1 Month Till The Trade Deadline!!!

[MichaelMcNamara]

THIS. IS. THE. PROBLEM.

This is exactly what Dell got himself into with Eric Gordon. I'm not one of this fans who thinks a player will leave. I think NOLA can be on par with South Beach if you're a young millionaire. Food, nightlife, festivals, big events, weather, women... I think more players will want to be here when we start making playoffs.

My problem is that Dell will resign Asik. Because he has to! Which means, almost always, that he'll overpay. He'll overpay for a defensive center coming off a year in which he appears to have regressed defensively and offensively looks as terrible as advertised.

Is this starting to sound familiar.

Go back and read the opinions about how Dell had to match Gordon's offer because of what we gave up to get Gordon.

Dell should trade Asik, get an asset, and then if he really believes based on what he's seen in the first 41 games of this season, that Asik is the ideal center to pair with AD over the next 4 years... He should pursue him his offseason without being handcuffed to him because of the asset he gave up to acquire him.

But it is not exactly abnormal. We just had it turn out the worst possible way with Gordon. Washington HAD TO re-sign Gortat because they made the same trade we made with Asik. The Suns had to extend Bledsoe, and so on and so on. It is not abnormal.

I think the biggest mistake people could make is convincing themselves two situations are the same just because they have a few similarities.

I don't think you make your decision on Asik based on how Gordon turned out. I would argue that Gortat would be far more similar, and that seems fine so far.

It is like when Raiders fans say that they shouldn't draft the OT from Iowa this year because Robert Gallery busted. I never understand that logic. As for "overpaying" - all free agents get overpaid except for the max ones and the min ones. Having his Bird Rights put the Pelicans in a unique position that they wouldn't be in if they took your tactic.

I would love to have my cake and eat it too with regard to our center position. Yes, ideally, we would have the pick and get the guy we want in 2016 free agency, but Dell identified the guy he wanted and went and got him - giving up a pick that is projected to be Frank Kaminsky for the ability to get him in the system a year early and his Bird Rights. Now, people can question whether they like him as a player, but I think that is a different conversation.

[HornetGuru]

Where do I sign? Thing is I just can't see Warriors going for that. They are 33-6, why make any moves?

he's a free agent and they might not be able to resign him, instead of losing him for nothing they get yet another player to stretch the floor for them.

[MichaelMcNamara]

But we aren't free to engage in the market even if Asik is off the books. We would still be right up against the cap meaning we'd only have the MLE and BAE. People greatly undervalue the trade Dell worked out last summer to even get Asik here.

The reasons why we are likely to resign Asik are: 1) He saves AD from taking beatings every night. 2) He is having his best rebounding year ever next to AD and his rim defense has been good (our team defense has been bad). 3) We have his Bird's Rights so we can sign him even though we don't have the cap space to sign other players. 4) There is very little if any benefit to letting him walk when you can lock him up for multiple years before the cap increase. 5) Because of higher yearly raises he has INCENTIVE to sign with us.

In your mind Dell HAS to resign Asik. In our organization's mind they WANT to resign Asik.

And on top of that, I have to add: Imagine having this philosophy with all our players. Continuity is a real thing in basketball. Sometimes people act like if you don't make the playoffs, then it is a lost season and you just go into sell mode. If Asik is here for the foreseeable future, who is to say that the next 42 games won't be huge for him in our system, playing with our other core pieces, becoming more of a defensive vocal leader, etc.

At some point, the team can't just look at everybody as an asset. There has to be some continuity, and I am telling you all that Jrue, AD, and Asik are long term pieces in Dell's mind. Not just assets ready to be moved.

[speedyG]

I was gonna make a thread but I'll just post here. What about this: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kbt3k4f

Houston sends: Terrence Jones, Clint Capela and Papalanikao
NOP sends Anderson

We know Houston wanted Anderson bad. Capela is a good prospect and Jones was playing great before his injury


I think Ryan is the piece most movable piece at this point, he's a luxury player that's been hurting the team more than helping it but does have trade value

[HornetGuru]

terrence jones is a freak, i'd do that trade in a heartbeat. I also like Papa's game a lot.

[UNO Gracias]

Tbh, I like what Jimmer is doing (now given minuets), and I don't see (at the moment) backup guard being an issue. We are still a month out from the deadline, so if he can continue to improve, unless something great is out there, I say, hold the line.

