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Thread: The House that Thibs Built- a must read for anyone clamoring for Thibs

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    Scotty Brooks has also finished with top offenses over the years. But looking beyond the numbers will tell you its neither creative nor dynamic.
    I guess the question behind this statement is .. So what? Top 5 is top 5.


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  2. #102
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! NOLa.'s Avatar
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    Im glad Brooks is being brought up because im tired of people saying he isnt a good coach (opinion) when I tell them he is a winning coach (fact) who has developed talent like Durant, Westbrook, Harden and Ibaka (fact).

    They say "Well I still dont think he is a good coach"

    Well, like, thats just like your opinion.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    I guess the question behind this statement is .. So what? Top 5 is top 5.


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    So when it comes to be the playoffs and coaches have analyzed your pet sets inside and out, it becomes increasingly difficult to produce the same results. The Warriors had the 12th best offense under Jackson. It was good, it worked, but when they added Kerr and Gentry, it took them to new heights. Improvement can always be there. You ask most OKC fans if they could have improved in late game execution, and they would have said yes.

  4. #104
    The Voice of Reason Contributor RaisingTheBar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UptownFuz504 View Post
    When Thibs finds a clue on offense, I may be open to him. Until then, I'll pass. His teams go on major scoring droughts and never come through in the big game. Yeah, yeah I know. Injuries blah blah blah, he made it to the CF that one time blah blah blah. He's losing to the Cavs and most likely going fishing tonight when he bar none has the best team in the series. Wake me up when he gets out of the 2nd round for a change.
    Wake me up when we've had a HC that in his worst season wins 48 games, without our star player for 2 seasons.

  5. #105
    The Voice of Reason Contributor RaisingTheBar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I think there are two different questions here:

    1. Is Thibs a good coach?

    2. Will Dell want to hire him?

    I say yes to #1 and no to #2
    3. Maybe Dell doesn't get as much say in this hire as some are thinking. See who fired Monthy, it's amazing to me that the GM didn't do that.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinedisastr View Post
    Is it wrong to want

    "New & Innovative Thinking"
    over
    "Established & Proven"?
    No, but I bring it forward to another analogy. To me it's like deciding between a Ferrari or the car behind door #1. I get that choosing door #1 is exciting, but let's make the obvious choice here.

    If we're talking a guy like D'Antoni, maybe more of an Acura, then ok let's play the game.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    So when it comes to be the playoffs and coaches have analyzed your pet sets inside and out, it becomes increasingly difficult to produce the same results. The Warriors had the 12th best offense under Jackson. It was good, it worked, but when they added Kerr and Gentry, it took them to new heights. Improvement can always be there. You ask most OKC fans if they could have improved in late game execution, and they would have said yes.
    Would you say the Heat had a dynamic offense ? I personally wouldn't. I'd say they had the proper players in place to make the plays at the right time. The bottom line is, Thibs doesn't have the talent in place offensively to be more effective at the end of games.

    Only few teams have dynamic talent to win a ring. When we compare to the gsw, they're the exception and not the rule. Again, 12th best not 5th best like Brooks. I think there's a gulf there.

    I bet if you ask most fans of any team they would agree they could improve late game execution. So o agree okc fans would say that.

    It's just my opinion on the matter we can take it for what it's worth.


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  8. #108
    Pass-First Point Center Caffeinedisastr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    No, but I bring it forward to another analogy. To me it's like deciding between a Ferrari or the car behind door #1. I get that choosing door #1 is exciting, but let's make the obvious choice here.

    If we're talking a guy like D'Antoni, maybe more of an Acura, then ok let's play the game.
    Thibs is more like a Lincoln.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by UptownFuz504 View Post
    Seriously speaking (no troll). Do you not think the Bulls are better than the Cavs this year? Do you think that they'll move on? My answer is yes to the first and no to the latter. If one the main defenses is that he lost to LBJ, it'll get no easier out West. I don't care about minutes played. That's hogwash to me. I'm concerned about his ability to take a team all the way. I don't think he can. He has had tons of success in the regular season and as an assistant but that doesn't mean he's the guy to take us over the hump. For the record. I do not hate Thibs. I just don't consider him elite.
    On my phone so responses will be short.

