Suppose to foul on 3pt play

[N.O.Bronco]

This was a test. And you failed.

i said to myself, I bet WisconsinHornet would pull this one line out and comment on it. I didn't say at all that Monty lacks the gravitas of "a Carlisle or a Pop." He specifically lacks the gravitas of CARLISLE and POP. Two individuals. That have won championships and have the 120% backing of ownership. The deification of Thibs has to stop. What has he won? How many eastern conf finals has played in? How many has he won? He's in the f'kn Easter Conference, for christ's sake!

Thibs would have run this brittle team into the ground. And Thibs (or any other NBA coach for that matter), if placed on the hotseat by ownership, wouldn't have had any better success getting a back court with the IQ of Tyreke Evans and Eric Gordon to be the NBA version of the Hart Foundation (The Excellence of Execution)!

Thibs. Get out of here.

Thibs got outcoached by the video guy for the Miami Heat (Eric Spoelstra) and Randy Wittman.

So Thibs, who took his first year team to the Eastern Conference finals and then, despite losing Rose every season, has made the playoffs and never fell below 45 wins hasn't proven anything, but Monty gets a pass on that metric?

As for his backcourt success, he actually has a damn good track record. Has revitalized several careers, or at least got them to produce in his system effectively.

Not sure the Thibs hate. The only true knock people have on him are outside of his X's and O's and his system. Of which a lot is speculation. But probably a good bit of truth to it. What you are talking about is pretty hyperbolic and speculative.

For one where is this evidence that Monty doesnt have the ability to bench players?

[NMThreeMVP]

Between the 6 minute mark and the 1 minute mark Evans botched or put no effort on every single offensive possession he was the facilitator. We also gave up basket after basket by giving up the paint or not getting rebounds. We also had Ryno on his hottest night this year. Yet he didn't get a single shot created for him, just one he created himself, and then didn't get a look for the last 4 minutes.

I'm sorry but a couple times you let them play through, after half a dozen times you need to adjust. Re-focus the team. It took til the 3:30 mark for Monty to call a TO and out of that timeout we end up in an Evans iso for a miss and a bucket the other way. No attempt to correct the points in the paint and rebounding issue or get the offense flowing so we can match bucket for bucket again. Evans isolation and shot selection are the problem and you double down on that?

Jrue is back in and we still let Evans botch possessions until by luck at the 1:00 minute mark the only pass Davis can make out of rebound is to Jrue who creates a wide open look for Gordon. The first genuinely created shot in 5 minutes. Who not unsurprisingly misses because the flow of the offense has been garbage for the last real-time 20 minutes.

Monty gets blame here. He sat idle and did nothing to get the team to adjust. Didn't try and correct the issue Evans was creating with offensive flow and didn't address the bleeding on the other end.

If I had witnessed him draw up a Ryno shot out of the timeout - heck even a Ryno post up - or yelled at Evans to let Jrue run the offense, I could of been more forgiving. But he just stood baffled and pouting as things didn't miraculously cure themselves like he seemingly had hoped.

I'm not an usher at the arena, I promise you, but are your seats next to, or directly behind the bench? Just curious.

I fault Monty for not being able to coach Tyreke. There is obviously a Tyreke/Monty problem in terms of being on the same bball wavelength. Tyreke is not an extension of the coach on the floor. But the solution is either you move Tyreke or you replace Monty, and I'm not convinced Coach K or Phil Jackson would be able to minimize the negative of Tyreke's game and increase his abilities/willingness to execute within the offense.

How would you have addressed the issues last night in the 4th? You're blaming Monty for sitting idly by, but I don't understand specifically what you would have had him do? From my perspective, and my seats may not be as good as yours if you're sitting next to or behind the bench, Monty repeatedly told players what needed to be done and the players didn't or couldn't do it.

[Perth_Hornet]

I'm not an usher at the arena, I promise you, but are your seats next to, or directly behind the bench? Just curious.

I fault Monty for not being able to coach Tyreke. There is obviously a Tyreke/Monty problem in terms of being on the same bball wavelength. Tyreke is not an extension of the coach on the floor. But the solution is either you move Tyreke or you replace Monty, and I'm not convinced Coach K or Phil Jackson would be able to minimize the negative of Tyreke's game and increase his abilities/willingness to execute within the offense.

