Lets Rank Jrue Holiday

[NMThreeMVP]

Westbrook, Wall, Payton, Bradley, Beverly and Rubio.
Stats don't measure point guards. A point should be able to run the offensive system and make his teammates better.
Holiday can't operate Gentry's point guard friendly system. Look at the difference between EG in Houston and here. It's the same system. Holiday isn't a good decision maker to be the primary go through guy.
Dell is boxed and will sign Holiday to a near max contract.

I don't disagree with your second point. But are you saying Payton, and Rubio are better defensively? I'd take Jrue over Rubio in a 7 game series if the objective was stopping Curry, Westbrook or CP3. And unless you're talking about Gary Payton, I'm not sure I agree with Payton being better than Jrue. Avery Bradley isn't really a PG. Wall is debatable as a defensive upgrade, but clearly an overall upgrade. Beverly is better defensively, but Jrue -even with all his faults- is much better offensively than Beverly.

Hopefully Dell has the kind of relationship with Jrue, his family and his agent that will allow him to let Jrue test the market and come back to the Pelicans with his best offer. If the expectation is that the Pelicans will max Jrue at 12:01 on day one, and anything less is an insult, we're going to be in trouble.

[PolishFan]

Hopefully Dell has the kind of relationship with Jrue, his family and his agent that will allow him to let Jrue test the market and come back to the Pelicans with his best offer. If the expectation is that the Pelicans will max Jrue at 12:01 on day one, and anything less is an insult, we're going to be in trouble.

It would be great if it went like this unless Jrue proves in the next 20 games that he is the perfect PG for this team. Then they give him the max at 12:01 but he would really have to show his playmaking skills cause that's what I have my biggest concerns with.

[durun]

I don't disagree with your second point. But are you saying Payton, and Rubio are better defensively? I'd take Jrue over Rubio in a 7 game series if the objective was stopping Curry, Westbrook or CP3. And unless you're talking about Gary Payton, I'm not sure I agree with Payton being better than Jrue. Avery Bradley isn't really a PG. Wall is debatable as a defensive upgrade, but clearly an overall upgrade. Beverly is better defensively, but Jrue -even with all his faults- is much better offensively than Beverly.

Hopefully Dell has the kind of relationship with Jrue, his family and his agent that will allow him to let Jrue test the market and come back to the Pelicans with his best offer. If the expectation is that the Pelicans will max Jrue at 12:01 on day one, and anything less is an insult, we're going to be in trouble.

Bradley is in class by himself as a defender. As you noted, AB is a combo guard. I will make the same argument that Holiday is a combo guard. Unlike Bradley, Holiday can't play extended periods without the ball.
Holiday's agent will not allow him to really test the market. Unlike the NFL, free agency is after the draft. This draft is loaded with point guards. Probably six point guards will be selected in the lottery. My guess Philly will select a point guard. The Knicks may select a point guard too or trade for Rubio. I don't see any other options for Holiday. The free agency market will be limited for Holiday.
I believe a deal was put in place for Holiday to resign with the Pels last summer. The qualifier is whether Dell is fired after the season. I am not convinced Dell is safe unless the team is playoff bound.

[luckyman]

I'll say this much, Holiday is the key to this team as constructed. If he has a poor game as a pg, as he has these past 2 games, the entire team suffers.

He's always been this way and remains inconsistent. If Dell can somehow find a way to make an upgrade he certainly needs to. Even if it's just an upgrade to a consistent player that might be a notch below Holiday skill wise.

The point guard spot on this team remains a problem.

[6warddude]

I'll say this much, Holiday is the key to this team as constructed. If he has a poor game as a pg, as he has these past 2 games, the entire team suffers.

He's always been this way and remains inconsistent. If Dell can somehow find a way to make an upgrade he certainly needs to. Even if it's just an upgrade to a consistent player that might be a notch below Holiday skill wise.

The point guard spot on this team remains a problem.

good consistent PG play is crucial to this team now....i dont know who is out there but we need two of them if we are going to resign jrue....

[NMThreeMVP]

Bradley is in class by himself as a defender. As you noted, AB is a combo guard. I will make the same argument that Holiday is a combo guard. Unlike Bradley, Holiday can't play extended periods without the ball.
Holiday's agent will not allow him to really test the market. Unlike the NFL, free agency is after the draft. This draft is loaded with point guards. Probably six point guards will be selected in the lottery. My guess Philly will select a point guard. The Knicks may select a point guard too or trade for Rubio. I don't see any other options for Holiday. The free agency market will be limited for Holiday.
I believe a deal was put in place for Holiday to resign with the Pels last summer. The qualifier is whether Dell is fired after the season. I am not convinced Dell is safe unless the team is playoff bound.

Pelicans can't sign Jrue before the draft.

[P_B_&_G]

I don't disagree with your second point. But are you saying Payton, and Rubio are better defensively? I'd take Jrue over Rubio in a 7 game series if the objective was stopping Curry, Westbrook or CP3. And unless you're talking about Gary Payton, I'm not sure I agree with Payton being better than Jrue. Avery Bradley isn't really a PG. Wall is debatable as a defensive upgrade, but clearly an overall upgrade. Beverly is better defensively, but Jrue -even with all his faults- is much better offensively than Beverly.

