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Thread: Pelicans at Trail Blazers 10-24-17

  1. #476
    Quote Originally Posted by Bricklayer View Post
    You already have 2 better prospects than Hinkie's entire 5 year plan turned up yet. Embiid and Simmons may one day be as good, if Embiid ever plays 40 games in a season, we'll see. Otherwise they wasted half a decade trying to get to the point you are at right now. There IS no "process" that results in a better in prime pairing than Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins. Two perennial All Star HOF caliber bigs capable of combining for 55pts 25rebs a night. You can't do in better. So the "process" has already been done, courtesy of one Vlade Divac. Now it's about winning, not quitting.
    Lulz. Give me the 76ers roster over ours 9 days a week. The process has netted the 76ers 3 top tier talents, and cap space for days (cap space = flexibility for all you little potential Del Demps' out there). The 76ers roster is set up in a way that they can grow and dominate on a cheap budget within a few years. Compare that roster to this dumpster fire without a lid, and it's clear to see, we can't make moves to get better, they can.

    Man, they wasted 5 years to get to where they are now and have 1 playoff appearance in that time. We have had 5 seasons with AD and have 1 playoff appearance. Congratulations, we have both sucked for the last 5 years. What your going to tell me that they give out participation trophies in the NBA?
    Last edited by UNO Gracias; 10-26-2017 at 02:29 AM.
    If you Jimmer it, they will come.

  2. #477
    Quote Originally Posted by Eman5805 View Post
    I'd say the problem is two fold. Jrue probably isn't capable of playing up to his contract. That's not on him.

    The problem is that Jrue hasn't consistently been playing like a starter lately, if you go way back into last season too.
    Yeah, I think that's exactly the issue. The big contract is obscuring the actual problem.

    It doesn't matter for this season at least if Jrue plays like a $25 million man. Irrelevant. That's a future consideration, and if the Pels fail this season, the future grows dark anyway. The problem right now, this season, is that Jrue isn't playing like a starter or any sort of guy you really want on your team, let alone a 3rd star. Doesn't matter whether he's earning $1 million or $25 million, the problem right now is he is not a positive asset. He's so shaky at PG that a 35 yr old journeyman off the waiver wire has walked right in and instantly has far more confidence and control in running the team than Jrue does. He is supposed to be a starting "shooting" guard. He's shooting .346.

    These are the only numbers that really matter for Jrue Holiday right now:

    4gms 36.5min 11.3pts (.346 .188 .857) 5.5reb 5.3ast 1.8stl 0.3blk 3.0TO .408TS% 7.6PER


    That's...horrendous. The discussion of Jrue should be centering around whether that will continue, why it's happening, is he giving the Pels defense at least, and how long you could continue to start a "player" averaging numbers like that if he were still mired in the slump 2 weeks from now for instance. All this contract talk obscures the problem. The play is the problem this season, not the contract.
    Last edited by Bricklayer; 10-26-2017 at 02:31 AM.

  3. #478
    Quote Originally Posted by UNO Gracias View Post
    Lulz. Give me the 76ers roster over ours 9 days a week. The process has netted the 76ers 3 top tier talents, and cap space for days (cap space = flexibility for all you little potential Del Demps' out there). The 76ers roster is set up in a way that they can grow and dominate on a cheap budget within a few years. Compare that roster to this dumpster fire without a lid, and it's clear to see, we can't make moves to get better, they can.
    That budget isn't going to be remotely cheap. Embiid is already going to be making max money, and as these talented kids each come up they will all join him until there is no money left. One of the problems with having all your kids miss their rookie seasons is you have wasted one of their cheap rookie contract years, and they barely get started before you have to pay them the real money.

  4. #479
    Quote Originally Posted by Bricklayer View Post
    That budget isn't going to be remotely cheap. Embiid is already going to be making max money, and as these talented kids each come up they will all join him until there is no money left. One of the problems with having all your kids miss their rookie seasons is you have wasted one of their cheap rookie contract years, and they barely get started before you have to pay them the real money.
    And where have we been with our "young vets" method? We gave Gordon, Ryno, Jrue, Reke, etc. great contracts, and what have we had to show for it. Quite frankly even with their 1-4 record, I feel more optimistic about the 76ers finishing with a better record than I do about our own chances.

  5. #480
    Quote Originally Posted by UNO Gracias View Post
    And where have we been with our "young vets" method? We gave Gordon, Ryno, Jrue, Reke, etc. great contracts, and what have we had to show for it. Quite frankly even with their 1-4 record, I feel more optimistic about the 76ers finishing with a better record than I do about our own chances.
    I have no idea what a bunch of 2nd tier players has to do with having 2 HOF big men anchoring your team. It's apples and oranges. Kawhi Leonard is a "young vet". So is Otto Porter. You can stack up 12 Otto Porters and not have them give you the chance 1 Kawhi Leonard does.