How would you have addressed the issues last night in the 4th? You're blaming Monty for sitting idly by, but I don't understand specifically what you would have had him do? From my perspective, and my seats may not be as good as yours if you're sitting next to or behind the bench, Monty repeatedly told players what needed to be done and the players didn't or couldn't do it.

This has been a season long issue.

Truth is, contending teams don't have boneheads as their number 2 guy.

[NMThreeMVP]

So Thibs, who took his first year team to the Eastern Conference finals and then, despite losing Rose every season, has made the playoffs and never fell below 45 wins hasn't proven anything, but Monty gets a pass on that metric?

As for his backcourt success, he actually has a damn good track record. Has revitalized several careers, or at least got them to produce in his system effectively.

Not sure the Thibs hate. The only true knock people have on him are outside of his X's and O's and his system. Of which a lot is speculation. But probably a good bit of truth to it. What you are talking about is pretty hyperbolic and speculative.

For one where is this evidence that Monty doesnt have the ability to bench players?

It's the E A S T E R N ...C O N F E R E N C E.

You know who else gets their team in the playoffs in that conference? Jason Kidd, Lionel Hollins, Randy Whitmann, Dwayne Casey. It's not exactly a murderers row over the last few years like the west. My hyperbolic response to Thibs is in direct proportion to the hyperbole that surrounds him as supposedly one of the league's top 5 coaches.

And his offenses will frequently look downright brutal.

I in no way meant to imply that Monty does not have the authority to bench players. I'm sure he does. Monty also has the mandate to win games and make the playoffs THIS season. He started the season with no legitimate small forward and no backup PG, making minutes for Tyreke a necessity. When we finally get QPon and Cole, we don't have Jrue. Again, making minutes for Tyreke a necessity.

Coaches that don't have a mandate placed on them, like Brad Stevens, or coaches that have depth, have the ability to bench players. When you're fighting for your job and the 8th seed, you're backed into a corner if you're trying to send a message to player that may cost you a game or two, that you HAVE TO win.

[RobertM320]

You admit in your own post that Monty lacks the gravitas of a Carlisle or a Pop. Or a Thibs. Know who's available to coach the Pellies in 2 weeks? Um ahh... THIBS. The 3rd, 4th, or 5th best basketball coach on the entire planet.

You mean the basketball coach who's NEVER won a championship at ANY level in his entire life? In fact, he's never even made it to the NBA Finals in the six seasons he's been the head coach in Chicago? That's the coach you're calling one of the top five basketball coaches on the entire planet? You lose any credibility at all with that statement.

[NMThreeMVP]

This has been a season long issue.

Truth is, contending teams don't have boneheads as their number 2 guy.

My point exactly. As long as Tyreke is that guy, Auerbach couldn't coach this team into contention.

[N.O.Bronco]

I'm not an usher at the arena, I promise you, but are your seats next to, or directly behind the bench? Just curious.

I fault Monty for not being able to coach Tyreke. There is obviously a Tyreke/Monty problem in terms of being on the same bball wavelength. Tyreke is not an extension of the coach on the floor. But the solution is either you move Tyreke or you replace Monty, and I'm not convinced Coach K or Phil Jackson would be able to minimize the negative of Tyreke's game and increase his abilities/willingness to execute within the offense.

How would you have addressed the issues last night in the 4th? You're blaming Monty for sitting idly by, but I don't understand specifically what you would have had him do? From my perspective, and my seats may not be as good as yours if you're sitting next to or behind the bench, Monty repeatedly told players what needed to be done and the players didn't or couldn't do it.

Well I have said in several posts now what was pretty obvious to me in hindsight and a lot that was obvious in game. Evans was botching possessions and killing offensive flow. We were getting torched in the paint and on the offensive glass.

To me you have a few options but at least one of those issues has to be addressed in some capacity. You can try and slow the bleeding on defense to hold onto the lead by putting in another rebounder like Cunningham or maybe even Asik at certain points and put your defensive guard unit in to see if that can slow things down. Sacrificing Ryno or Gordon to just situational use if need be. Or what I wanted was to call a timeout much sooner then 3:30 since it was clear as day problems were happening and then you draw up a play to get the ball moving again and get someone like Ryno an open shot. Heck even the timeout Monty did call was a frustration one that forced us to inbound in the back court thus limiting what we could draw up.

