To slow, below average handle, bad defender, to name a few.
Maybe Gordon helps him out.
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Contributor
To slow, below average handle, bad defender, to name a few.
Maybe Gordon helps him out.
it just further confirms my point that u r just throwing household names out there that are known..u arent basing it off production or stats at all which is just ridiculous...vasquez is a starting pg in this league and he will lead this team now and the future nothing more nothing less...he showed what he is capable of when playing against the best pg in the league cp3..it was no fluke..with more time and a better supporting cast he will be even better...u guys think we will have an all star at every position lol...not gonna happenOriginally Posted by NOH2313
too early in his career to fully judge him..give him another 2 seasons with a better lineup to play with then judge him...he has constantly shown improvement every year and thats all u can ask of him...sorry guys but derrick rose is not stepping through those doors anytime soon
I can't see how he is still the same athlete out of college after 3 off seasons to improve his speed/quickness/hops with legit NBA trainers
Once again, you drew the wrong conclusion and this reflects your inability to comprehend an argument without an extreme degree of personal bias. What I argued is that I would rather have a player who has a proven track record and continues to play at a high level rather than a Grevis Vasquez, who hasn't even had his version of a "career year" for a full season yet.
Once again, that doesn't matter. The question was name 18 better point guards than Vasquez. I was specifically responding to that part of his OP. Thus, I ranked the players assuming it was in the context of the present and not the future.
Otherwise, I could get away with saying that Drummond is a better center than Tyson Chandler because he has so much potential. I was specifically responding to that part of his OP.
Your improvement argument is noted, however. I think we have different ideas on where his ceiling lies. My personal opinion is that he's almost at, if not hit, his ceiling this season given his physical limitations. I understand where you are coming from, though.
Last edited by PelsFan2313; 12-03-2012 at 03:39 PM.
"I'm not going to allow my putative owner to answer that question, this is an NBA related press conference. Paul Tagliabue and Roger Goodell have collectively sung their praises of Tom and if uh ESPN has a problem with that tell Mr. Skipper to call me at my office."
And you are basing your assessments based on a 15-game sample which is much more statistically illogical.
Take Aminu, for instance. People jumped on the AFA bandwagon based off a small sample of solid performances. Now, with 5-10 more games of NBA action, it is clear that his play was an anomaly. Furthermore, this specific situation exhibited how statistics don't always paint an accurate reflection of play. While his numbers were up, Aminu didn't add anything to his game. Instead, the only difference was that he finished at the rim at a more efficient rate. All in all, he still couldn't shoot, handle, or take care of the ball.
I'm not hoping for an all-star position at every starting level. I just want players with manageable liabilities. Vasquez, in my opinion, brings too much bad with the good to warrant starting minutes.
Last edited by PelsFan2313; 12-03-2012 at 03:46 PM.
no i just said that because u stated how miller performed for 15 years when the truth is miller is in steep decline and no where near what he used to be...and we are talking about the present not the future NOR THE PAST like you are trying to do...lets talk about production CURRENTLY this year..vasquez is in the top half of pg's like love it or hate it but it is what it is
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/greivis_vasquez/..go there and u can compare very easily to your listy and u will see that 6or 7 dont stack up...yea it is only 15 games so far but there is nothing there to assume vasquez will all of a sudden fall off or his numbers will drop...there is reason to believe that they will increase tho looking at a healthy ad and eg getting back in the lineup...
oh no i wont let u get away with that 1 but nice try buddy...please do not compare that lost looking,have no idea where im at guy we call chief lol...please stop my stomach hurts....afa is what he is and there is no ceiling for him only a floor unless he all of sudden grows a brain sometime soon
Contributor
Vasquez would be perfect if we had a cat like Brandon Jennings ahead of him. But Vasquez turns the rock over too much and can't guard anyone. It's not hate. It's just the facts. I love me some Vasquez.
As a backup. But he is a liability physically.
his to numbers rank right there with westbrook rondo dwill and a few more js
Last edited by kclaboy504; 12-03-2012 at 04:01 PM.