    Superstars are by FAR the hardest thing to get in the NBA, especially for a small market franchise that can never sign one as a FA. Once you have those in place, you have a future. Maybe you will need a new GM to cash in the potential, but you have to win this year first to keep the pairing together.
    Last edited by Bricklayer; 10-26-2017 at 05:26 AM.

  6. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonPelicans View Post
    My issue with Jrue is that he didn't come back better. This was a fully healthy offseason, he signed a big deal and it's like he spent no money on training. I can't see nothing he worked on this summer in his game and he looks out of shape.
    He always had the excuse of being injured during the summer for not improving. But he didn't have that excuse this season, he should've taken a jump or at least that was expected.
    Good post. That's why I more disappointed with him now than in the past.

  7. #482
    The Franchise PolishFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 42 View Post
    It's funny that people think pointing to Jrue's contract is criticism of Jrue.

    It's criticism of Dell and others, but not Jrue. That should be obvious enough not to be said, but here we are.

    Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
    Another poster who thinks is always right. No the criticism should not be just on Dell. Like HoustonPelicans said we could/should expect more from him once he got this huge deal.

  8. #483

    Pelicans at Trail Blazers 10-24-17

    Quote Originally Posted by PelsFan2313 View Post
    That's fair. I think the act of calling them out on something like that is dumb, because it's not like anyone is questioning the substance of the message...

    Agree to disagree I suppose.
    Funny, You think there’s substance to that message. . .

    Yep agree to disagree.
    Last edited by Mythrol; 10-26-2017 at 09:28 AM.

  9. #484
    Quote Originally Posted by Bricklayer View Post
    The discussion of Jrue should be centering around whether that will continue, why it's happening, is he giving the Pels defense at least, and how long you could continue to start a "player" averaging numbers like that if he were still mired in the slump 2 weeks from now for instance. All this contract talk obscures the problem. The play is the problem this season, not the contract.
    This has been what I’ve said the whole time. Jrue is not above criticism but his contract talk is pointless. Criticize the games and what the players are doing in them, not something that happened months ago.

    That said, 4 games into the season with the huge amount of injuries to this team is not the time to start making judgements on what this team or player is or isn’t. Everyone should give it a bit of time.

  10. #485
    The horrendous play is absolutely the problem. But, that naturally begs the question, did we make the right decision in resigning him? Performance and pay go hand in hand.

    Also, I just don’t get people suggesting that we all need to have a discussion on how to fix Jrue’s issues to better utilize his talents, like this is a new issue or something. We’ve had years to fix Jrue’s issues. Where has that gotten us? All these excuses:

    He was injured going into the year.

    He needs a full year to get acclimated to playing with Boogie.

    He needs to play alongside a true point guard.

    Meanwhile, Jameer’s been here for two games. He’s played without Solo, Rondo, and AD last game. Yet, the guy looks way more comfortable and confident out there than Jrue.

    Face it, Jrue’s been here since 2013. These issues aren't new. We’ve seen his talents on full display for years now. Is anyone really all that shocked he’s playing like this? I mean, sure..there have been times where he’s sucked less, but, for the most part, those brief moments of being slightly above average have been heavily overshadowed by how consistently bad he’s been for a while now. So, excuse some of us for still scratching our heads over why Dell & Co. decided to pay him $25 million when he apparently needs a perfect storm of basketball luck to have a halfway decent game.

  11. #486
    Quote Originally Posted by 42 View Post
    I don't think he looks out of shape. I think he looks stupefied. He looks nervous.

    Sometimes signing a big contract can do that. Look at Hill. I think part of his issue for most of last season (not the end, as he was better) was a combination of adjusting to skills he had not polished (e.g. 3's) and general nerves about being a featured, 8-figure guy.

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    Good point, he definitely has nerves. But I'm more concerned about him not adding anything to his game. He's the same player he was when we got him 4 years ago. Which is a pretty good player but I thought he would improve at some point. There's still time though I guess

  12. #487
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    Quote Originally Posted by PolishFan View Post
    Another poster who thinks is always right. No the criticism should not be just on Dell. Like HoustonPelicans said we could/should expect more from him once he got this huge deal.
    How is paying someone more going to make them better? The raiders are locked in. There are incentives, but the base salary is a massive increase from before.

    So, why does the expectation increase?

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  13. #488
    Dell knew he had to sign Jrue. In Dells eyes DC needed to see stability with the Pelicans and signing Jrue showed the Pelicans that. Same goes for Alvin Gentry that is why Alvin didnt get fired at seasons end. DC is called a Coach Killer Loser around the league for a reason. Now seeing him on our roster I agree.
    De'Aaron Fox is going to be a handful for Jrue Holiday. Look for Buddy to go work tonight.
    Last edited by Buckwheat; 10-26-2017 at 07:12 PM.

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