Hopefully Dell has the kind of relationship with Jrue, his family and his agent that will allow him to let Jrue test the market and come back to the Pelicans with his best offer. If the expectation is that the Pelicans will max Jrue at 12:01 on day one, and anything less is an insult, we're going to be in trouble.

I agree with all of this but speaking in terms of defense only I think Jrue is equal to Beverly. But by that list I still have him ahead of Payton and Rubio.

Let's not forget we can offer Jrue more than anyone overall because of the 5th year. I'm hoping he will sign for less than the max but more than anyone else can offer because of that extra year.

[luckyman]

good consistent PG play is crucial to this team now....i dont know who is out there but we need two of them if we are going to resign jrue....

Or find a consistent, AS/ fringe AS wing. Then Holiday can play like a moron all he wants.

[NMThreeMVP]

Man...

Good news is no one, not even us, will pay Holiday near the max if he doesn't start to play significantly better. I mean, dude has been horrible on both ends.

Bad new is we're all fully aware of how terrible Jrue Holiday can be and his flaws have been fully accentuated over the last 3 games, and the most likely scenario is that he will be our starting PG next season.

I'm still leaning on small sample size, but this dude has to get his mind right soon.

[N.O.Bronco]

Man...

Good news is no one, not even us, will pay Holiday near the max if he doesn't start to play significantly better. I mean, dude has been horrible on both ends.

Bad new is we're all fully aware of how terrible Jrue Holiday can be and his flaws have been fully accentuated over the last 3 games, and the most likely scenario is that he will be our starting PG next season.

I'm still leaning on small sample size, but this dude has to get his mind right soon.

This is starting to feel eerily similar to the Asik situation.

Give up so much to get the guy, lacking flexibility to seek out alternative options, thus you are in a situation where the best short-term move you have is over-paying to keep your guy but in two years it could be another anchor contract that prevents you from key moves to get better.

If Jrue can't get it together I also fully expect Cousins to literally lose it on the guy by the end of the season and who knows how that ends up. But his play has been downright gross to watch.

[Darkhorse985]

This is starting to feel eerily similar to the Asik situation.

Give up so much to get the guy, lacking flexibility to seek out alternative options, thus you are in a situation where the best short-term move you have is over-paying to keep your guy but in two years it could be another anchor contract that prevents you from key moves to get better.

If Jrue can't get it together I also fully expect Cousins to literally lose it on the guy by the end of the season and who knows how that ends up. But his play has been downright gross to watch.

I feel that Dell will make the exact same mistake with Holiday as he did with Asik. Overpaying and overvaluing a mediocre talent.

[Thepeelsessions]

I feel that Dell will make the exact same mistake with Holiday as he did with Asik. Overpaying and overvaluing a mediocre talent.

That's why if you're smart, you don't give Dell that chance.

[UptownFuz504]

Did you just say that George Hill is better than Jrue?

Did he just say that all those dudes are better than Kyrie?

[All Metro]

He said NOT IN ORDER

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[UptownFuz504]

This exactly, people discount elite defense.

How about you make a list of the top defensive PG. Then average them with what is clearly a list if offensive ability.

Jrue is probably top 5 defensively and if he's about top 12 offensively that puts him right about number 8 or so.

He is not an elite defender. Can we please stop with this urban legend.

[N.O.Bronco]

He is not an elite defender. Can we please stop with this urban legend.

I'd say when he wants to he can and is an elite defender. Problem is, like on the other side of the ball, he lacks consistency. And that consistency issue is why I can't call him elite or rank him in my top ten.

[UptownFuz504]

I think Rubio would do well here. He plays d and will run the offense. We'd just have to get shooters to surround him with.

[eballa1]

Simmons did this on his pod Friday. He had Jrue in the early 20's before the pod and on the pod they ranked again and he came out a little better, but still around 20ish.

[UptownFuz504]

I'd say when he wants to he can and is an elite defender. Problem is, like on the other side of the ball, he lacks consistency. And that consistency issue is why I can't call him elite or rank him in my top ten.

Reread what you typed and then tell me what is elite about that.

[AD23nEG10]

lets assume Jrue struggles the rest of the season. I feel like we still need to re-sign him. My question is - does another team offer him the max, putting the pressure on us to do the same or will his price go down?

[tyler]

Jeff Teague is an unrestricted free agent

[N.O.Bronco]

Reread what you typed and then tell me what is elite about that.

Not sure what is not to get Jrue can be an elite defender and is for stretches of games at a time. He just can not put it together consistently the way a player like CP3, Beverly or the guy you mentioned, Ricky Rubio does.


So that(along with his offensive inconsistency) is why I DON'T call Jrue elite defensively, or overall.

[UptownFuz504]

Not sure what is not to get Jrue can be an elite defender and is for stretches of games at a time. He just can not put it together consistently the way a player like CP3, Beverly or the guy you mentioned, Ricky Rubio does.


So that(along with his offensive inconsistency) is why I DON'T call Jrue elite defensively, or overall.

Gotcha

[hornetsrebirth]

What was Jrue doing on that play where Cousins got put on a poster by Westbrook?

[UptownFuz504]

What was Jrue doing on that play where Cousins got put on a poster by Westbrook?

Playing "elite defense". LOL