Seriously people? PELS VS WOLVES

[Mythrol]

1) I don't have to defend him. The numbers all defend him. All I have to do is know what the numbers say.

2) Despite his reputation, aside from George Karl, who was a well known **** who alienated every HOF player he ever coached except Gary Payton (probably because of a certain similarity in being ****s) and who created the feud when he went sliming around during the summer and tried to get Cousins traded not only behind Boogie's back, but even behind the front office's at the time, DeMarcus Cousins loyalty creed has extended to his coaches as well. Michael Malone wasn't only his coach, he was his friend, and he in no way shape or form wanted him fired. He asked the front office not to fire Ty Corbin despite the disaster of his short post-Malone reign. He liked Dave Joerger, but of course Sac couldn't have that either. He still goes over to Calipari's for dinner when he passes through Kentucky. He apparently likes Alvin Gentry as a person so no he's not going to point those fingers at the coaches.

Numbers mean nothing without the context to surround them. James Harden has the highest Defensive Win Share on his team. I could sit here and say that proves Harden is the best defender on the Rockets, but we all know that's BS.

Cousins is a net negative defender who routinely takes plays off. Heck, someone posted a video in this thread showing him throw a turnover and then not even turn back to run up court on defense. I'm not surprised he leads in defensive rebounds, he's a Stat chaser. He also isn't the only one who is at fault. A lot of our players are just bad on defense or give no effort. Cousins worst crime isn't actually even his defense himself. It's that his influence has crept into AD. You're new to the Pelicans, being a Cousins fan and all, but AD used to give a lot of defensive effort. He made mistakes, yeah, but he always gave effort. This is the 1st year where he has routinely phoned in his defense. I don't think that's a surprise that it's the 1st year with Cousins here. We were a top 10 defense last year with largely the same players and just swapping Cousins for Solomon Hill. I'm sorry but I don't believe Solomon Hill is worth a 20 spot swing in defense on his own.

As far as Cousins being a good guy who routinely jumped on a grenade to save his Coaches, let's stop with the nonsense. He has a reputation for a reason. He's trying to change, and I give him credit for that, but if you're going to sit here and try to blame everyone else but Cousins for his entire career - well you're a bigger shill than I thought.

[tdcreator]

Coaches do have to put players in position to succeed but players need to push themselves. Cousins is great when things are good but one of the first to stop playing hard when it gets bad. Gentry should pull players when they aren't hustling, period!!

Moore is a backup SG who is playing starting SF. Not good. If he was out there leading the second unit with Miller and say Hill when he comes back that would be awesome. That's why I'm pulling to trade for a big wing like Simmons to start at SF and send Moore back to his regular position. Moore, Miller, Hill, and Cousins could be a nice unit when subbing in players.

[Mythrol]

High school, college, pro...it makes absolutely NO DIFFERENCE. I have no idea where you get that from.

Some of the best motivators in coaching you find at the pro level. What are you talking about?

What are you talking about? I disagree that the No. 1 skill of a coach is being a motivator in the Pros. Especially for an older team. These are guys bring paid Millions, who are supposedly hungry to make the playoffs and yet they still need a father figure telling them to get ready for the game? I just don't buy it.

[billfromfinance]

I didn't really think boogie was that much of a problem tonight (certainly not number one, well outside of the same old turnovers), he seemed to have more energy than most. I thought AD had a horrid game, shot was off from the get go, low energy, looked like a deer in headlights at times on both defense and offense. He has always been the main energy gauge for the team. Trying to have Moore guard wiggins right out of the gate was never going to work either. Also I don't know who taught any of our guards to fight through screens, but watching them you would think they were the Velcro loop to the screeners hook.

[Mythrol]

https://www.theringer.com/platform/a...-anthony-davis

“Cousins is the common denominator in a long line of bad defenses”

This can't be true, I have a handful of stats saying Cousins is the best defender on the Pelicans. Argh!!!!

[N.O.Bronco]

I think it's become pretty clear how big of a factor the Solomon Hill injury has had on this team. Even to a lesser extent the Tony Allen injury. We just don't have a guy on the team who can shut down bigger wings.

That does not excuse the complete lack of energy and effort to start games though. These players come out sleep walking as soon as the buzzer sounds.

I think it is big, and I've said it before, but not necessarily because Hill was some great role player and defensive savant, to be quite frank, unlike others, I am deeply concerned about the spacing issues a Rondo/Jrue/Hill lineup poses, but his loss is so big because the roster is such that the drop off from the position is literally either a journeyman sharpshooter that can do little else, a shooting guard that's ideal position is 7th man off the bench, or the last career gasp of Tony Allen.

[N.O.Bronco]

https://www.theringer.com/platform/a...-anthony-davis

“Cousins is the common denominator in a long line of bad defenses”

I feel like that is boiling down the piece far too much.

I think one of the interesting points is how the author thinks we should try and fix the defensive cratering when Cousins doesn't have AD.

And I too have often wondered why Gentry doesn't just roll with the hand he is dealt a bit more? Diallo has all but disappeared and Asik, who actually brought some interior toughness and rebounding in his spurts, has been completely absent. Even in games like tonight where it seemed like the matchups favored going big over small. For all his lineup tinkering in his first seasons, Gentry has become almost as rigid as Monty with his rotations, and I think if there is one criticism I currently have about Gentry from a tactical perspective, that is it.

The author also mentions further maximizing AD and Cousins together while trying out something like Jrue taking charge of a second unit with Asik and Diallo. Another interesting idea that seems like we don't have much to lose trying it.

[N.O.Bronco]

Relevant quotes from that article:

When the Pelicans traded for Cousins, they were bucking the leaguewide trend toward small ball. Pairing two traditional big men together almost never works anymore, but Cousins and Davis are the furthest thing from traditional. Twin Towers lineups can succeed when both 7-footers are as multidimensional as those two. The reason New Orleans is still stuck in a rut is what happens when they go smaller: Cousins can’t handle the defensive responsibilities that come with being the only player his size on the floor. Instead of asking him to carry offensive-minded players on defense, the Pelicans should see if he can carry defensive-minded players on offense. The only thing left for them to do is to double down even more on big lineups.

One option would be to pair Cousins with one of their other centers when Davis is out, although both have flaws. Omer Asik missed the first month of the season after being diagnosed with Crohn’s disease, and he has played only 75 minutes since returning in mid-November. Asik can’t score in an empty gym, and his block rate has steadily declined over the last six seasons. Cheick Diallo, a second-round pick in 2016, has played only 323 minutes in the NBA. Diallo is an athletic big man with a 7-foot-4 wingspan who had a 11.9 percent block rate in college, but he may be too inexperienced to anchor a defense.

The other option would be to play Cousins and Davis more together, and let Holiday anchor the second unit with Asik or Diallo as the center. Holiday is having a career season, averaging 18 points and 5.4 assists a game on 48.5 percent shooting. According to NBA.com, the Pelicans have an offensive rating of 117.5 in the 73 minutes he has played without Davis or Cousins. In the 50 minutes Asik has played with Holiday, New Orleans has a net rating of plus-28.5. Those numbers would go down in a bigger sample size, but the Pelicans wouldn’t need much from those lineups. They just have to find a way to stop bleeding points when Davis is out.

[Creative]

Another dissapointing loss. Gentry needs to go. Period.

[billfromfinance]

Relevant quotes from that article:

I'd be fine with seeing a boogie and asik duo (considering the boogie solo lineups are normally boogie + trash, 4 guys stand around and watch boogie on offense). if it stops the bleeding excellent, we don't need to blow the other team out of the water just minimize the damage. Sure seems like a guy who knows how to box out and rebound could be useful. If boogies said no so he can get his numbers, throw the jrue asik out there and give the two a break. the sooner allen and hill get back the better though really, our current 3 guard lineups are severely lacking..

[DaFranchise80]

Enough of the 3 guard starting lineup. Moore is too small to guard the likes of Butler, KD, PG13, etc. I would start Miller and put Moore on the 2nd unit where he belongs. He and Nelson could provide some scoring punch for that group which is sorely needed.

[Mythrol]

Enough of the 3 guard starting lineup. Moore is too small to guard the likes of Butler, KD, PG13, etc. I would start Miller and put Moore on the 2nd unit where he belongs. He and Nelson could provide some scoring punch for that group which is sorely needed.

Or Cunningham at SF. Yeah. The change to Moore clearly hasn't made a huge difference in the team's record, so I would be all for trying to add a bit more defense to the starting lineup.

[tdcreator]

Or Cunningham at SF. Yeah. The change to Moore clearly hasn't made a huge difference in the team's record, so I would be all for trying to add a bit more defense to the starting lineup.

I agree, I like Miller a bit more with the starters because of size and floor spacing with Rondo. Backup PG and starting SF are still the major problems. I think Hill will be used in the backup PF more than anything so he's not going to help as much when he comes back. (I don't think he'll have the lateral quickness to stay with SF this year. It also lets him ease back into it)

[pelicanchamp]

Is AD playing hurt?


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[N.O.Bronco]

I'd be fine with seeing a boogie and asik duo (considering the boogie solo lineups are normally boogie + trash, 4 guys stand around and watch boogie on offense). if it stops the bleeding excellent, we don't need to blow the other team out of the water just minimize the damage. Sure seems like a guy who knows how to box out and rebound could be useful. If boogies said no so he can get his numbers, throw the jrue asik out there and give the two a break. the sooner allen and hill get back the better though really, our current 3 guard lineups are severely lacking..

The other elephant in the room is Rondo.

As of right now we have relatively stable sample size of the pre-Rondo and current Rondo starting lineup:

https://stats.nba.com/lineups/advanc...mID=1610612740

[PelsFan2313]

High school, college, pro...it makes absolutely NO DIFFERENCE. I have no idea where you get that from.

Some of the best motivators in coaching you find at the pro level. What are you talking about?

