I think you take Monroe. He's healthy. Shooters will shoot you into games and shoot you out of games. Monroe brings consistency and a better interior presence than what we've had. We still have a lot of shooters from the outside.
 |
| . |
|
I think you take Monroe. He's healthy. Shooters will shoot you into games and shoot you out of games. Monroe brings consistency and a better interior presence than what we've had. We still have a lot of shooters from the outside.
Ways to think about this....
#1- If EG plans on accepting the PO in 15, what difference does it make? Any rational player understands the market.(I read all the "he's not rational" posts in the other thread, and I agree, but still). The FA list in 15 is rounding out to be a stunner. Why not wait to see what EG can actually bring to the table. This was his best year since he's been here if I read correctly (GP wise). Maybe this season he will be better, and up his trade value more. If he does great...If not then we try to get rid of him...Plain and simple.
#2- If I read the OP correctly, RA wasn't included in the deal...How did he get mentioned in it and why would he be brought into the discussion anyway?
#3- On the Anderson/Monroe topic..2 different types of player....Like Nike and Reebok...They're both shoe types, but personal perception is key. Monroe makes his money inside, RA makes his money outside. All depends on what gear you decide to wear with it. SA won a championship with Admiral/TD at a young age. Parker n Gino were hits also, but still not the great players they are now.
Imagine Jrue/Reke/Morrow/AD/Monroe....2 guys who can drive/dish/make layups/ hit jumpers. A 3 pt shooter..2 guys who love rebounding and can hit shots from inside 10 feet. Couple that with the interior defense that would impose, plus the backcourt defense from jrue and reke, that's a pretty good squad....with a bench that features B-Rob/Rivers/Babbit/Smith/Withey or Steamer..The 2nd unit doesn't sound like a world beater, but it might keep you in games.
Thats just off the top of the head. Like I said, RA was never mentioned, so why bring him into the convo?
All said, I'd trade EG for GM every day and 2x on Sunday, plus a leap year Feb 29th.
I think this is a really good post so I won't say too much I'll just answer number 2.Originally Posted by NOSportsFan
The assumption is that the Pistons would never just trade Monroe for Gordon straight up therefore they would require someone on this team to make the trade worth while. Most people just assumed that player would be Anderson.
That's why raw numbers without context are very confusing. First, Ryno played 22 games, so his numbers are for only 55 possessions, so small sample, I don't have access to synergy so may be you can prove me that's more a trend than an exception for Ryno. Then who was defending both players ? I don't remember Anderson drawing the best post-defender on regular basis while this was the case for Monroe. And last, how many double teams did they draw ? I'm pretty sure that Monroe was more double-teamed than Anderson in the post with the lack of spacing in the Pistons offense.
Then in another post you said that the possibility of having a decent SF would prevent opposing coach top put an SF on Anderson, that's quite naive, since almost every single team in the NBA today can play small ball.
I like the ability of Anderson to stretch the floor, but since Davis is already a reliable option as a stretch 4, their skills seems a bit redundant to me. One thing that I think is overlooked in the NBA nowadays is the ability to open the floor with good screens and I think that a mobile and inteligent player like Monroe is perfect for this.
I really like the Divac's comparison but I could see also a bit of Marc Gasol in him and that's the type of player that could be a great sidekick to AD regardless of how he evolves.
If Greg Monroe was Marc Gasol this wouldn't even be a question.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
How about this:
Gordon AND Ryno for Monroe (4 yrs/50 mil) and Jonas Jerebko
That I could live with. You get Goron off the books, meaning you can go into the summer of '15 with 20 mil in cap room to go get any SF you want (Butler, Leonard, Parsons, Green, Gay, and more all FA's)
Now, THAT I would sign up for.
@mcnamara247
I think (hope) he was talking about his skills as a passer on offense. There is no similarities on the defensive end between those two, but I can see the comparison as high post and low post passers.
Yep, that's what I meant by "a bit of Marc Gasol". But regarding Monroe's defense, it's funny that when you look at the defensive ratings of our core (according to basketball reference) he would be an upgrade :
Anthony Davis carreer average DRtg 104
Jrue Holiday 106
Jason Smith 107
Ryan Anderson 108
Tyreke Evans 110
Eric Gordon 113
Greg Monroe 106
I think Opp %FG at rim is also an interesting stat for a center and again he's decent :
Roy Hibbert 41.4%
Andrew Bogut 45%
Joakim Noah 46.8%
Dwight Howard 47.8%
Anthony Davis 48.9%
Marc Gasol 50.8%
DeMarcus Cousins 51.1%
Monroe 51.2%
Tyson Chandler 51.5%
Ryan Anderson 53.9%
Zach Randolph 53.9%
Pau Gasol 54.6%
Pekovic 55.2%
Vucevic 56.4%
Of course this number are impacted by the coaching style of each team but I didn't expect him to perform as well as Holiday on the DRtg, so may be he won't be a real liability on this side of the court.
DRtg is nigh useless to use when comparing individual players on different teams. It is so highly dependent on teammates that it is not worthwhile in a 1:1 comparison between players.
Yeah, I am a stats guy and I have never found defensive stats that I like. When I want to evaluate a guy, I dont even look at stats, I just watch him on Synergy.
A bit of a copout, I know, but that is how I do it.
Supposedly, some teams have their own proprietary defensive stats using data from the Synergy cameras and use that to help out with evaluating a player's defensive impact. For the public, we just get a ton of different things (like OppFG% from different distances). We then have to piece all of these disparate defensive stats together in order to develop an understanding of how a player affects defense.
And even THAT is highly flawed because there is no publicly available stat to measure missed or poorly played rotations and other, similar things that result in a defender taking himself (or allowing himself to be taken) out of a play.
Offense is so much easier to analyze.
And that makes sense because teams ask their players to do different things. Just because player A plays the 5 for the bucks and player b plays the 5 for us; doesn't mean they have the same responsibilities.
"I don't know if people know — I dislocated my pinkie finger. And [Tyreke] told me, 'You wanna go home or you wanna be here?' I want to be here. And he said, 'All right, then go tape it up and let's play. Let's go. We not stoppin' at no stores. Straight gas. That's what we do, just keep going.'"
http://thebasketbawlblog.com/
Yeah, they have a system that shows them where a player SHOULD be on every play at every second and where they actually are/were.
Now THAT would be useful.
Oh yeah! I completely forgot about that 'ghost' that Toronto has: http://grantland.com/features/the-to...al-revolution/
Not a cop out at all. I hate using defensive ratings. Either the defensive ratings are always inaccurate or I'm a terrible judge of defense, but I almost never agree with them.
Can you sign and trade a player (Monroe) and add a player to that?
I thought that wasn't allowed
But yes that would be a trade I'd be all over. Even just for the purposes of dumping Gordon and if Monroe would take a hometown discount that would be great.
Completely agree here. But for what it's worth the pistons and the pelicans are pretty close in terms of point allowed per possession this year, so the deviation might be less significant between players and the ranking is still approximately the same.
But in my opinion even offensive stats aren't flawless, there's still a lack of information to draw the whole reality. For example, if a player use his low-post game only when the shot clock expires or when he plays alongside certain player, there would be some deviation when you want to compare two players on certain points.
Last edited by Blattman; 05-22-2014 at 02:28 PM.
And whoever is currently on the roster may influence who he becomes, based on what he is asked to do or what we need from him.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote