.
Pelicans Report
 
Page 7 of 7 FirstFirst ... 3 4 5 6 7
Results 151 to 165 of 165

Thread: Pels vs Mavs Gameday Thread

  1. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by RaisingTheBar View Post
    But they are not talking about a bench player. They are talking about a guy who has averaged over 33 minutes per game for his career. So to quote per36 stats on a player like that isn't unreasonable or "not reality".

    It's all about how per36 is being used. If the argument was talking a guy who gets 10mpg and projecting per36 then yeah that's where most of us start to disagree or trash per36.
    Very much agreed. I was commenting on the stat in a vacuum. I should have made that more clear.

    The thing about Guru's(?) projection for Tyreke is that he likely won't get the opportunity for the assists and points he was getting at the end of the season. With a healthy lineup, he won't see as high of a usage. If he is, something bad happened to AD.

    I think (and certainly hope) that he can keep up the rebounding.

  2. #152
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! Spaniard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Baton Rouge
    Posts
    2,699
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    It's very deceptive. The more minutes a player gets, the more their per36 drops. Especially when looking at bench players.
    That's just factually incorrect. It only goes down if you continue to play below your average. And it goes up if you play better. It's no different than any per game stat, but more representative because it levelizes minutes.

  3. #153
    The Voice of Reason Contributor RaisingTheBar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    13,058
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    Very much agreed. I was commenting on the stat in a vacuum. I should have made that more clear.

    The thing about Guru's(?) projection for Tyreke is that he likely won't get the opportunity for the assists and points he was getting at the end of the season. With a healthy lineup, he won't see as high of a usage. If he is, something bad happened to AD.

    I think (and certainly hope) that he can keep up the rebounding.
    Yeah I don't think I agree with that projection.

    I like to use per36 more so for comparisons of 2 similar players. or at least like players in the same stratosphere. So like Westbrook vs Paul if someone wanted to debate that sure throw those per36 at me or Like Evans who for his career is has played in 3 minutes less than 36. But don't show me per36 stats comparing Chris Paul to Austin Rivers lol

  4. #154
    I don't think people realize just how hard it is to average those types of numbers. For example Guru put Tyreke's averages at 18-8-6 in another thread. LBJ has only averaged 8 Rebs and 6 assists ONCE in his entire career and that season he played more minutes per game than Tyreke ever has.

    Tyreke had his highest TRB and Assist % ever last year. And he still was only on track for 6reb, 6ast. Which btw is still an amazing feat. Durant has never once averaged 6reb,6ast. Not per game or per 36.

    Ignoring all of the arguing about per36. If I had to lay down a line on where Tyreke's numbers will be Id say 16-5-6. And I'd be darn happy with that. Remember, those were career numbers for Tyreke and that was with the highest usage of his career. The odds he increases his rebounding by an extra 1 or 2 Rebs a game are beyond small.

    More than likely with everyone healthy his rebounding and scoring numbers take a dip. I think his assists stay the same if they keep running the offense through him but I don't see his usage as high so his scoring goes down and with Asik I think his rebounding drops.

  5. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaniard View Post
    That's just factually incorrect. It only goes down if you continue to play below your average. And it goes up if you play better. It's no different than any per game stat, but more representative because it levelizes minutes.
    Nope, sorry, but this is wrong. A typical bench player forced into a starting role is going to see his per36 numbers take a do. Same with all his efficiency numbers.

    The style of play is different, the responsibilities are different, etc. The player could play to the same level he always has and still see drops in his rate and efficiency stats.

    Like RtB said, it's useful when comparing players who get similar minutes. It is awful at projecting the stats of a 10 minute player out to a starters minutes.

  6. #156
    All-Star
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    378
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    Nope, sorry, but this is wrong. A typical bench player forced into a starting role is going to see his per36 numbers take a do. Same with all his efficiency numbers.

    The style of play is different, the responsibilities are different, etc. The player could play to the same level he always has and still see drops in his rate and efficiency stats.

    Like RtB said, it's useful when comparing players who get similar minutes. It is awful at projecting the stats of a 10 minute player out to a starters minutes.
    It isn't "wrong". It may be incorrect in practicality or in most cases but it is not factually incorrect.

  7. #157
    Literally all of James Harden's Per36 numbers skyrocketed after going from OKC's bench to Houston's starting lineup. And he was now playing against better players.

    There are numerous other examples too, so to declare that Per 36 will always drop when minutes go up - THAT is factually incorrect
    @mcnamara247

  8. #158
    Did Witheys game last night do him any favors in getting playing time early in the season?
    If you Jimmer it, they will come.

  9. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by UNO Gracias View Post
    Did Witheys game last night do him any favors in getting playing time early in the season?
    It might make him active, as opposed to inactive. But he aint getting minutes. Thankfully.

  10. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    It might make him active, as opposed to inactive. But he aint getting minutes. Thankfully.
    Any prediction on the inactives for the season opener?

  11. #161
    I think it comes down to:

    Miller, Withey, Young, and Smith

    If I had to guess, I would say Smith and Young for now

  12. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    Literally all of James Harden's Per36 numbers skyrocketed after going from OKC's bench to Houston's starting lineup. And he was now playing against better players.

    There are numerous other examples too, so to declare that Per 36 will always drop when minutes go up - THAT is factually incorrect
    There are exceptions, which is why I used the phrase "typical bench player".

  13. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara View Post
    I think it comes down to:

    Miller, Withey, Young, and Smith

    If I had to guess, I would say Smith and Young for now

    This makes perfect sense given the rest of our rouster. We need Miller and Withey more if someone goes down in a game. We have enough ball handlers or else I would trade Miller for Smith somewhere throughout the season just to see what he gives us in a normal game.

  14. #164
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! Spaniard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Baton Rouge
    Posts
    2,699
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    There are exceptions, which is why I used the phrase "typical bench player".
    I don't want to hijack the whole thread on a conversation we have had plenty of times on here. But as a mathematics major, it's just hard for me to let something like this go. There is a WIDE gap in your thinking between what the stat is, and what you think it shows. Per 36 is a stat, a number, an average, an actual mathematical formula. Nothing more, nothing less. It's production on the court put into a formula.

    It's actually you that looks at the stat and you that makes assumptions, projections, etc. Per 36 is literally a player's per minute average production multiplied out to 36 minutes to levelize. As was said, if you play above your average, it goes up, below your average, it goes down. Playing more or less minutes has no impact if you play exactly the same. Like every single stat on the planet, if you play against better competition and in turn play worse, the statistic will drop. That's just a given.

    A bench player with a good per36 simply shows that that bench player is giving great production while on the court. A starting player with a good per36 is simply showing that they are giving great production while on the court. Anything you try to do to take that further and assume if a player starts, or plays more minutes or different teams, or whatever....that is your own doing and has nothing to do with the stat.

  15. #165
    I agree with this.

    I feel like if the stat was - Per 1 minute, people might be more open to it.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •