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Thread: Pels were 3rd team in Pistons-Suns Bledsoe Deal

  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    Come on, you know better than to judge based off one game. His 3pt % is lower than his average but so far this season he's averaging 16-6-4 while playing only 29 minutes a game.
    So will Jackson replace DC in the starting lineup, add a perimeter defender that can consistently knock down a 3pter, improve Holiday's aggression, or be a legit big off the bench? He doesn't add another new besides a familiar name. He's just another 6'3 combo guard like Holiday, Clark, Moore, and Frank Jackson. He doesn't improve any weaknesses. I would be on board if we traded for a good 3pt shooting wing or a solid big off the bench. That's what we need.

  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Topdawg26 View Post
    So will Jackson replace DC in the starting lineup, add a perimeter defender that can consistently knock down a 3pter, improve Holiday's aggression, or be a legit big off the bench? He doesn't add another new besides a familiar name. He's just another 6'3 combo guard like Holiday, Clark, Moore, and Frank Jackson. He doesn't improve any weaknesses. I would be on board if we traded for a good 3pt shooting wing or a solid big off the bench. That's what we need.
    The entire reason the trade didn't go through was because the Pels couldn't swing a 2nd deal for a backup big. It's clear everyone is aware what this team is lacking.

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    The entire reason the trade didn't go through was because the Pels couldn't swing a 2nd deal for a backup big. It's clear everyone is aware what this team is lacking.
    Swingmen who can create?

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    Come on, you know better than to judge based off one game. His 3pt % is lower than his average but so far this season he's averaging 16-6-4 while playing only 29 minutes a game.
    And I know that in all likelihood he'll regress to his mean. Which is ineffiency

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    Swingmen who can create?
    Who's a realistic wing we can get?
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    And I know that in all likelihood he'll regress to his mean. Which is ineffiency
    His averages as a starter are basically the same. Let's not get it twisted, Jackson is overpaid but he is an alright player.

    Exactly who do you expect us to be able to get with our package of bad contracts and a single 1st?

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    Who's a realistic wing we can get? His averages as a starter are basically the same. Let's not get it twisted, Jackson is overpaid but he is an alright player.

    Exactly who do you expect us to be able to get with our package of bad contracts and a single 1st?
    So overpaid Jackson AND giving up the first is your answer? It's the same amount of money on the books as AA + OA for another inefficient combo guard.

    It's just Dell handing out disgusting contracts and trying to fix it by handing over what little assets we have time and time and time again

    It's bloody groundhog day and it has to stop

    Jrue is more than capable of averaging 16-6-4, having Jackson is so redundant
    Last edited by AusPel; 11-04-2017 at 10:19 AM.

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    So overpaid Jackson AND giving up the first is your answer? It's the same amount of money on the books as AA + OA for another inefficient combo guard.

    It's just Dell handing out disgusting contracts and trying to fix it by handing over what little assets we have time and time and time again

    It's bloody groundhog day and it has to stop

    Jrue is more than capable of averaging 16-6-4, having Jackson is so redundant
    Exactly!

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    So overpaid Jackson AND giving up the first is your answer? It's the same amount of money on the books as AA + OA for another inefficient combo guard.

    It's just Dell handing out disgusting contracts and trying to fix it by handing over what little assets we have time and time and time again

    It's bloody groundhog day and it has to stop

    Jrue is more than capable of averaging 16-6-4, having Jackson is so redundant
    It's not my answer. I've already said I'm indifferent to the trade but I can see the logic of it for Dell.

    See its really easy to sit here and talk about what this team needs but when the rubber meets the road of actual options, it gets a whole lot harder. We aren't getting Curry or Lebron. Our options are limited. Maybe there are better deals, but using a 1st plus two bad contracts to get back an overpaid but actual starter level guard is not the worst move ever.

    Is there something wrong with having a 2nd 16-6-4 guard on this team? Is our guard situation so pristine that we wouldn't benefit from having a decent, if not great guard? Our biggest problem right now is finding consistent scoring help for AD and Cousins. 16 points a game is still 16 points a game.

