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Thread: GAMEDAY THREAD PELS at GRIZ 10/18/17

  1. #451
    A Soulful Sports Fan Contributor Eman5805's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    That's not how it works. Come on people, you're smarter than this and we've covered this already months ago.
    It's only going to get worse with time. If this season doesn't work out, and I happen to think it will, many more will echo that sentiment. That it would be better to have nothing than the occasional whatever it is we get from Jrue.

    Even see one of my favorite things I see in gaming "I'd rather have nothing."

  2. #452
    Jrue was available and the Pelicans needed a solid guard. And you can't change the past. Jrue is under contract and the Pel's need to find ways to make things work.
    From my point of view Rondo was missed big time last night. With all due respect to Moore, Clarke, Miller or Crawford, but none of those guys looked like he could run a team or should handle the ball a lot. With Cuz and AD playing their A games, there were way too many avoidable mistakes by the Pel's guards and wings. Cousins was fuming and at some point I barely expected him to go after Moore to tell him how a post entry pass should look like.
    Crawford looked absolutely aweful out there and his lack of defense really hurt us.

    Of course when most of your payroll is locked into the big man spots and one combo guard, you can't expect too much from your wings and off guards, but it still has to be better than this.

    What I don't understand is the reason, why the Pel's seem so eager to play uptempo. There were quite a few risky or bad passes to force the ball quickly up the floor and everything seemed rushed. Of course when your guards and wings are subpar mistakes will happen, when you force them to play fast. With 2 bigs commanding double teams and one of those bigs being matched up with Chandler Parsons for extended amount of time, there is absolutely no need to increase the pace to a level where mistakes are about to happen.
    Why not play under control, play simple and play off the double teams? Of course we should run, when we have the advantage after missed shots or turnovers, but there is no need to force things. The guards don't need to break the defense down at all costs. The team goes as far as Cuz and Ad can take it. The guards and wings should just try to avoid unnecessary mistakes and the coaching staff should recognise missmatches and take advantage of the superior size and strength. Don't be afraid to wrestle and don't try too hard to be a flashy finesse team!

  3. #453
    I’m with the guy that said let’s find a way to get Green and Nelson and let some of these scrubs go like Miller and Grits , Grits gets hot then he’s fun to watch but that’s not consistent enough to justify his roster spot and I’m not sure what Miller gives you I haven’t seen anything yet .


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  4. #454
    Pass-First Point Center Caffeinedisastr's Avatar
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    Dell
    Dell
    Dell.

    This team has no fit,
    no IQ (except for Rondo, who's on a 1 yr deal and hurt; go figure),
    no tradeable pieces to gain a return (except for next yrs draft pick)

    Dell's first business getting here was to trade Chris Paul (who already wanted out; not Dell's fault)
    However, the team hasn't had a real, decent point guard since he got here. (till Rondo)

    Jarrett Jack
    Greivis Vasquez
    Jrue Holiday
    Tim Frazier
    Ish Smith
    Austin Rivers
    Pierre Jackson
    Russ Smith
    ........Jimmer (shudder)

    Also, the best small forward they've had under Dell's reign was Trevor Ariza. (who was traded with Okafor for Rashard Lewis and a pick; Lewis never suited up)
    Quincy Pondexter (for how many games?)
    Solomon Hill
    Alonzo Gee
    John Salmons
    Luke Babbitt
    Darius Miller
    Dante Cunningham
    James Ennis

    Dell signed Ryan Anderson. This could be quantified as one of the only decent things he has done.
    Davis fell into his lap at #1.
    Boogie fell into his lap. Kings loved Buddy.

    He repeatedly gives out giant contracts to players when the money could be better used spread out around Davis.
    Gordon
    Evans
    Asik
    Ajinca
    Holiday

    Dell has to go.
    Even if it means Boogie walking, Dell has to go.
    After reading ANY of this, could anyone legitimately say they have faith that this man can put together a good team around Anthony Davis.

    Year 7
    Playoff appearances: 1 (8th seed sweep)

  5. #455
    So a ref gave boogie a tech for talking back to a fan who was cursing him out and ********??? I don't think the refs liked us very much last night man wow lol

  6. #456
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    Guys let see what happens on Friday in the Blender.
    Top shelf ball club coming to town.
    Will the Warriors play just enough to the competition and win easy? or will they blow us off the floor?
    Will Jrue Holiday slow down Steff Curry? Will Jrue Holiday go to work on Steff Curry?
    Loser Alvin Gentry should have this game plan in the bag lol

  7. #457
    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinedisastr View Post
    Dell
    Dell
    Dell.

    This team has no fit,
    no IQ (except for Rondo, who's on a 1 yr deal and hurt; go figure),
    no tradeable pieces to gain a return (except for next yrs draft pick)

    Dell's first business getting here was to trade Chris Paul (who already wanted out; not Dell's fault)
    However, the team hasn't had a real, decent point guard since he got here. (till Rondo)

    Jarrett Jack
    Greivis Vasquez
    Jrue Holiday
    Tim Frazier
    Ish Smith
    Austin Rivers
    Pierre Jackson
    Russ Smith
    ........Jimmer (shudder)

    Also, the best small forward they've had under Dell's reign was Trevor Ariza. (who was traded with Okafor for Rashard Lewis and a pick; Lewis never suited up)
    Quincy Pondexter (for how many games?)
    Solomon Hill
    Alonzo Gee
    John Salmons
    Luke Babbitt
    Darius Miller
    Dante Cunningham
    James Ennis

    Dell signed Ryan Anderson. This could be quantified as one of the only decent things he has done.
    Davis fell into his lap at #1.
    Boogie fell into his lap. Kings loved Buddy.

    He repeatedly gives out giant contracts to players when the money could be better used spread out around Davis.
    Gordon
    Evans
    Asik
    Ajinca
    Holiday

    Dell has to go.
    Even if it means Boogie walking, Dell has to go.
    After reading ANY of this, could anyone legitimately say they have faith that this man can put together a good team around Anthony Davis.

    Year 7
    Playoff appearances: 1 (8th seed sweep)
    Agreed!!

  8. #458
    Quote Originally Posted by RaisingTheBar View Post
    I find it hard to believe that we can't find anyone better than Miller to be on the roster. Dude is just not NBA level.
    So true
    The most overused words on Pelicansreport.com. Wrongly, I might add.

    ELITE - (often used with a plural verb) the choice or best of anything considered collectively, as of a group or class of persons.

    GREAT - notable; remarkable; exceptionally outstanding

    These words should not be used lightly

  9. #459
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythrol View Post
    That's not how it works. Come on people, you're smarter than this and we've covered this already months ago.
    Please explain how not resigning Jrue wouldn’t have freed up money to sign a wing scorer. We didn’t have to sign him correct? I understand that the Pels could pay extra b/c of exceptions but fill me in on why the Pels couldn’t spend money used on Holiday on another player. Dell overpaid for a mediocre player that is probably going to play himself to untradeable status shortly
    Last edited by UptownFuz504; 10-19-2017 at 03:25 PM.

  10. #460
    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinedisastr View Post
    Dell
    Dell
    Dell.

    This team has no fit,
    no IQ (except for Rondo, who's on a 1 yr deal and hurt; go figure),
    no tradeable pieces to gain a return (except for next yrs draft pick)

    Dell's first business getting here was to trade Chris Paul (who already wanted out; not Dell's fault)
    However, the team hasn't had a real, decent point guard since he got here. (till Rondo)

    Jarrett Jack
    Greivis Vasquez
    Jrue Holiday
    Tim Frazier
    Ish Smith
    Austin Rivers
    Pierre Jackson
    Russ Smith
    ........Jimmer (shudder)

    Also, the best small forward they've had under Dell's reign was Trevor Ariza. (who was traded with Okafor for Rashard Lewis and a pick; Lewis never suited up)
    Quincy Pondexter (for how many games?)
    Solomon Hill
    Alonzo Gee
    John Salmons
    Luke Babbitt
    Darius Miller
    Dante Cunningham
    James Ennis

    Dell signed Ryan Anderson. This could be quantified as one of the only decent things he has done.
    Davis fell into his lap at #1.
    Boogie fell into his lap. Kings loved Buddy.

    He repeatedly gives out giant contracts to players when the money could be better used spread out around Davis.
    Gordon
    Evans
    Asik
    Ajinca
    Holiday

    Dell has to go.
    Even if it means Boogie walking, Dell has to go.
    After reading ANY of this, could anyone legitimately say they have faith that this man can put together a good team around Anthony Davis.

    Year 7
    Playoff appearances: 1 (8th seed sweep)
    Exactly

  11. #461
    Boogie can’t be the best 3pt shooter on the team. Pels need more shooters. Ian Clarke is a good start.

  12. #462
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    Personally I think Jrue Holiday and Asik are the most awful loaded contracts we have on this ball club.
    Neither one these players are trade-able at this time. Lets see Friday night. I am looking to see what Jrue Holiday does with Steff Curry.
    He could drop 30+ on Curry? But he dropped 4 on Conley and we know Conley ate his lunch

  13. #463
    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinedisastr View Post
    Dell
    Dell
    Dell.

    This team has no fit,
    no IQ (except for Rondo, who's on a 1 yr deal and hurt; go figure),
    no tradeable pieces to gain a return (except for next yrs draft pick)

    Dell's first business getting here was to trade Chris Paul (who already wanted out; not Dell's fault)
    However, the team hasn't had a real, decent point guard since he got here. (till Rondo)

    Jarrett Jack
    Greivis Vasquez
    Jrue Holiday
    Tim Frazier
    Ish Smith
    Austin Rivers
    Pierre Jackson
    Russ Smith
    ........Jimmer (shudder)

    Also, the best small forward they've had under Dell's reign was Trevor Ariza. (who was traded with Okafor for Rashard Lewis and a pick; Lewis never suited up)
    Quincy Pondexter (for how many games?)
    Solomon Hill
    Alonzo Gee
    John Salmons
    Luke Babbitt
    Darius Miller
    Dante Cunningham
    James Ennis

    Dell signed Ryan Anderson. This could be quantified as one of the only decent things he has done.
    Davis fell into his lap at #1.
    Boogie fell into his lap. Kings loved Buddy.

    He repeatedly gives out giant contracts to players when the money could be better used spread out around Davis.
    Gordon
    Evans
    Asik
    Ajinca
    Holiday

    Dell has to go.
    Even if it means Boogie walking, Dell has to go.
    After reading ANY of this, could anyone legitimately say they have faith that this man can put together a good team around Anthony Davis.

    Year 7
    Playoff appearances: 1 (8th seed sweep)
    I like the laying out of the facts, and I agree 100%. There is nothing to do about it now. This should be a playoffs or bust year for the Dell/Gentry combo.

  14. #464
    Quote Originally Posted by UptownFuz504 View Post
    Please explain how not resigning Jrue wouldn’t have freed up money to sign a wing scorer. We didn’t have to sign him correct? I understand that the Pels could pay extra b/c of exceptions but fill me in on why the Pels couldn’t spend money used on Holiday on another player. Dell overpaid for a mediocre player that is probably going to play himself to untradeable status shortly
    Because of the other contracts on our books not signing Jrue would not have meant we would have had 25m to spend freely on whatever we want. We still would have been close to the cap even by letting Jrue walk. We would have created yet another hole on our roster and not had the money to fill.

    Keep in mind also, even if we HAD money, and even if we HAD let Jrue walk, we would never have spent it on a wing player after just signing Solomon Hill. That money would have went to trying to get a starting PG and SG.

  15. #465
    Quote Originally Posted by UptownFuz504 View Post
    Please explain how not resigning Jrue wouldn’t have freed up money to sign a wing scorer. We didn’t have to sign him correct? I understand that the Pels could pay extra b/c of exceptions but fill me in on why the Pels couldn’t spend money used on Holiday on another player. Dell overpaid for a mediocre player that is probably going to play himself to untradeable status shortly
    The problem is Demps has done such a terrible building this team he can only try to continue digging his way out. The Gordon, Asik and now Holiday deal are all evidence. He invested too many assets into unnecessary mid reward high risk moves. Now everything is resting on this season and the only thing he could do was throw cap space away on Jrue.

  16. #466
    While I consider virtually every piece on the team outside of Cousins/Davis to be blindingly mediocre, including Jrue in the role he's being asked to play, I do think it's possible to get better results just by sorting out roles and rotations. One of the problems with having so many similar level 8th-10th men types on the team is that there is no clear hierarchy, and in the first game it felt like guys were just being thrown out there in random combinations to see if anybody would randomly catch fire. There need to be some choices made, some roles defined.

    Won't matter though if Jrue is going to be so shaky that your center is having to play PG every night.

  17. #467
    Quote Originally Posted by UptownFuz504 View Post
    Please explain how not resigning Jrue wouldn’t have freed up money to sign a wing scorer. We didn’t have to sign him correct? I understand that the Pels could pay extra b/c of exceptions but fill me in on why the Pels couldn’t spend money used on Holiday on another player. Dell overpaid for a mediocre player that is probably going to play himself to untradeable status shortly
    If we had not resigned Jrue we would have had around 12 to 15 million to sign free agents. Look back at free agency and see who we could have picked up for that amount. It wasn't enough to sign Teague and probably wouldn't have been enough to pull Mills away from the Spurs. Who else would you have signed? What makes you think we wouldn't have had to overpay to get them here? Jrue was really the only option because the money that was available wasn't enough to bring in any needle movers.

    I'm convinced Dell should have A) kept Monty B) hired JVG C) stepped down due to being in over his head. In that order.

    Put me on the Gentry should be fired list. If we are at 500 at the end of November he can keep his job for another month. If we miss the playoffs it's time to clean house.

    Sucks for Boogie and AD.

