Since everyone else is doing it.... (Gordon Trade Idea)

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

Some people on here think he is the 2nd coming of Michael Jordan because he has 1 good half against us :rolleyes:

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I think this is emans point, who has said this ?

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

I think this is emans point, who has said this ?

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I'm not going to go back and find all the people gushing over Klay Thompson, but it's pretty well known that this board love his game. Most of it picked up after the game where he went off on us in the 1st half (yet they forget that we shut him down in the 2nd). Anyway, you can see how people respond to my proposal by saying "oh, they would never do that!"

I mean, on the nose, it's a bad trade for us, as Pelicans78 pointed out. That much is obvious. We are giving up Gordon AND Aminu AND a 1st round pick. That isn't great value. I, however, look at it as a precursor deal to the CP signing, and that's where the value shifts in our favor.

I completely disagree with you about cp3 even having a remote chance to come back. And with that being said you can't make a trade IMO as a precursor to a move that you isn't likely to happen. Unless cp3 came to dell behind closed doors and said he'd sign you don't do this, IMHO.

I also am not in favor of giving out our first this year at all.

So you have to argue that Klay and Barnes are not that good to convince people that GS will go for trading them away for the large question mark in Gordon, "they are overrated, Klay doesn't even shoot that well, Barnes is struggling, etc." And then have to go back and argue that they are good enough with enough potential to not only help our team in the long and short run but also are good enough to convince CHRIS PAUL of returning. They are giving up way to much potential for a diminished chance at becoming a contender on the back of Eric Gordon, their team has already made large strides from the last couple of years and with Klay and Barnes both being so young with that much potential and already being on a playoff team they really don't need to give up on their potential to push them over the top. The whole idea around this trade is bringing Chris Paul back to New Orleans which is just stupid, I'm sorry it is, I can't believe we are back on Chris Paul again. No way in hell is Demp's planning on completely undoing the Chris Paul trade - "yea I'll trade him away to make him happy for a few years, get rid of all the crappy players and contracts and get some good pieces and then just bring him back through trading the players we got for him" - sounds great, and COMPLETELY UNREALISTIC

Don't live in the past, JG. Put Chris Paul out of your mind.

I agree, the CP3 talk is ridiculous. If it were to somehow happen for whatever miracle reason, then great. But in no way do we have much of a chance of that happening, and wishing or making trades to try to improve that isn't going to make much (or any) difference. Let it go.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

I completely disagree with you about cp3 even having a remote chance to come back. And with that being said you can't make a trade IMO as a precursor to a move that you isn't likely to happen. Unless cp3 came to dell behind closed doors and said he'd sign you don't do this, IMHO.

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In more or less ways, you'd need some insurance, but yes that is a big aspect to a deal like this. Now, if we wanted to wait it out, and not make this trade at the deadline, we could wait until the off season, and basically trade Biedrins to Charlotte into their cap space (since Diop would be off the books), and it's essentially the same deal. That would give us more time to gauge where CP is.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

I also am not in favor of giving out our first this year at all.

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I agree. That's why I made it "lottery protected."

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Originally Posted by jgman

So you have to argue that Klay and Barnes are not that good to convince people that GS will go for trading them away for the large question mark in Gordon, "they are overrated, Klay doesn't even shoot that well, Barnes is struggling, etc." And then have to go back and argue that they are good enough with enough potential to not only help our team in the long and short run but also are good enough to convince CHRIS PAUL of returning. They are giving up way to much potential for a diminished chance at becoming a contender on the back of Eric Gordon, their team has already made large strides from the last couple of years and with Klay and Barnes both being so young with that much potential and already being on a playoff team they really don't need to give up on their potential to push them over the top. The whole idea around this trade is bringing Chris Paul back to New Orleans which is just stupid, I'm sorry it is, I can't believe we are back on Chris Paul again. No way in hell is Demp's planning on completely undoing the Chris Paul trade - "yea I'll trade him away to make him happy for a few years, get rid of all the crappy players and contracts and get some good pieces and then just bring him back through trading the players we got for him" - sounds great, and COMPLETELY UNREALISTIC

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What I'm trying to say is that Klay and Barnes are unknowns. Klay is an offensive player with a PER of 12.9, and PER measures offensive efficiency. I, however, think he can be much more productive with a guy who can create for him. This is where Chris Paul comes in. Curry is a great complimentary piece, but he isn't a creator. He can't even create for himself. Paul could make Klay a damn good player, and it's the same deal with Barnes. Barnes could really be something if he plays with a guy like Paul who could create for him, but Curry can't do that in GS, so their numbers will always suffer because of it. GS recognizes this, and they want to get a playmaker, which is why they are after Gordon.

Again, this is a deal that hinges on CP. We would need some sort of assurance that he would want to come here, or that we would at least be in serious consideration as a potential suitor. I think it's very possible, considering our roster. Even if we don't make this trade, and we find some way to free up a few extra million dollars, we can afford to give CP the max. We are an attractive place for him, especially with guys like Anderson and Davis. Rivers is developing nicely, IMO. He will be an attractive piece to play with (takes pressure off of CP). And you either keep Gordon or you trade him for 2 potentially elite role players.

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

Again, this is a deal that hinges on CP. We would need some sort of assurance that he would want to come here, or that we would at least be in serious consideration as a potential suitor. I think it's very possible, considering our roster. Even if we don't make this trade, and we find some way to free up a few extra million dollars, we can afford to give CP the max. We are an attractive place for him, especially with guys like Anderson and Davis. Rivers is developing nicely, IMO. He will be an attractive piece to play with (takes pressure off of CP). And you either keep Gordon or you trade him for 2 potentially elite role players.

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Sorry, you never get those assurances in a mid-year trade. I highly doubt (and that is being generous) that CP would come back to NOLA and he certainly would not give up $$$ to do so. What about NOLA would convince him that this is where he needs to go to win?

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Originally Posted by PELICANSFAN

Sorry, you never get those assurances in a mid-year trade. I highly doubt (and that is being generous) that CP would come back to NOLA and he certainly would not give up $$$ to do so. What about NOLA would convince him that this is where he needs to go to win?

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Pennies on the dollar for a guy like him, especially when you consider endorsements. And yes, he would come back to NOLA (I believe) for a good shot at multiple championships. I listed the attractions of this franchise to him multiple times above. We are VERY attractive team to a PG.

If we keep Gordon, then he has another elite player that he can play next to (along with future AD). Anderson provides elite spacing - think DWest x2. Monty is a great coach to play for, and CP has openly stated how much he respects Monty. Local ownership, new GM in Demps, fan support, team that drafted him, etc... The list goes on and on. People think that since we traded him away, we can never re-acquire him again because it would be too weird, but that stuff happens a lot more than people would think.

The main idea is that this team makes a lot of sense for CP to sign with just in terms of winning. That's what he cares about, and CP + Gordon (or Thompson and Barnes) + Davis + Anderson is about as good as it gets.

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Originally Posted by 42

You can have 2 designated players, but you can only offer one when you have none on your team.

Chris Paul can be signed to a 5 years deal via Bird Rights provided he stays with the Clippers. He can't get the 5 years with any other team. This doesn't get into that designated player thing. That is more for people coming off rookie deals it seems.

Remember, the new CBA has mechanisms to help teams keep their players. This is one.

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Thank you for the clarification.

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

Pennies on the dollar for a guy like him, especially when you consider endorsements. And yes, he would come back to NOLA (I believe) for a good shot at multiple championships. I listed the attractions of this franchise to him multiple times above. We are VERY attractive team to a PG.

If we keep Gordon, then he has another elite player that he can play next to (along with future AD). Anderson provides elite spacing - think DWest x2. Monty is a great coach to play for, and CP has openly stated how much he respects Monty. Local ownership, new GM in Demps, fan support, team that drafted him, etc... The list goes on and on. People think that since we traded him away, we can never re-acquire him again because it would be too weird, but that stuff happens a lot more than people would think.

The main idea is that this team makes a lot of sense for CP to sign with just in terms of winning. That's what he cares about, and CP + Gordon (or Thompson and Barnes) + Davis + Anderson is about as good as it gets.

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I'm not sure this assumption is accurate. According to ESPN (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/s...geles-clippers), LAC can offer CP3 $108 million this offseason. What is the max the Hornets can offer him?

According to Forbes, he makes $6 million per year in endorsements (http://www.forbes.com/pictures/mli45gmml/10-chris-paul/). His NBA salary still makes up about 75% of his income.

chris paul is not coming back
GS is not trading thompson AND barnes for a SG on a max contract who can't get on the floor and a SF who can't dribble or shoot

other than that, great trade

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Originally Posted by greewe

I'm not sure this assumption is accurate. According to ESPN (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/s...geles-clippers), LAC can offer CP3 $108 million this offseason. What is the max the Hornets can offer him?

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That's for 5 years. We can only give him 4 years, but we can give him a max deal. I think LAC can give him $3 million more per year, or something like that. That equates to around $12 million over 4 years. Again, on a contract worth over $80 million + endorsements, that's not even 10%. Would you sacrifice 10% of your salary for a better shot at multiple championships if you were CP? I know I would...

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

That's for 5 years. We can only give him 4 years, but we can give him a max deal. I think LAC can give him $3 million more per year, or something like that. That equates to around $12 million over 4 years. Again, on a contract worth over $80 million + endorsements, that's not even 10%. Would you sacrifice 10% of your salary for a better shot at multiple championships if you were CP? I know I would...

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If he cared so little about money and wanted only a title why should he go here? I'm sure another team with much better chances than us (almost any team at this point) would offer him a ton of money and a better chance at the finals. It's not like he's 22 and with lots of time for a team to develop and reach the finals

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Originally Posted by Kurgan

If he cared so little about money and wanted only a title why should he go here? I'm sure another team with much better chances than us (almost any team at this point) would offer him a ton of money and a better chance at the finals. It's not like he's 22 and with lots of time for a team to develop and reach the finals

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The money is not the issue. He will get a max deal. Other than the clippers (because of the 5th year) no other team can offer him more money than we can. So it pretty much comes down to where does he want to play, but I agree with you there are other teams that are going to contend next season. Don't see him coming back here unless he is completely satisfied with Monty, Demps and Benson.

The extra year a team with a player's rights can offer can play a role when a player is rationally considering their own injury situation. If they are high on their own durability, then in they could reason to themselves that they'll get a good contract in that 5th year anyway, maybe even a max, and that deal's first year may very well exceed the value in the 5th year of the base deal.

So, it's not about the sum. It's about the amount of guaranteed money compared to the player's `personal guarantee' that they can make that money later.

It's not the same thing, but Landry took a pay day in a one season deal rather than less per year but more total over multiple years here.

Guys I really dont think a Gordon trade is going to happen. If it does it will happen at the deadline next season. I am starting to think that the great plan Dell has for this team going forward. If you look at all the moves made since the Chris Paul trade this, team is putting themselves in a particular position. The rest of our moves, I believe, will begin with a minor trade before the deadline, possibly netting us a second round pick and a minor player. (Xavier is dead weight). Next we will draft wisely getting the best player available. We will sign two or three more mid level guys in FA. Bring back Lopez and Aminu. Enter next season with a deeper bench, a more aggressive Anthony Davis, a better more efficient Austin Rivers and still a ton of cap space. Finish around the 8th or 9th in the West. In the offseason we will hit the FA period hard. There is where the championship will be won. In the 2014 FA class. We are, IMO, using the next two years to develop depth and develop our core. We have youth, money and time on our side right now.

I dont expect us to move Gordon until we know exactly what the basketball landscape will look like around this time next year. The whole key to this is if Gordon is healthier next season we will be competing for a playoff spot. Thats going to be key for us getting FA to come here. If the team is like it is this year, next year then we wont get anybody. IMO, Gordon is too "valuable" to be moved.

http://www.v6performance.net/gallery...0/1239dumb.gif

I respect slim for providing some good points. Right now, I just don't know. I mean, the pieces are there. It's just will anyone actually pull the trigger.

With CP3, how do we know he is not in cahoots with the Drama Queen himself(Dwight Howard) to land in Dallas? Hypothetically, if we made this trade and we don't sign CP, where does that leave us? With the draft, I assume we draft BPA in the lottery. But now we have a whole lot of cap space...Pek? Mayo?

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e8...byJesusCry.jpg

I'd also like to point out that we are in the midst of a rebuild with the 2nd youngest team in the nba, I think, and that our FO and coach are preaching patience and that our team is not good right now so any trade like this one, though coupled with FA acquisitions, where we are instantly trying to become contender status is highly highly unlikely.

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Originally Posted by jgman

I'd also like to point out that we are in the midst of a rebuild with the 2nd youngest team in the nba, I think, and that our FO and coach are preaching patience and that our team is not good right now so any trade like this one, though coupled with FA acquisitions, where we are instantly trying to become contender status is highly highly unlikely.

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thats why i like trading for barnes, he will be really good 3 years down the road and we save so much cap, when davis is at his all star level gordon will be around 27-28 and prob in a wheel chair

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

That's for 5 years. We can only give him 4 years, but we can give him a max deal. I think LAC can give him $3 million more per year, or something like that. That equates to around $12 million over 4 years. Again, on a contract worth over $80 million + endorsements, that's not even 10%. Would you sacrifice 10% of your salary for a better shot at multiple championships if you were CP? I know I would...