    Yes, I think the cabs have the superior all around roster. Levron is better then either rose or butler by quite a margin. Irving when healthy is better then rose currently. I also think people undervalue how good Thibs is at getting guys to produce in his systems. Deng, rose, robinson, gasol and several others should speak volumes about how Thibs gets players playing at their peak and optimally for the team. I think Thibs overachieved with his talent most years and makes them look Better then they are and Blatt bats average if not a bit below.

    The cavs win in depth and role players IMO.

    Give Thibs and Blatt equal talent and I think Thibs wins that series 10 out 10 times IMO.

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    Would you say the Heat had a dynamic offense ? I personally wouldn't. I'd say they had the proper players in place to make the plays at the right time. The bottom line is, Thibs doesn't have the talent in place offensively to be more effective at the end of games.

    Only few teams have dynamic talent to win a ring. When we compare to the gsw, they're the exception and not the rule. Again, 12th best not 5th best like Brooks. I think there's a gulf there.

    I bet if you ask most fans of any team they would agree they could improve late game execution. So o agree okc fans would say that.

    It's just my opinion on the matter we can take it for what it's worth.


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    Yeah I absolutely would say the heat had a dynamic offense. Sure they had otherworldly talent, but Spo maximized that with his small ball sets. Its how they took apart Brook's Thunder in the finals who left Perkins in for way too long. Its how they punished Spilter the first go around. The 2013 Finals were all pace and space by Miami, only to be beaten the by the pace and space Spurs of 2014

  11. #111
    The Franchise DarkHornet's Avatar
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    Let's say hypothetically that Demps would hire Thibodeau. If the Bulls want to force the issue and try to get something for him, is Thibodeau worth giving something up to the Bulls in order to get?

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by N.O.Bronco View Post
    On my phone so responses will be short.

    Yes, I think the cabs have the superior all around roster. Levron is better then either rose or butler by quite a margin. Irving when healthy is better then rose currently. I also think people undervalue how good Thibs is at getting guys to produce in his systems. Deng, rose, robinson, gasol and several others should speak volumes about how Thibs gets players playing at their peak and optimally for the team. I think Thibs overachieved with his talent most years and makes them look Better then they are and Blatt bats average if not a bit below.

    The cavs win in depth and role players IMO.

    Give Thibs and Blatt equal talent and I think Thibs wins that series 10 out 10 times IMO.
    What's funny is most here seem to think that this current Bulls team is the best Thibs has had. And that the Bulls have a better team than the Cavs especially with no Love and a gimpy Irving. This could be homerism but is food for thought.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    No, but I bring it forward to another analogy. To me it's like deciding between a Ferrari or the car behind door #1. I get that choosing door #1 is exciting, but let's make the obvious choice here.

    If we're talking a guy like D'Antoni, maybe more of an Acura, then ok let's play the game.


    I do get this feeling a lot reading some posts here haha.

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  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkHornet View Post
    Let's say hypothetically that Demps would hire Thibodeau. If the Bulls want to force the issue and try to get something for him, is Thibodeau worth giving something up to the Bulls in order to get?
    If our guys truly believe he's the best candidate out there, then absolutely. The right coach is worth it obviously. But I hope it's no more than a second rounder type of thing.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by N.O.Bronco View Post
    I do get this feeling a lot reading some posts here haha.

    lol, I love that one.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    Yeah I absolutely would say the heat had a dynamic offense. Sure they had otherworldly talent, but Spo maximized that with his small ball sets. Its how they took apart Brook's Thunder in the finals who left Perkins in for way too long. Its how they punished Spilter the first go around. The 2013 Finals were all pace and space by Miami, only to be beaten the by the pace and space Spurs of 2014
    The offense doesn't look too dynamic this year. The fact is you have the have the talent in place which was the argument before.


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  17. #117
    Case and point, Thibs's refusal to play Mirotic this series. The Bulls are a net 10pts/100 better when Mirotic plays than Gibson, yet gibson has double the minutes. In fact, check the net Ratings for the entire playoffs: http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612...T_RATING&dir=1

    Its this refusal to adapt that irks people.

  18. #118
    I'm just saying Thibs would not have a 22nd ranked defense with this team. Offense hasn't really been the problem.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    The offense doesn't look too dynamic this year. The fact is you have the have the talent in place which was the argument before.