  18. #468
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    Listen Friday night when they announce Alvin Gentry he has been getting Boos for 2 years straight.
    Its terrible what has happened with this franchise is such short period of time.

  19. #469
    Quote Originally Posted by P_B_&_G View Post
    If we had not resigned Jrue we would have had around 12 to 15 million to sign free agents. Look back at free agency and see who we could have picked up for that amount. It wasn't enough to sign Teague and probably wouldn't have been enough to pull Mills away from the Spurs. Who else would you have signed? What makes you think we wouldn't have had to overpay to get them here? Jrue was really the only option because the money that was available wasn't enough to bring in any needle movers.

    I'm convinced Dell should have A) kept Monty B) hired JVG C) stepped down due to being in over his head. In that order.

    Put me on the Gentry should be fired list. If we are at 500 at the end of November he can keep his job for another month. If we miss the playoffs it's time to clean house.

    Sucks for Boogie and AD.
    Could have stretched Asik, which they would have done for the right guy.

    Easily could have signed, say Collison and maybe CJ Miles. Then, with room exception, go get Dante. Bring in Clark for the same min contract. Kept Quinn Cook

    That team aint worse and its way more flexible moving forward. Collision has 2 mil guaranteed next year.

    Look - Dell had a bunch of bad choices, but the narrative that he had NO CHOICE but to bend over and take it from Jrue's agent and bring him back is plain false. Heck, he could have Jameer now too if he went that path. You telling me Jrue is gonna do so much better than a Nelson/Collison combo?

    He had no great choice, but he had A CHOICE.
    @mcnamara247

  20. #470
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! pelicanchamp's Avatar
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    It's one game. Everyone is freaking out. I'm disappointed but I don't think one yucky game is enough to dismiss holiday as a waste or to assume this bench will never improve.

    They will be very good before all star break. Jrue is a coveted pg. he'll make y'all eat your words tomorrow night. Watch.


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  21. #471
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    Could have stretched Asik, which they would have done for the right guy.

    Easily could have signed, say Collison and maybe CJ Miles. Then, with room exception, go get Dante. Bring in Clark for the same min contract. Kept Quinn Cook

    That team aint worse and its way more flexible moving forward. Collision has 2 mil guaranteed next year.

    Look - Dell had a bunch of bad choices, but the narrative that he had NO CHOICE but to bend over and take it from Jrue's agent and bring him back is plain false. Heck, he could have Jameer now too if he went that path. You telling me Jrue is gonna do so much better than a Nelson/Collison combo?

    He had no great choice, but he had A CHOICE.
    No disagreement here, never said he didn't have a choice. Just trying to point out the seeming misconception that we could have used everything we paid to Jrue to bring in free agents. You know how the cap works better than most so its easy for you to see what the alternatives were. Again, non of those guys you mention are needle movers, but neither is Jrue apparently. So, if the question is what should we have done to keep maximum flexibility, then absolutely you let Jrue walk. Dell had choices to make and he decided to roll with Jrue. Right now, Jrue has a long way to go to earn his money.

    I'm with you in that the other options would likely have resulted in us not being any worse. But is not any worse where we really need to be?

    Had Dell decided to do exactly what you said, and all of those guys agreed to come here. We still probably lose last night either way and have the opposite discussion.

    We should have paid Jrue!

  22. #472
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    Dell had a choice the Draft. Juwan Evans sitting waiting the best pure Point Guard in the draft. He could have let Holiday hit the road.

  23. #473
    Quote Originally Posted by pelicanchamp View Post
    It's one game. Everyone is freaking out. I'm disappointed but I don't think one yucky game is enough to dismiss holiday as a waste or to assume this bench will never improve.

    They will be very good before all star break. Jrue is a coveted pg. he'll make y'all eat your words tomorrow night. Watch.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I hope you are right and I agree that its only one game. Jrue needs to at least get into double figures every night. I still think it will take some time to gel. If we are around 500 when Rondo comes back we should be okay. Hell, if we are at 500 at the end of November I think we will be doing well.

    I can't be too mad about losing on the road to a team that has made the playoffs for 7 straight years. We need to be around 500 against good teams and beat the teams we are supposed to beat. If we can do that we should be fine.

  24. #474
    Well, looks like its going to be just what most of us thought.

    Either they will figure it out or it will be a spectacular disaster!

  25. #475
    A Soulful Sports Fan Contributor Eman5805's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P_B_&_G View Post
    Well, looks like its going to be just what most of us thought.

    Either they will figure it out or it will be a spectacular disaster!
    One way or the other, we'll know. Demps and Gentry will either get us into the playoffs. Or finally be shown the door.


    Or they damn well better be.

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