I really like our SF duo of Cunningham and QPon. Both of those guys have played solid ball, and would serve just the same purpose on any other team. They aren't liabilities, and in fact are growing assets.

Asik would be an easy move, but I like the idea of keeping him around for next year. He will come cheaper than what he is making now (his two prior seasons he was making less than $6mm, he knows that's his market, not the $11mm he is currently making). I think give him a legit coach, or a legit NBA system and he returns back to the guy he has been his entire career, and not this anomaly. This season is an outlier for many of our players (look how many guys are posting away from their avg. stats). Keep him.

This season is a bust, and I would prefer not moving anyone at the risk of hampering our next GM/Coach.

[NMThreeMVP]

But we aren't free to engage in the market even if Asik is off the books. We would still be right up against the cap meaning we'd only have the MLE and BAE. People greatly undervalue the trade Dell worked out last summer to even get Asik here.

The reasons why we are likely to resign Asik are: 1) He saves AD from taking beatings every night. 2) He is having his best rebounding year ever next to AD and his rim defense has been good (our team defense has been bad). 3) We have his Bird's Rights so we can sign him even though we don't have the cap space to sign other players. 4) There is very little if any benefit to letting him walk when you can lock him up for multiple years before the cap increase. 5) Because of higher yearly raises he has INCENTIVE to sign with us.

In your mind Dell HAS to resign Asik. In our organization's mind they WANT to resign Asik.

1. I was all on board for getting Asik here. Bravo Dell.

2. I agree with all your reasons why we would resign Asik

3. Want to and have to, are not mutually exclusive. If Dell goes into the offseason hoping he can get Asik at $10m annually (an overpay IMO), sets his limit at $12m, and another team offers Asik $13m, or Asik says he'll take $12m from Team X, but wants $13m or an extra year from Pelicans, what do you think Dell is going to do? He wants to resign Asik, and he has to resign Asik.

It's a basic value proposition for me. If I'm confident I can resign Asik at a market value that I agree with, I keep him. If I have any doubt at all, I trade him, because otherwise I put myself in a position where I have to overpay.

Overpaying Asik the year before you're finally free of Eric Gordon's contract is the last thing I want this team to do.

[UNO Gracias]

But who is going to pay Asik $10 mm? Phil Jackson is running the Knicks now, so not even they will. Asik's next contract will be right around what a 15-30 ranked center will get paid. This seasons salary is not the norm even for him. He is a $7-$9mm center, and because you can get his production for closer to that $7mm you would be silly to move him. No agent in the world is getting $10mm+ for a center of Asik's abilities. It's just to crazy to even think about. He is a good center, but what he is good at doesn't mean he is $10mm+ good at it.

Here are some fun numbers when coming up with how much he will probably get paid next season.
http://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/center/

[NMThreeMVP]

But it is not exactly abnormal. We just had it turn out the worst possible way with Gordon. Washington HAD TO re-sign Gortat because they made the same trade we made with Asik. The Suns had to extend Bledsoe, and so on and so on. It is not abnormal.

I think the biggest mistake people could make is convincing themselves two situations are the same just because they have a few similarities.

I don't think you make your decision on Asik based on how Gordon turned out. I would argue that Gortat would be far more similar, and that seems fine so far.

It is like when Raiders fans say that they shouldn't draft the OT from Iowa this year because Robert Gallery busted. I never understand that logic. As for "overpaying" - all free agents get overpaid except for the max ones and the min ones. Having his Bird Rights put the Pelicans in a unique position that they wouldn't be in if they took your tactic.

I would love to have my cake and eat it too with regard to our center position. Yes, ideally, we would have the pick and get the guy we want in 2016 free agency, but Dell identified the guy he wanted and went and got him - giving up a pick that is projected to be Frank Kaminsky for the ability to get him in the system a year early and his Bird Rights. Now, people can question whether they like him as a player, but I think that is a different conversation.

You also don't base your decision on Asik based on how Bledsoe and Gortat turn out. Just because situations are similar doesn't mean they are the same, right? And I'm not sure the Bledsoe and Gortat signings are great things long term for Wizards or Suns.

I really don't mind at all the move Dell did to acquire Asik. Fair value in my opinion.

But I can separate what Dell did 8 months ago, from what Dell ought to do now.

NOW, Dell has an asset that is potentially worth more to a contender or a team looking to move salary than the 1st round pick Dell gave up to acquire the asset. He should explore his options, check in with Asik and his agent, and have a game plan based on today forward, not 8 months ago.