It's clear that I can't convince you otherwise and that's ok. All I'm really saying is that we should at least wait until the season comes to an end before annointing GV "the future". Perhaps, even two. Clearly he's shown improvment as of this moment, but I'm afraid that his ceiling isn't as high as you believe it to be simply given his physical limitations (not to mention his turnovers, but that's another story). That's the last thing I have to say on the matter.
Last edited by PelsFan2313; 12-03-2012 at 04:04 PM.
Are we talking simple stats? Because if we are talking advanced stats- the stats that reflect more closely a player's overall production relative to usage, pace, etc. then Vasquez is still not in the top half. These guys are still ahead of him THIS YEAR
CP3
Rondo
Parker
Dragic
Lowry
Westbrook
Conley
Irving
Holliday
Jennings
Teague
Lillard
D-Will
Calderon
Curry
George Hill
Felton
Mo Williams
J. Nelson
Sessions or Walker- whomever you want to consider the PG for Charlotte
That's 20. Plus you still got guys like Lawson, who we know is better, Rose and Rubio who are hurt, and 5 or 6 others that you can go either way on like Jose Calderon and Jeremy Lin.
It's not hate, just facts
@mcnamara247
Contributor
No one is saying he's a bad player. I don't want to see him having to check Westbrook.
I think people who emphasize on vasques turning the ball over are just caught in the now moment of a bad game...yea he turns the ball over but so do the top pg's in this league..vasquez to avg/pg is 3.4...same as rondo,dwill,curry,lawson and westbrook but lower than some pretty good pg's like irving
I'm not the grammar police, but since you are trying to be (and you're doing it wrong), I have to call you out on this. When a person uses an "apostrophe-s," it makes the word possessive, not plural as you suggest.
EX: The dogs played with their bones. Plural
EX: The dog's bone was white. Possessive
Moreover, how in the world are you trying to correct someone's grammar when you don't even use periods or any other punctuation? {Mod edit-please refrain from name calling}
That may be true but he doesn't bring nearly as much as rondo, d will or westrbook...
Contributor
Agreed x10
I am sorry, but somebody has to introduce you to advanced stats because you keep coming back to arguments that don't apply. Yes, Westbrook averaged 3.5 turnovers per game, but Vasquez turnover % is over 20 while Westbrook is at 14%. That is what matters, not total turnovers. The Hornets play at a snail's pace and get fewer possessions, and Vasquez still manages to turn the ball over at an alarming rate despite having so few possessions.
Just trying to help out, really. There are some arguments to play for Vasquez's play this season being above average, but pulling out assists per game or turnovers per game are not going to win that argument on a board with people as intelligent and savvy as this one
People aren't hating on Vasquez, only on each other.
Maybe he doesn't fit on the team because fans will not clearly agree on his status in the NBA
im sorry but all those guys listed do not have better numbers this year ...lawson,teague,lowry,dragic(even),hill to name a few...mo williams doesnt either...sessions?? r u kidding me?? sorry ill take vasquez and his 8.7 assist/pg over sessions 4 pg same goes with walker
Wow I wish you can the best players on your team, but that's not how NBA works if you also call that stupid.
NBA is about making money.
BTW, Vasquez is not at his last year of the contract. Hornets has team option for two more years. To me, that's cash saving.
Again, you counter advanced stats with simple stats. I guess we can't help you here. If you wanna believe, then fine, it's not our job to tell you there is no Santa, but don't come calling us haters when we are just objectively analyzing
hey bro 1st off all im not spell checking nobody...what i meant is that they are by themselves in there own category and that there are not more than 1 of them type of players...not referring to punctuation or spelling so check yourself...i tyoe on here as if im teexting to someone..i am not writing an exam or trying to pass a text get it? but thanks for your schooling youngsterI'm not the grammar police, but since you are trying to be (and you're doing it wrong), I have to call you out on this. When a person uses an "apostrophe-s," it makes the word possessive, not plural as you suggest.
EX: The dogs played with their bones. Plural
EX: The dog's bone was white. Possessive
Moreover, how in the world are you trying to correct someone's grammar when you don't even use periods or any other punctuation? {Mod edit-please refrain from name calling}
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