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightshade

First time poster.

I think if we draft Burke we keep GV. When you look at GV's college ape and skill set I believe he gets moved to SG and he'all do fine there he was successfully in college playing off the ball and defensively he would be better playing the 2. River last season did much better and looked more comfortable at PG playing on the ball.

Draft in Burke would solidify our back court and give Monty a lot of versatility.

PG Burke, Rivers, Roberts
SG Gordon, Vasquez

Welcome, and not totally off base at all. Though Vasquez is scary guarding, well anyone, I think he might be ok guarding backup SGs.

Problem with that is, there is no WAY he agrees to that plan long term. He got a taste of starting and doing pretty darn well at it. He'll leave us for nothing if we try and push him to backup 2. Best to get his value sooner than later and trade him. Mason or another vet can do just as well as he can at backup 2 for the time being.
06-18-2013, 10:35 AM
kclaboy504

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee-Fense

I think if Burke goes to us his numbers will look better than if he went to another team. New Orleans has been very friendly to point guards' numbers over the years, especially recently, and I think Burke might end up averaging 9 assists for us if we do take him.

I also think he's probably the best passer in this draft and the best I've seen at running the pick n roll in a while. I have very little doubt he'll be good offensively.

Defensively, he's going to be horrible to start. But here's the thing: so is every other young point guard. Kyrie Irving is absolutely horrible on defense right now, yet he's still considered a top 10 point guard and one of the top 2 young guys to have. Defense is technically 50% of the game, but for point guards, I think offense matters more. Put it like this, I'm taking Kyrie Irving over Avery Bradley any day of the week and I think anyone else is too.

Plus Burke actually showed moments where he can be a good defender and has a really good wingspan, so I don't think he's completely destined to be a bad defender.

I disagree with offense matters more with the pg. Not with the makeup of this team currently. Vasquez was ok on the offensive end of the floor. His defense absolutely killed us. He's the first line of defense. If the opposing pg can penetrate at will then it breaks down your entire defense. As seen last year time and time again. I honestly don't think Burke will be as bad as ppl r thinking defensively. He will be an upgrade over gv that's for sure. I seriously think many ppl on here are overreacting big time on that front. Just cause he isnt Quick As rose, westbrook Etc. 90% of the pgs In the league arent. I'm taking Irving over Bradley as well. Irving's offense is light years better than Bradley. So, no matter how much better defensively Bradley is. It doesn't make up for the lack of offense. Bad comparison for that point. IMO. Better one would be Irving to rondo. I'm taking rondo for other things besides his defense but it factors in big time when considering. Even tho Irving is much better on offense than rondo. I also think McW has better vision than Burke at this current moment. Being the better passer as well. I'm not against taking McW either. If that dude had shot a little better then I think he def goes 1st off the board. As far as pgs go. I love McW length and quickness on the defensive side of the ball. He is a beast at stealing the ball too. He has very good handles but makes poor choices at times costing high turnover numbers. His turnovers and shooting are his 2 problems. Both of those are fixable with hard work and dedication.
06-18-2013, 10:36 AM
kclaboy504

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

I hope we draft Burke or trade for Rondo. I don't want to go into next season with GV as our best option and Rivers and Roberts backing him up. That might enduce vomiting.

Is UNO coming around finally??? Lol.
06-18-2013, 10:38 AM
UNO Gracias

I have always been on the Burke bandwagon (go check my history, that and he is a Michigan boy).
06-18-2013, 10:39 AM
kclaboy504

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

I have always been on the Burke bandwagon (go check my history, that and he is a Michigan boy).

Nahi know. I was referencing the vomiting if Vasquez was our starter again next year.
06-18-2013, 11:02 AM
fullcourtpress

sign brandon jennings or jeff teague so everybody understands we cant pick for position despite what the team actually TELLS us. They are liars until draft time.
06-18-2013, 12:34 PM
Eman5805

Quote:

Originally Posted by fullcourtpress

sign brandon jennings or jeff teague so everybody understands we cant pick for position despite what the team actually TELLS us. They are liars until draft time.

Now that I believe. Everything is misdirection and smoke screen this time of year.
06-18-2013, 03:12 PM
MonsterMash

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I watched every second of that game, and while Nate Wolters shot poorly, he got by Burke almost any time he wanted. I understand how the box score looks, but I would be willing to watch that game again - have us all watch it with an open mind if someone can find video of it. I am telling you, Wolters, a 2nd round pick at best, got past him at will.

Don't believe me, let's find the video and really watch it

You likely watched it closer than I did. I'm admittedly going off of results and a few specific things I remember from it. Food for thought, then.
06-18-2013, 03:16 PM
da ThRONe

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonsterMash

You likely watched it closer than I did. I'm admittedly going off of results and a few specific things I remember from it. Food for thought, then.

Yeah I don't recall MM version at all. Wolters had a tough time against Burke from my recollection.
06-18-2013, 04:37 PM
FlyGirl

Trey Burke interview with Sean Kelley...

http://www.nba.com/video/teams/pelic...n1mov-2513025/
06-18-2013, 05:27 PM
BallSoHard

Honestly, ill take the Burke fascination over the cp3 is coming back delusion anyday.
06-18-2013, 05:32 PM
iNolaNightmare

Honestly, I'm just ready for this to be over with. At the end of the day, we are all bickering about this and that, but I can't wait to see the look on some of y'all's faces when Greivis Vasquez starts at point guard come Pelicans opening night.
06-18-2013, 08:17 PM
Nightshade

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purple Haze

Welcome, and not totally off base at all. Though Vasquez is scary guarding, well anyone, I think he might be ok guarding backup SGs.

Problem with that is, there is no WAY he agrees to that plan long term. He got a taste of starting and doing pretty darn well at it. He'll leave us for nothing if we try and push him to backup 2. Best to get his value sooner than later and trade him. Mason or another vet can do just as well as he can at backup 2 for the time being.

If he wants to be a starter he is going to have to settle for bottom half teams. He is good enough to be on any roster but to play for a contender he will have to be a reserve.

With Gordon's injury history and that he can come off the bench as a perimeter shooter and backup PG he can still roll up quality minutes

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