Is Asik a top 10 center?
Will the agent demand we pay Asik like a top 10 center?
Does Asik fit with this team and AD from a chemistry standpoint?
How much do we want to pay Asik?
What is Asik's trade value?
What role do we think of Ajinca and Withey going forward?
What are our alternatives at Center, if not Asik?

...these are questions Dell and this team should be answering.

[MichaelMcNamara]

I am so curious to see what Asik gets offered. Offense usually gets rewarded in unrestricted free agency. My guess is that he gets 9-10 mil per year, which will be about 10-12 percent of the new cap ( or the equivalent of 6.5-7.5 mil today)

That is fine by me

[UNO Gracias]

Man, how I wish Gortat was our problem (and I'm sure AD does too). Gortat is going to be like Sarbonis playing until he is 50.

[Sleeper]

Anyway that Asik takes a back loaded deal? Say maybe 5 million next year, then 7, and then 9?

[NMThreeMVP]

And on top of that, I have to add: Imagine having this philosophy with all our players. Continuity is a real thing in basketball. Sometimes people act like if you don't make the playoffs, then it is a lost season and you just go into sell mode. If Asik is here for the foreseeable future, who is to say that the next 42 games won't be huge for him in our system, playing with our other core pieces, becoming more of a defensive vocal leader, etc.

At some point, the team can't just look at everybody as an asset. There has to be some continuity, and I am telling you all that Jrue, AD, and Asik are long term pieces in Dell's mind. Not just assets ready to be moved.

I mean, if your going to keep asserting that you know what's in Dell's heart and soul... It's not fun to argue with you!

But as to continuity, it matters for teams like Warriors, Hawks, maybe Wizards and Raptors.

But it's obviously less a factor for Bulls, Dallas, Rockets, Grizzlies, Cavs, and Thunder. In fact, continuity seems to be something only a few teams value, and only when they're streaking.

[BP225]

I do wonder if a more balanced center like Koufos would be the better option to pursue. But Asik's flaws are being magnified by this system/team/coach. The Bird Writes had an article on how often Tyreke and Asik are getting blocked, and Asik is getting blocked an astounding 26.1% of the time, about twice as often as when he was the starter in Houston.
http://www.thebirdwrites.com/2015/1/...-stuffed-birds

[UNO Gracias]

I am so curious to see what Asik gets offered. Offense usually gets rewarded in unrestricted free agency. My guess is that he gets 9-10 mil per year, which will be about 10-12 percent of the new cap ( or the equivalent of 6.5-7.5 mil today)

That is fine by me

I'll buy that. I honestly don't know how a guy with a lopsided skill set could demand the money that some people think he is going to get. Morrow last year comes to mind for me. He isn't a starting center, so that isn't the comparison I am trying to make, but he showed he had an amazing skill that the Spurs won a title on the back of. Even then he got less than what I thought he was going to get (as you well know). Asik has one skill, and one skill only. He does it well, but not Noah, Horford, or Ben Wallace in his prime well, and probably not as well as most men making $2-3mm less than him are making. His contract isnt a burden yet, and he has proven he can be an asset when used appropriately. It would be silly to jettison him for a draft pick.

[speedyG]

What about Kevin Martin? Minny needs a PF and has no use for him. We would have a clutter of SG's, but he would be a better fit playing off the ball while Jrue and Tyreke create

Ryno for Kevin and Mo Williams works- http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kty7rvj

Jrue-KMart-QPon-AD-Asik with Tyreke off the bench

[UNO Gracias]

I thought it was decided that Ryno, AD, and Asik were amazing when on the floor together, why mess that up?

Can we offer something other than Ryno and get Martin (who I like by the way)? I think a guy like Martin (even at his age), would be a good get at a discount price.

[MichaelMcNamara]

I mean, if your going to keep asserting that you know what's in Dell's heart and soul... It's not fun to argue with you!

But as to continuity, it matters for teams like Warriors, Hawks, maybe Wizards and Raptors.

But it's obviously less a factor for Bulls, Dallas, Rockets, Grizzlies, Cavs, and Thunder. In fact, continuity seems to be something only a few teams value, and only when they're streaking.

I don't even know where I stand on Asik as of this moment, but I do know Dell sees him as more of a core piece than Ryno and Tyreke.