The moment Jrue came back in the ball should of went into his hands and he should of been given the reigns of facilitation. I probably would of sat Evans too. He wasn't defending, scoring or getting boards so he became a albatross IMO.

My problem isn't that Monty did it wrong, it is he basically did nothing til it was to late and then started making mistakes to start OT.

[N.O.Bronco]

My point exactly. As long as Tyreke is that guy, Auerbach couldn't coach this team into contention.

Evans needs to be used in an up tempo, player movement heavy offense if he is going to start IMO. Having him walk the ball up, taking precious time off the clock and then allowing the defense to set and then asking him to create the offense on a shortened clock against a set D puts him in a suboptimal position IMO.

[NMThreeMVP]

Well I have said in several posts now what was pretty obvious to me in hindsight and a lot that was obvious in game. Evans was botching possessions and killing offensive flow. We were getting torched in the paint and on the offensive glass.

To me you have a few options but at least one of those issues has to be addressed in some capacity. You can try and slow the bleeding on defense to hold onto the lead by putting in another rebounder like Cunningham or maybe even Asik at certain points and put your defensive guard unit in to see if that can slow things down. Sacrificing Ryno or Gordon to just situational use if need be. Or what I wanted was to call a timeout much sooner then 3:30 since it was clear as day problems were happening and then you draw up a play to get the ball moving again and get someone like Ryno an open shot. Heck even the timeout Monty did call was a frustration one that forced us to inbound in the back court thus limiting what we could draw up.

The moment Jrue came back in the ball should of went into his hands and he should of been given the reigns of facilitation. I probably would of sat Evans too. He wasn't defending, scoring or getting boards so he became a albatross IMO.

My problem isn't that Monty did it wrong, it is he basically did nothing til it was to late and then started making mistakes to start OT.

I don't dismiss this. But I do think it's kind of hindsight and retrospective.

The most likely thing he "coulda woulda shoulda" done is bringing Cunningham or Asik in, and if he does that and sits Anderson, he's probably going to get killed for sitting the hot guy. He gets paid to make the tough decisions, but I'm not sure in the moment, with a lead, anyone is thinking "bring in Asik and Cunningham". If you were thinking that at the 6 minute mark, props to you.

I guess what gnaws me, is that this team lost because they got out hustled and rebounded in the 4th quarter. I think that's indicative of being a young team that hasn't learned how to close. But instead, I see the vast majority of the blame being thrown at the coach. In my years playing ball, I can't conceive of a time when our coach was at fault because we got out rebounded and didn't execute. I think players know who should be held accountable for a 4th quarter like that, and it's the guys on the court. But fans always want to blame the coach.

It would be great it we had a local media that invested in the Pelicans coverage enough to ask Monty really good questions about was drawn up and what wasn't, and whether he considered certain substitutions and/or benching certain players.

[NMThreeMVP]

Evans needs to be used in an up tempo, player movement heavy offense if he is going to start IMO. Having him walk the ball up, taking precious time off the clock and then allowing the defense to set and then asking him to create the offense on a shortened clock against a set D puts him in a suboptimal position IMO.

I agree, but this is not a midseason adjustment you can easily make. How they approach this offseason from a personnel and scheme perspective will be interesting. If we keep status quo personnel wise, do they adjust the offense more towards Tyreke's style, or keep an offensive scheme more suited for Jrue Holiday?

[UptownFuz504]

You admit in your own post that Monty lacks the gravitas of a Carlisle or a Pop. Or a Thibs. Know who's available to coach the Pellies in 2 weeks? Um ahh... THIBS. The 3rd, 4th, or 5th best basketball coach on the entire planet that hasn't won anything in the East but will miraculously be the Pels savior in the West..

FIFY

[UptownFuz504]

This was a test. And you failed.

i said to myself, I bet WisconsinHornet would pull this one line out and comment on it. I didn't say at all that Monty lacks the gravitas of "a Carlisle or a Pop." He specifically lacks the gravitas of CARLISLE and POP. Two individuals. That have won championships and have the 120% backing of ownership. The deification of Thibs has to stop. What has he won? How many eastern conf finals has played in? How many has he won? He's in the f'kn Easter Conference, for christ's sake!