    Dell walked away from the deal anyway. So it's clear he wasn't so sold on it he had to do it. It was an option, one Dell chose not to do.

  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    The entire reason the trade didn't go through was because the Pels couldn't swing a 2nd deal for a backup big. It's clear everyone is aware what this team is lacking.
    Not with this trade we aren't. It's just Dell doesn’t the same thing. So if we were to trade for a big it would be for Moore. That means we would have traded our best 3 point shooter outside of Boogie for another Holiday and an okay big and giving up our future in the process with less cap space longterm and the potential of getting a good player in the draft.

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    MM confirmed it was a real deal but was dependent on a 2nd trade for a big.
    I like MM but it came straight out of the horse's mouth that the trade was bogus. I'll go with Van Gundys word. As well as logically the trade makes no sense for us or Detroit to give up assets for another guard. I don't think Demps is a complete idiot.

    I'm surprised you actually want this trade. You were so passionate about the luxury tax and paying alot of money for a bench player. Well Reggie makes $19M a year.

  11. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Topdawg26 View Post
    Not with this trade we aren't. It's just Dell doesn’t the same thing. So if we were to trade for a big it would be for Moore. That means we would have traded our best 3 point shooter outside of Boogie for another Holiday and an okay big and giving up our future in the process with less cap space longterm and the potential of getting a good player in the draft.
    A backup big that can allow Cousins and AD to not play 40 minutes a game and a consistent scorer is unfortunately more important than Moore's on again, off again 3pt shooting.

    The trade with Philly would also be adding an extremely young 1st round pick wing with *potrntial* (magic word everyone loves to use) that we could develop as well.

    The entire trade was basically a future 1st + injured backup bigs, Moore for an overpaid starter, 1 year of a backup big, and a previous 1st round potential wing.
    Last edited by Mythrol; 11-04-2017 at 11:23 AM.

  12. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonPelicans View Post
    I like MM but it came straight out of the horse's mouth that the trade was bogus. I'll go with Van Gundys word. As well as logically the trade makes no sense for us or Detroit to give up assets for another guard. I don't think Demps is a complete idiot.

    I'm surprised you actually want this trade. You were so passionate about the luxury tax and paying alot of money for a bench player. Well Reggie makes $19M a year.
    Coaches lie all the time. The deal fell through, what were you expecting him to do come out and tell Jackson they were trying to dump him after the fact? I'm sure that would do wonders for team chemistry.

    As far as the trade goes, I'm not all for it, but people need to get some perspective of what is going on. First, Jackson is a starter. Second even if he is overpaid and not as effective as you'd like he still gives you 16-6-4, that's useful. 3rd, the two trades suggested would together lower the Pels cap hit this year and lower non starter cap hits for next year. 4th, weren't you the person calling for a backup big to give AD and Cousins rest? The two trades would have accomplished just that while adding a potential wing to develop, and giving us more scoring not named AD or Cousins.
    Last edited by Mythrol; 11-04-2017 at 11:05 AM.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    A backup big that can allow Cousins and AD to not play 40 minutes a game and a consistent scorer is unfortunately more important than Moore's on again, off again 3pt shooting.

    The trade with Philly would also be adding an extremely young 1st round pick wing with *potrntial* (magic word everyone loves to use) that we could develop as well.

    The entire trade was basically a future 1st + injured backup bigs for an overpaid starter, 1 year of a backup big, and a previous 1st round potential wing.
    What players from Philly are you talking about?

  14. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by PolishFan View Post
    What players from Philly are you talking about?
    We don't know the details of the 2nd trade, only that the Pels were targeting a big. One suggestion was with Philly: Moore for Okafor + Luwawu.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    We don't know the details of the 2nd trade, only that the Pels were targeting a big. One suggestion was with Philly: Moore for Okafor + Luwawu.
    I wouldnt mind this trade

  16. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    We don't know the details of the 2nd trade, only that the Pels were targeting a big. One suggestion was with Philly: Moore for Okafor + Luwawu.
    I love that trade

  17. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    Coaches lie all the time. The deal fell through, what were you expecting him to do come out and tell Jackson they were trying to dump him after the fact? I'm sure that would do wonders for team chemistry.

    As far as the trade goes, I'm not all for it, but people need to get some perspective of what is going on. First, Jackson is a starter. Second even if he is overpaid and not as effective as you'd like he still gives you 16-6-4, that's useful. 3rd, the two trades suggested would together lower the Pels cap hit this year and lower non starter cap hits for next year. 4th, weren't you the person calling for a backup big to give AD and Cousins rest? The two trades would have accomplished just that while adding a potential wing to develop, and giving us more scoring not named AD or Cousins.
    I don't think Jackson will give us $19M/yr in production and he is not a starter over Rondo or Jrue. I would not call Jahlil Okafor a legit backup big and his defense is so bad, he doesn't even play for Philly. Those two trades would make us marginally better, but I don't think they give us a 3pt shooting SF and a legit 3rd big. Jackson and Jrue would combine for $42M/yr over the next 3 years, no thanks. Frank Jackson could end up being as good as Reggie.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    We don't know the details of the 2nd trade, only that the Pels were targeting a big. One suggestion was with Philly: Moore for Okafor + Luwawu.
    I would love the trade. I'd turn around a offer a pick swap in 2019 and Ajinca for Henzonja. The magic can't expect a lot because we would have a hard time resigning him. We still have our first for a deal later in the year.

  19. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonPelicans View Post
    I don't think Jackson will give us $19M/yr in production and he is not a starter over Rondo or Jrue. I would not call Jahlil Okafor a legit backup big and his defense is so bad, he doesn't even play for Philly. Those two trades would make us marginally better, but I don't think they give us a 3pt shooting SF and a legit 3rd big. Jackson and Jrue would combine for $42M/yr over the next 3 years, no thanks. Frank Jackson could end up being as good as Reggie.
    Rondo is on a 1 year deal. He is pretty irrelevant to the future of this team at this time. Okafor gives you scoring and would be going against backups, besides it'd be a 1 year rental just to give AD and Cousins minutes of rest this season. We don't know what Luwawu would turn into, he has the potential to be a 3pt shooting SF (shooting 35% this season) he is just buried on the bench at Philly so he can't get minutes to develop.

    Frank could end up being Reggie, or he could never get over his foot injuries. He hasn't played a minute of NBA basketball or even D League ball. The whole point of the trade is to get the Pels another *consistent* scorer to take some of the pressure off of AD and Cousins, to get a backup big to give AD and Cousins some minutes of rest, and to get a potential 3 and D wing to develop.

    There's probably better trades but it wouldn't have been a bad turn around for Moore, 1st, and injured bigs.

  20. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    We don't know the details of the 2nd trade, only that the Pels were targeting a big. One suggestion was with Philly: Moore for Okafor + Luwawu.
    Now we're talking.

  21. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Topdawg26 View Post
    Now we're talking.
    I don't see why Philly does it though. Moore isn't an asset really

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    I don't see why Philly does it though. Moore isn't an asset really
    Not every trade makes sense.

  23. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by AusPel View Post
    I don't see why Philly does it though. Moore isn't an asset really
    Pels couldn't get the 2nd deal done so if it was Philly, they didn't want to do it.

  24. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    Pels couldn't get the 2nd deal done so if it was Philly, they didn't want to do it.
    What a surprise

    A mediocre shooting guard on 9 mil

    Why isn't everyone lining up?

    He also passes up the widest of open widest threes you'll ever see

    Great player or great coaching, pick one
    Last edited by AusPel; 11-04-2017 at 11:59 AM.

  25. #75
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    Philly I think would need a decent experienced guard and I think Moore fit that. I like Moore but I think he's our only real tradeable asset that is worth close to his pay. It comes down to what do we need more, a backup big and guard or a starting guard we could replace and who will move to the bench when Rondo comes back.

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