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    I mean I don't think anyone is claiming you can run the same looks without LeBron or Bosh. But if you place Brooks incharge of the 2012 Miami Roster, and Spo in charge of the Thunder, you may see different results. Not saying the Thunder would win, but Spo wouldn't play Perkins as much as Brooks did.

    You have two coaches and give them equal talent, why would you not pick the guy that gives your talent more looks?

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by FlyPelicanFly View Post
    I'm just saying Thibs would not have a 22nd ranked defense with this team. Offense hasn't really been the problem.
    Do we have a 100% guarantee? Again, take a look at all our starting lineups- stellar defensively. Monty can clearly put together a good defense when his talent plays. Our Post ASG defense was only 2pts/100 worse than the Bulls.

  21. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    I mean I don't think anyone is claiming you can run the same looks without LeBron or Bosh. But if you place Brooks incharge of the 2012 Miami Roster, and Spo in charge of the Thunder, you may see different results. Not saying the Thunder would win, but Spo wouldn't play Perkins as much as Brooks did.

    You have two coaches and give them equal talent, why would you not pick the guy that gives your talent more looks?
    I also wanted to note, I don't think Thib is an offensive genius by any means.

    I think you also have to look at experience in this. Given those two coaches, spo just came off of a final appearance and was mentored by Riley. So I do agree he gets more out of the roster. If Brooks were in the same position as Spo from day 1 (big 3 , Riley, etc) , there's no telling what happens. I think Miami still wins a ring or two. But as they are I think Spo get another play or two a game that Brooks doesn't give you.


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  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    Case and point, Thibs's refusal to play Mirotic this series. The Bulls are a net 10pts/100 better when Mirotic plays than Gibson, yet gibson has double the minutes. In fact, check the net Ratings for the entire playoffs: http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612...T_RATING&dir=1

    Its this refusal to adapt that irks people.
    Come onnnnnnn!!!! Mirotic injured his knee and had a possible concussion in the series against the Bucks, causing him to miss a game and have a limp for a period of time. He's also playing his first season in the NBA and his first playoffs. It's not exactly shocking that Taj Gibson would be the first guy off the bench. Taj is averaging about 23.7 minutes a game to Mirotic's 15 minutes a game. That's with some blow outs, some foul trouble for each of them and a lot of other factors, specifically the injury. Taj has gone:

    8 and 5 on 3-5
    11 and 2 on 5-5
    9 and 9 on 3-4
    6 and 8 on 2-7
    10 and 5 on 4-12

    Last two as a starter in place of Gasol. He's played over 30 minutes one time this series. Surely that can't be your reason for not liking Thibs.

  23. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
    Case and point, Thibs's refusal to play Mirotic this series. The Bulls are a net 10pts/100 better when Mirotic plays than Gibson, yet gibson has double the minutes. In fact, check the net Ratings for the entire playoffs: http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612...T_RATING&dir=1

    Its this refusal to adapt that irks people.
    He's been awful this series. Absolutely awful. He also was coming off of injury as well as has had foul trouble.


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  24. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by DirtySouf View Post
    What's funny is most here seem to think that this current Bulls team is the best Thibs has had. And that the Bulls have a better team than the Cavs especially with no Love and a gimpy Irving. This could be homerism but is food for thought.
    I would say given Roses health and the teams age they are a step below his 10-11 and 11-12 teams.

    The Bulls also had no Gasol and Rose has only had 5 games to get re-acclimated before the playoffs. Not exactly ideal. Plus Thibs is on his way out. I mean for a guy that was a walking corpse all season and the GM and ownership have done everything they can to sabotage him, I think he did pretty well. If we are going to play the excuse game you have to play for both teams.

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by N.O.Bronco View Post
    I would say given Roses health and the teams age they are a step below his 10-11 and 11-12 teams.

    The Bulls also had no Gasol and Rose has only had 5 games to get re-acclimated before the playoffs. Not exactly ideal. Plus Thibs is on his way out. I mean for a guy that was a walking corpse all season and the GM and ownership have done everything they can to sabotage him, I think he did pretty well. If we are going to play the excuse game you have to play for both teams.
    Hence why I mentioned homerism. This was not my point of view. This is just the Bulls' version of how we are with our team.

    What makes you think they are sabotaging him?

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