Thibs would have run this brittle team into the ground. And Thibs (or any other NBA coach for that matter), if placed on the hotseat by ownership, wouldn't have had any better success getting a back court with the IQ of Tyreke Evans and Eric Gordon to be the NBA version of the Hart Foundation (The Excellence of Execution)!

Thibs. Get out of here.

Thibs got outcoached by the video guy for the Miami Heat (Eric Spoelstra) and Randy Wittman.

I totally agree

[UptownFuz504]

It's the E A S T E R N ...C O N F E R E N C E.

You know who else gets their team in the playoffs in that conference? Jason Kidd, Lionel Hollins, Randy Whitmann, Dwayne Casey. It's not exactly a murderers row over the last few years like the west. My hyperbolic response to Thibs is in direct proportion to the hyperbole that surrounds him as supposedly one of the league's top 5 coaches.

And his offenses will frequently look downright brutal.

I in no way meant to imply that Monty does not have the authority to bench players. I'm sure he does. Monty also has the mandate to win games and make the playoffs THIS season. He started the season with no legitimate small forward and no backup PG, making minutes for Tyreke a necessity. When we finally get QPon and Cole, we don't have Jrue. Again, making minutes for Tyreke a necessity.

Coaches that don't have a mandate placed on them, like Brad Stevens, or coaches that have depth, have the ability to bench players. When you're fighting for your job and the 8th seed, you're backed into a corner if you're trying to send a message to player that may cost you a game or two, that you HAVE TO win.

Exactly

[UptownFuz504]

You mean the basketball coach who's NEVER won a championship at ANY level in his entire life? In fact, he's never even made it to the NBA Finals in the six seasons he's been the head coach in Chicago? That's the coach you're calling one of the top five basketball coaches on the entire planet? You lose any credibility at all with that statement.

People said that I was crazy for saying this same thing

[RhythmNathan]

Here's what I'm wondering and I maybe don't have the basketball IQ to know the answer. If you're Monty and you're putting a lineup on the floor not to play defense but to foul why would you stick Pondexter on Curry and Jrue on Thompson? That's basically assuming you may not be able to catch them and might have to defend the 3. Isn't there such a thing as your fouling matchup lineup? Why would we think Quincy would be able to grab Currys jersey before Jrue. He's quick for a SF but not as quick as Holiday off injury or not.

[Tip-Off]

If Pop tells his team to foul there, his team fouls there.

If Carlisle tells his team to foul there, his team fouls there.

If Monty tells his team to foul there, they will fail to do so and bumble their way to the best 3 pt shooter in the West getting TWO chances and being fouled on the 2nd.

Pop also has three guys that have been playing together for over 700 games, have more total wins and have more playoff wins than any other trio in NBA history. I doubt our whole roster has a combined 700 games played.

[akshun]

http://www.nola.com/pelicans/index.s...licans_article

[akshun]

Evans needs to be used in an up tempo, player movement heavy offense if he is going to start IMO. Having him walk the ball up, taking precious time off the clock and then allowing the defense to set and then asking him to create the offense on a shortened clock against a set D puts him in a suboptimal position IMO.

Precisely. This is what many of us have been saying relative to Tyreke. He is a hell of a basketball player. He is NOT a point guard.

I applaud him for what he was able to do having been asked to perform in that capacity. There is some inherent risk to a player's reputation when said player agrees to play out of position. He accepted that challenge and didn't complain one bit. Many seem oblivious to that fact pattern.

[Heavy]

This was a test. And you failed.

i said to myself, I bet WisconsinHornet would pull this one line out and comment on it. I didn't say at all that Monty lacks the gravitas of "a Carlisle or a Pop." He specifically lacks the gravitas of CARLISLE and POP. Two individuals. That have won championships and have the 120% backing of ownership. The deification of Thibs has to stop. What has he won? How many eastern conf finals has played in? How many has he won? He's in the f'kn Easter Conference, for christ's sake!

Thibs would have run this brittle team into the ground. And Thibs (or any other NBA coach for that matter), if placed on the hotseat by ownership, wouldn't have had any better success getting a back court with the IQ of Tyreke Evans and Eric Gordon to be the NBA version of the Hart Foundation (The Excellence of Execution)!

Thibs. Get out of here.

Thibs got outcoached by the video guy for the Miami Heat (Eric Spoelstra) and Randy Wittman.

You'll have to pardon the slow response to this... Most of our fans are still googling 'deification'.