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Let me get this right. You think CP3 thinks he has a better shot to win multiple championships with our roster versus his roster with the Clippers who have the third best record in the league despite missing 12 games. I just want to make sure i'm understanding correctly.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

Let me get this right. You think CP3 thinks he has a better shot to win multiple championships with our roster versus his roster with the Clippers who have the third best record in the league despite missing 12 games. I just want to make sure i'm understanding correctly.

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With out question. LAC has nothing moving forward except for Griffin. I already addressed this here:

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

Lamar Odom - 33, declining
Caron Butler - 32, declining
Willie Green - 31, declining
Matt Barnes - 32, declining
Jamal Crawford - 33, 4 year deal, will probably start declining next year
Chauncey Billups - 36, nearly out the league
Grant Hill - 40, nearly out the league

The only hope that franchise has is Blake Griffin, and he is super injury prone. DeAndre Jordan is making over $10 million dollars, but he is only playing 24 minutes per game because he fouls too much and can't hit FTs. He is also just a dumb player. Bledsoe is their best young prospect, but he plays PG like CP, so he is a backup for them. Seriously, there is no upside to the LAC franchise moving forward.

Compare that to our young, up-and-coming roster, and it's a clear choice IMO. Obviously, I'm biased, but it's a logical conclusion.

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http://www.pelicansreport.com/showth...=1#post1040161

i really dont see CP3 wanting to come back to nola. he moved on and i think we need to do the same.

Quite a few Clippers are older and declining but in a market like L.A., I'm pretty sure they won't have any trouble getting talented players to go play alongside CP3 and Blake.

CP3, his brother, wife, and agent would probably see if they could get to NY and probably a few other places before coming back here. I'm sorry, I just don't see it happening. Not trying to crush anyone's dream but I, myself, just don't see it.

But my question is if you think that CP3 thinks though nola, not you. Because in the end, thats who's opinion matters with this (not that yours doesn't in general). I think CP3 will stick with the Clippers as I think most people do. I dont think 12 Million is pennies to CP3 either. This is a short term business and he has his kids to think about as well. He's got what 7-9 years left. We're talking about losing 12 mill in 4 years, which doesnt include the variance of what he'd lose in year 5 if this next deal versus year 1 in the second new deal. So we're probably talking about 17 Million over the span of 5 of his last 9 years which also doesn't include the variance in sponsorship deals that he'd in in LA versus NO? Just don't see it.

Eric Gordon is not Kobe, not DWade, or any other guy like that. So is it a shock that the Hornets are listening to offers for him? Not at all. If we weren't, I'd say Dell was not doing his job. But actually trading him, unless some miraculous deal came along, wouldn't be very smart. When you factor in his injury history, the other team has the upper hand. Whether he wants to be or not, he's under contract for a couple years, he hasn't said anything that paints a bad picture regarding him and the franchise since we matched the offer, so why are people so quick to dump him? We aren't getting Klay Thompson or Harrison Barnes for Eric Gordon. The speculation I've seen surrounding Houston probably isn't realistic. Which leads me to believe any offer we may have on the table for Gordon right now, could very well still be there a year from now.

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Originally Posted by HunnyB

Quite a few Clippers are older and declining but in a market like L.A., I'm pretty sure they won't have any trouble getting talented players to go play alongside CP3 and Blake.

CP3, his brother, wife, and agent would probably see if they could get to NY and probably a few other places before coming back here. I'm sorry, I just don't see it happening. Not trying to crush anyone's dream but I, myself, just don't see it.

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Hey, it's all good! You don't have to worry about hurting my feelings or anything. This is just a little fantasy of mine. Chris Paul fits in perfectly with my suggested lineup, so that's my fantasy haha. No biggie if you don't think it's likely to happen. I appreciate opposing opinions, so long as they are constructive.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

But my question is if you think that CP3 thinks though nola, not you. Because in the end, thats who's opinion matters with this (not that yours doesn't in general). I think CP3 will stick with the Clippers as I think most people do. I dont think 12 Million is pennies to CP3 either. This is a short term business and he has his kids to think about as well. He's got what 7-9 years left. We're talking about losing 12 mill in 4 years, which doesnt include the variance of what he'd lose in year 5 if this next deal versus year 1 in the second new deal. So we're probably talking about 17 Million over the span of 5 of his last 9 years which also doesn't include the variance in sponsorship deals that he'd in in LA versus NO? Just don't see it.

