Giannis has made the playoffs twice (2014-15, and last season 16-17). Sixth seed both times, both 4-2 first round exits.Originally Posted by Mythrol
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Giannis has made the playoffs twice (2014-15, and last season 16-17). Sixth seed both times, both 4-2 first round exits.
Touche. I felt like there was something to it. Was it with losing records?
So that moves Giannis to top 10 then for sure.
I just want to know when Gentry turned into Tom Thibodeau from his early Bulls days?
There is about ZERO chance this team makes the playoffs if Gentry can not start trusting other players to give Jrue and AD more rest. Because at this rate they will not be healthy by seasons end, book it. Playing AD nearly the entire second half when you had a 25 point lead at one point was absurd. Especially after he missed 2 free throws at the end of the 3rd and you just go ahead and run him out again. That is when you give AD that extra rest for a run, not run him back out there where he is already gassed and give him a quick minute down the stretch. So of course AD goes 0-5, misses two free throws and him and Holiday turn it over three times.
We are fighting for the 8th seed with the Clipps and Jazz on our tails. Fun times.
And AD is top 7 but not top 5.
If you Jimmer it, they will come.
41-41 in the 2014-15 season, and 42-40 last season. So yea, not great, but good enough in the East. He also had pretty good showings in the playoffs from what I remember. Yea I'd say he's up there for sure, probably about near where AD is ranked.
Also, can't see how you wouldn't have Harden as better than AD. Dude does it all, has led his team deep(ish) in the playoffs the last few seasons. And superstar guards can just affect the game more than big men can in today's game. I mean, it's all moot point really, top 15, 10, 7, 5, they all really good.
That's not including Kawahi Leonard. When that guy is healthy he is top 3.
I'd put Harden over AD right now. Mostly because Harden has started to show effort on defense again with CP3 there. Quietly becoming the best post defender amongst guards in the league, which has allowed them to do a lot more switching successfully, and putting a lot more effort on and off the ball.
I don't think I would put Giannis over AD just yet though. But it is hard. The biggest hole in AD's game remains something I am still shocked he hasn't been better at and that is facilitating and assisting. It seemed like he was poised based on the offseason to really make that the next leap in his game. I was frankly expecting a Kawhi Leonard type jump given Cousins presence and the emphasis, and while at times it's there, he and the team have never really embraced it. I think it is also that one aspect of his game holding back him making the teams around him much better like Giannis and the Marc Gasol's/Cousins of the big man world.
I would take LeBron, KD, Curry, Harden, and Kawhi over AD. After that, it becomes rather hard to bump him further down the list. There's no denying AD's talent. But he's a frustrating player to root for at times because the bar for excellence is raised a lot higher for elite talents like him.
"I'm not going to allow my putative owner to answer that question, this is an NBA related press conference. Paul Tagliabue and Roger Goodell have collectively sung their praises of Tom and if uh ESPN has a problem with that tell Mr. Skipper to call me at my office."
I'd take LeBron, KD, and healthy Kawhi over AD. That's it.
Basketball.
AD is top 10. The problem is he doesn't handle the ball as well as other guys you'd put in the top 10, his defense is overrated, and to this point in his career he doesn't appear to make other players better or impact the other team's defensive strategies significantly. With Lebron, Giannis, and KD playing significant minutes at PF, it's debatable whether AD is still the best PF in the game.
Is AD the best Center in the NBA? He was't the best Center on his own team for half the season and avoids guarding other Centers on defense.
AD puts up great stats, but too often it's in a losing effort. He's not a "good stats - bad team" guy per say, but he has literally been a good stats guy on a bad team.
For whatever it's worth, I don't think AD is a first team All NBA lock, especially if Pelicans miss the playoffs.
Seriously laughing at some who think AD is a better player than harden. Harden has had different coaches and trash on his team and still makes playoffs every year. Ad had been once with a really good pool of talent. As much as I love AD there is no way in hell he and harden are in the same stratosphere. Harden KD and lebron are the three best followed by curry
I'm a grinder
AD has to step up his heart. Dude is not a killer on he court. He needs to hate to lose like Westbrook and cp3
I find this post accurate except for the serious disrespect shown to a 2x league MVP and NBA champion. There’s no way a guy who has vanished in the playoffs in big games like Harden should be above Curry. Harden may have all the skill and ability, but if there was NBA2K rating for flakiness, Harden would be a 100.