I also am hesitant to judge guys completely on their first 40 games with a new system, coach, teammates, etc. I would love to see if more pace and smarter guards could minimize his offensive struggles.

[speedyG]

I do wonder if a more balanced center like Koufos would be the better option to pursue.

Yeah I think if you can find the next Robin Lopez on a cheap deal (Koufos, Brandan Wright etc), that's the way to go instead of paying an established center like Asik

[NMThreeMVP]

I don't even know where I stand on Asik as of this moment, but I do know Dell sees him as more of a core piece than Ryno and Tyreke.

I also am hesitant to judge guys completely on their first 40 games with a new system, coach, teammates, etc. I would love to see if more pace and smarter guards could minimize his offensive struggles.

I think I'm on record that I love Dell's creative deal making, but his roster construction is terrible. My wildass guess is that this could be indicative of a coach and GM not being on the same page.

I'd hope that Asik will get better over time if he's a core pace. But I get nervous when the opinion of his skill set and value is all over the place. All it takes is for Dell to be of the opinion that Asik is a $6-7m core piece, and Asik and his agent believing he's a $11-12m player, for this to go all bad.

I'd like for someone in our media to ask Dell if he's had recent conversations with Asik's agent to determine value. There is no rule that says the two can't talk during the season. Or ask Asik what his plans are for free agency. It seems like in other markets, the press ask these questions.

[new city champ]

Interesting that they feel that strongly about Asik. I get why he's valuable, but is he really that much more valuable than other alternatives? Our defense hasn't markedly improved with his arrival, even at the rim.

The Pels, realistically, have two major chits they could trade by the deadline: Asik and Anderson. Both players would be attractive to contending teams in either conference. Trading either would signal that the organization has accepted that we won't make the post-season this year and is ready to remake the roster going forward. Dealing both would net us net us a huge amount of cap flexibility, picks and prospects going into the offseason. Paired with Gordon's expiring deal, that would give us a lot of ammunition to sign or trade for core players who fit around Holiday, Davis and Evans. I would think that tempting. Obviously, if they see Asik as a core player, then some of that is off the table. But you still might flip Ryno by the deadline if the value was out there. Might be higher at the deadline than in the offseason.

[HornetGuru]

i wonder if given the minutes if kosta koufas would be just as good as Asik?

[NMThreeMVP]

i wonder if given the minutes if kosta koufas would be just as good as Asik?

I wonder if Tyson Chandler, Kosta Koufos, Robin Lopez, or Kevin Seraphin would be significantly cheaper than Asik.

[Mythrol]

Asik is a C. He is going to get paid. People need to readjust their amounts because thinking he is only going to get 6-7m is silly talk.

We have no idea what the market will be so we have no idea what his actual value is. For example if Deandre Jordan gets the max or near it what is Asik's value? He is worse no doubt but is he only 50% the player Jordan is? No. Should he get a contract worth 50% of Jordan's? No. His value might be far higher than what people expect. That doesn't mean he will get over paid, it means peopledid not accurately gauge the market for defensive centers.

All we can really do is wait and see. But the FEAR of losing a player does not mean every time a team has a player that will be an UFA that they should deal him.

[BallSoHard]

Interesting that they feel that strongly about Asik. I get why he's valuable, but is he really that much more valuable than other alternatives? Our defense hasn't markedly improved with his arrival, even at the rim.

The Pels, realistically, have two major chits they could trade by the deadline: Asik and Anderson. Both players would be attractive to contending teams in either conference. Trading either would signal that the organization has accepted that we won't make the post-season this year and is ready to remake the roster going forward. Dealing both would net us net us a huge amount of cap flexibility, picks and prospects going into the offseason. Paired with Gordon's expiring deal, that would give us a lot of ammunition to sign or trade for core players who fit around Holiday, Davis and Evans. I would think that tempting. Obviously, if they see Asik as a core player, then some of that is off the table. But you still might flip Ryno by the deadline if the value was out there. Might be higher at the deadline than in the offseason.

I think the point is, we have bird rights to sign Asik. We won't get a talent of that level with our open space. Therefore, we should sign Asik. Also, if we're trading Asik bc he's expiring we're only going to get value for him for a 1/2 season rental, afterall that's why we'd be selling him. Essentially we would have bought Asik for $1 used him 1/2 a season and sold him back for $.30. That's why i don't think trading him is an option. Just my opinion though.