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Again, just looking at the rosters, I don't see how CP could think that LAC has a brighter future than we do. Davis is going to be a big attraction for FAs, and if CP enjoyed playing with DWest, then he's going to LOVE play with Ryan Anderson. I just see Davis being a better version of TC in regards to the PnR, and Anderson being a better version of DWest in the PnP, so what's not to love? Gordon just puts it over the top. That is a great, young nucleus that you can have moving forward, and who knows how good Rivers can become (I think he can be a significant player for us). Lopez is very solid, and guys like Vasquez and JSmith off the bench to keep things moving. It's just a much better, more sustainable roster.

He said this today:

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"It is what it is," Paul said. "I like the colors, though, and the logo. Whatever makes the city happy. At the end of the day, the team has to do what it has to do."

"I so was so happy when I found out that the game is going to be there," Paul said. "I miss New Orleans and I tell people that all the time. I love our team in L.A. and I love the weather, but I miss the people in New Orleans."

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http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ss...2/post_96.html

It think it's all of our fantasies lol.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

It think it's all of our fantasies lol.

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Then stop fighting me on it!!!


Haha just playing :hihi:

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

He said this today:


http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ss...2/post_96.html

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I was just coming to bring that to you to make you happy. :hihi:

Chris always does know what to say when the recorder is in his face though. :hihi:

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Originally Posted by HunnyB

I was just coming to bring that to you to make you happy. :hihi:

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Haha, beat you to it! ...for once :p

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Originally Posted by HunnyB

I was just coming to bring that to you to make you happy. :hihi:

Chris always does know what to say when the recorder is in his face though. :hihi:

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he probably hates all those cali snobs over there.. id welcome him back with open arms, if he ever came back

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

Then stop fighting me on it!!!


Haha just playing :hihi:

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LOL Stop fighting it; just let it happen. That was my pickup line in college. I kid, or am i?

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Originally Posted by bojangles837

he probably hates all those cali snobs over there.. id welcome him back with open arms, if he ever came back

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I know he came from a small city but Chris Paul is probably loving everything about cali except the traffic. I'm quite sure no one is snobbish towards him (maybe Laker fans) so he probably couldn't care less about the snobs.

Chris Paul almost sued the league when stern vetoed the Lakers trade, that is how bad he wanted to leave this place. Idc if he says I love the people there in a media interview that is what he is supposed to say the dude is not coming back plain and simple

CPME can stay in LA.

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Originally Posted by nolaslim213

He said this today:


http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ss...2/post_96.html

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Haha he said that at the end of the article. Check out the rest of it. It would be a good team with him on it but I just can't see it

I don't get why anyone here even cares about anything CP3 has to say. He's not on this team anymore...his opinions on anything NOLA is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned and as far as his "identity" as a Hornet being lost when we change the name...that was lost the day he decided he didn't want to be here anymore IMO....

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Originally Posted by Miss_318

I don't get why anyone here even cares about anything CP3 has to say. He's not on this team anymore...his opinions on anything NOLA is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned and as far as his "identity" as a Hornet being lost when we change the name...that was lost the day he decided he didn't want to be here anymore IMO....

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I mean of course the guy has some affinity towards the city of New Orleans. It was the city that drafted him, the city he's played in the longest thus far, his brother got married here and his sis-in-law is from here. Not to mention he still has to come back here at least twice a year to play us. He's not going to say anything terrible. I just wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into everything he has to say.

The great thing about this trade is it allows us to focus our cap to shore up our bench. Think of it this way. We could have a roster like:

Vasquez/Rivers
Thompson/Henderson
Barnes/Brewer
Davis/Anderson
Lopez/Smith

Plus our lotto pick (between 6-10).

CP3 or no CP3, this sets us up nicely.

Can't really bothered to look it up, but does anyone know if the Knicks can amnesty Stoudemire next year?
If they can I really thick CP3 goes to NYK to finally team up with Melo and Chandler rather than stay a Clipper.

No way he is a Pelican in 2014.

Don't care where Chris Paul goes, frankly.

What I do care about is the 300 guests looking at our site right now. Can't imagine why. Ain't nothing happening.

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Originally Posted by Eman5805

Don't care where Chris Paul goes, frankly.

What I do care about is the 300 guests looking at our site right now. Can't imagine why. Ain't nothing happening.

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They must know something we dont.

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Originally Posted by AUSSIE_PELICAN

Can't really bothered to look it up, but does anyone know if the Knicks can amnesty Stoudemire next year?
If they can I really thick CP3 goes to NYK to finally team up with Melo and Chandler rather than stay a Clipper.

No way he is a Pelican in 2014.

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Knicks used their Amnesty on Billups, I think. So they are done.

They can waive and stretch.

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Originally Posted by 42

Knicks used their Amnesty on Billups, I think. So they are done.

They can waive and stretch.

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Yes you are right.
TY