And it’s debatable who the best player on the Warriors is, but I give a slight edge to KD because of his stepped up defensive ability.
This "AD has no heart or killer instinct" tripe is getting monotonous . & I call bullcrap. Hey Smonty, here come the faux nonverbal communication experts. That Tim Duncan fellow Was off the chart with emotion! Right? NOT !
AD is not a naturally boisterous kinda guy. It's not synonymous with "no heart or killer instinct" . Conflation to create the outcome one wants to perceive is a lazy convenient truth. AD has NEVER been on a team completely healthy & the 1st taste he ever got of LEGIT 2nd round possibilities was CRUSHED when Boogie went down. He's 24yrs old & Boogies injury probably annihilated him emotionally. Hopefully he gets over it in time save a playoff run. Then we get Boogie back next year, with Nico & try again.
But the narrative that AD has no heart or killer instinct is horse tripe.
Harden is a three point chucker guard in a league tailored to three point chucking guards. His exceptional scoring is largely driven by his ability to pathetically worm free throws. You can call that an ability if you want, but I wouldn't. Therefore his only remaining high caliber skill is his playmaking which is largely a result of D'Antoni's system, which pretty much always blows up the assist numbers of the lead guard.
And like all D'Antoni teams, Hardens Rockets appear to be regular season wonders that crumble in the playoffs when the wormlike flopping isn't quite so favoured.
So yeah, I don't rate him above actual elite scorers who get their numbers by actually scoring within the context of an actual moving game, nor do I rate him about players who actually playmake rather than just tossing the ball to someone else who also doesn't mind chucking.
Yeah, you're clearly underselling Harden's skills and production because you don't like the way he plays. Harden elevates the play of those around him at a level AD will never reach. That's why he's the better player.
Sure thing buddy, I'm just a rampant hater.
Well, the easiest way to prove that this narrative is false would be with evidence of AD consistently demonstrating heart and killer instinct. Part of AD’s problem is he’s not a good ball handler or three point shooter, and it’s difficult for someone with his skill set to take over a game. He’s also missed time and left games with tweaks and minor injuries. None of that proves or means he’s soft and a Beta, but we’ve also yet to see evidence that he’s got the heart and alpha mode that some people believe he consistently needs.
Last edited by NMThreeMVP; 02-11-2018 at 01:16 PM.
Well that settles that then.
I'll take it a step further. Even easier to prove is wins which AD doesn't have. I really hated hardens game before but I have to give credit where its due. He curry Durant cp3 and lebron are the horses in this league who can drive up wins with nothing around them. Everyone else is second tier even kawhi
as much as it pains me to say it, ad reminds me of Chris bosh with his game in Toronto. Really good player and state fuller but couldn't carry a team for nothing. Boogie is gonna be needed forever with ad or an attacking guard. Imagine harden and ad...he is the perfect robin.
What hero has the talent and abilities of a batman but the heart of a Robin?
Is AD really Nightwing?
Contributor
Nightwing is one of the best leaders in the DCU. Even Superman and Batman think highly of his ability to command respect despite being younger and less experienced than Batman.
I'd say AD is more like Cyborg or Manhunter. He's got tremendous ability, but he doesn't really have that deadly fire and killer instinct.
You can absolutely win a championship with AD as your best player.. if you surrounded AD/Boogie what Lebron/Love have in Cleveland right now this team would be unstoppable. We need better players top to bottom with another stud player. The whole alpha/beta conversation is just ridiculous with AD.. not to mention how old is he? When did MJ and Lebron win their 1st championship? Put better players around him and we will get better results.. not to mention a good coach wouldn't hurt.
AD is just not your typical superstar. He has a lot of unique quirks to his game.
He requires a different type of approach, but like other dominant big men, once you get those pieces, those teams can be dominant and a matchup nightmare. Like the Spurs were for so long with Tim Duncan as the heart and soul.
Cousins/AD with a Jrue type and a Paul George or a Damian Lillard with a solid set of cohesive role players, like a Mirotic, and a few good guard and wing shooters to stretch the floor, that can play average and above average defense, with the ability to switch, would compete with any team in the league TBH.
Problem is I don't know if the Pelicans will ever be in that position, due to so many accumulated past mistakes, lack of assets and cap space, Cousins injury, and a crunch of a time schedule due to Davis's contract, that will ever allow the room for this franchise to put it all together perfectly.
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