I can’t blame a coach for lack of player effort. As I’ve said a few times on postgame radio call-in show lately, if you constantly need a coach to motivate players in an 82-game season, you’ll constantly lose to teams who don’t https://t.co/mcjftFxdMQ

— Jim Eichenhofer (@Jim_Eichenhofer) January 7, 2018

This is like the 10th smart person tonight to tell y'all that motivating grown ****** men getting paid millions is not a coaches job.

You guys listening yet? https://t.co/R3GMgszvGB

— Solomon Will Return Strong (@SilverAndMac) January 7, 2018

Blame the coach all you want (I know many will).

These guys are professional basketball players. Coach doesn’t stand there and give “rah rah” speeches. Show up to play.

Want to blame the rotations, timeouts, plays from breaks, etc...fine. Blame the coach. No effort? Nah. https://t.co/M9eiV5LZAB

— Scott Kushner (@ScottDKushner) January 7, 2018

[billfromfinance]

The other elephant in the room is Rondo.

As of right now we have relatively stable sample size of the pre-Rondo and current Rondo starting lineup:

https://stats.nba.com/lineups/advanc...mID=1610612740

Interesting look at the image, most would probably think that the rondo lineup would have the better looking AST stats. But everything is almost identical, improved rebounding, and a massive defensive difference with dante in and him out. Jrue on their best guard, e'twaun on the other, and then length at the 3 with dante just shows the defensive matchup differences. Also easier on switching. Compared to E'twaun trying to guard guys who have the dimensions all over him at the 3, and then a nightmare for switching with rondo in too. At least E'twaun fights to get his man, even if he is solidly beat a lot and/or gives the silly foul pulling on the jersey or arm. As has been shown in quite a few clips on twitter (and apparently why he got sat the other night), rondo really doesn't fight through those screens and stick on his man. He also seems to cheat off a lot, over helping elsewhere and going for steals leaving his man wide open for the 3 or drive to the paint.

[Mythrol]

https://streamable.com/amp_player/8q...mpression=true

A full minute and a half of actual game time against the Wolves where Cousins gave absolutely zero Fs about defense. This isn't one play that lasted that long. This is multiple plays of Cousins just defensively not caring. Even after he throws a turnover.

There is NO excuse for this.

[PELICANSFAN]

I wish we could get value for Cousins in a trade. I just do not see this working with him here. I hope I am wrong.

[Rheem654]

Interesting look at the image, most would probably think that the rondo lineup would have the better looking AST stats. But everything is almost identical, improved rebounding, and a massive defensive difference with dante in and him out. Jrue on their best guard, e'twaun on the other, and then length at the 3 with dante just shows the defensive matchup differences. Also easier on switching. Compared to E'twaun trying to guard guys who have the dimensions all over him at the 3, and then a nightmare for switching with rondo in too. At least E'twaun fights to get his man, even if he is solidly beat a lot and/or gives the silly foul pulling on the jersey or arm. As has been shown in quite a few clips on twitter (and apparently why he got sat the other night), rondo really doesn't fight through those screens and stick on his man. He also seems to cheat off a lot, over helping elsewhere and going for steals leaving his man wide open for the 3 or drive to the paint.

Yea Rondo was a flashy big-name signing, but so far he's showed that he's a 15-20 minute back-up at this point. Great passing can't make up for being below average in every other aspect of the game.

[Rheem654]

https://streamable.com/amp_player/8q...mpression=true

A full minute and a half of actual game time against the Wolves where Cousins gave absolutely zero Fs about defense. This isn't one play that lasted that long. This is multiple plays of Cousins just defensively not caring. Even after he throws a turnover.

There is NO excuse for this.

Yes, and he's good for at least 5 of these a game. So frustrating.

[Mythrol]

I wish we could get value for Cousins in a trade. I just do not see this working with him here.

Our best chance at value would be a sign and trade. I don't think Cousins would agree to that though.

We are tied at the hip to him. Have to offer him a max contract this summer. The only thing we can really do is change the coach and see if a different system will minimize his lack of effort defensively.

What we really need is another two way wing that can cover over our defensive shortcomings.

[Rheem654]

I wish we could get value for Cousins in a trade. I just do not see this working with him here. I hope I am wrong.

Really though, I would be all for trading him, even if it means getting slightly less talented players in return but with the right attitude and defense. But seem like they're going to ride this out, so best we can hope for is him to change his attitude and approach at some point.

[Rheem654]

Our best chance at value would be a sign and trade. I don't think Cousins would agree to that though.

We are tied at the hip to him. Have to offer him a max contract this summer. The only thing we can really do is change the coach and see if a different system will minimize his lack of effort defensively.

What we really need is another two way wing that can cover over our defensive shortcomings.

Any ideas of players like that we could realistically acquire? You know how excited we get about the idea of adding new players on the team, lol

[Mythrol]

Any ideas of players like that we could realistically acquire? You know how excited we get about the idea of adding new players on the team, lol

Solomon Hill coming back from injury.

Other than that there are not really many realistic options out there. Maybe another method would be bring in a capable backup center so we can rest Cousins more, but how would he respond to reduced minutes? My guess is probably not well.