Conference Finals, Conference Finals, Conference Semifinals, 1st Round.Originally Posted by RaisingTheBar
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Conference Finals, Conference Finals, Conference Semifinals, 1st Round.
So just because Mike D runs a fast paced offense and get's his players to play hard it's gimmicky? C'mon you're reaching too much just for an argument.
This works both ways fella. They are the exact same just one is on offense and one on defense.
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So offense doesn't win championships, thanks.
One thing i don't like in a coach is a complete lack of adaptability, especially when it comes to players' styles and attributes. Which is one thing i don't like about monty, he's so stubborn into his way of thought he rarely sees beyond his nose. But at times he actually does, he changes his mind and gets better at something. D'antoni has never ever changed his philosophy, never adapted it to the players, trying to put every single time a square peg into a round hole. Sorry but i'd rather almost anyone else, d'antoni's time has come and gone. If i have to choose over him and monty, hell, keep monty.
I don't know about you guys but I might boycott next year's season if Monty comes back.
This isn't fair. Of course you need to be at least decent on one side of the ball or the other to win it all. But how hard would it be to bring in a defensives assistant to come up with a quality scheme.
I agree mostly with this, but I think d'antoni's overall philsophy dictates against this. So even if you had Thibs as a defensive assistant, if D'Antoni's overall philosphy is to take early shots, get out and run (not crash boards on D), Crashing boards too heavily on O (so defenders can't get back and set-up) etc it's always going to have a negative impact on defense. You look at guys like thibs (since i brought him up earlier) and they play a much more traditional style of offense. We also may need to be objective and look at D'Anoni's offensive as very innovative for it's time, but the NBA has caught up to it some. at that time Phx was one of the only teams doing the stretch 4 and shooting 3's like they're going out of style. Teams didn't have the type of player to adjust t that defensively; now everyone runs a version of it so the innovation level, or shock value of the system won't produce the skew you want like it was before (4 or 5 years at #1 overall offensive effiency).
"I don't know if people know — I dislocated my pinkie finger. And [Tyreke] told me, 'You wanna go home or you wanna be here?' I want to be here. And he said, 'All right, then go tape it up and let's play. Let's go. We not stoppin' at no stores. Straight gas. That's what we do, just keep going.'"
http://thebasketbawlblog.com/
Hi, I'm Monty Williams. I talk about defense, defense, defense every time a microphone gets put in my face. I don't even worry about the offense. I'm not happy we're 25th in defensive efficiency. All we ever do is talk about defense. I'm not sure what else I can do. These guys just don't get it.
Does Phil Jackson go away from his Triangle Offense to adjust to his players?
Last edited by ItIsRynosTime; 05-01-2014 at 10:38 AM.
Just wanted to point out - there is a huge misconception that the Suns had terrible defensive teams. Simply not true. Here were their defensive ratings in those years:
17th
16th
13th
16th
Oh, and the year before Mike D got there, they were 24th (moved up to 17) and the year after he left, they plummeted to 26th
Okay, we can carry on with hyperbole now.
@mcnamara247
Monty positively adapted to his players as the year went on. True as that may be, you'll still find very few Monty apologists on this forum.
We're stuck with Monty for next season; neither he nor D'antoni will ever bring this team close to a championship
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I don't even like Monty or really want him around, I just don't think D'Antoni is the answer. Now if you said hey maybe Vogel or Brooks gets fired and you are interested I'm all ears.
They were elite on offense and NBA average on defense. What am I missing?
So, Monty running a terrible system with few reliable offensive weapons due to injuries had a more efficient offense than D'Antoni running his uber offense (while also having similar injury issues).
Thanks for looking that up!
Not that I think Monty is a great coach or anything, but Brooks would draw all the same complaints. And Indiana had a worse offense than the Pelicans this year so, yeah.
That matches up nicely with what I was saying. So if you don't want to listen to me, listen to Michael who's more of an expert.
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I think he is currently in a lose-lose situation. He has an athlete for a PG who won't stop shooting, and the 2nd best player in the world who doesn't have the balls to tell him to stop.
But....his post only proves that a stellar offense and a middle of the pack defense is not enough to get it done.That matches up nicely with what I was saying. So if you don't want to listen to me. Listen to Michael who's more of an expert.
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All that proves is that Mike D couldn't win a title with the best offense and an NBA average defense. That's not reassuring.That matches up nicely with what I was saying. So if you don't want to listen to me. Listen to Michael who's more of an expert.
He also starts Perkins (their own Stiemsma) and plays Caron Butler over Jeremy Lamb. Also, extensive minutes to the veteran Fisher. OKC also runs awful offensive sets and just hope that Durant or Westbrook bail them out.
e: So, lots of similarities.
If I had a dollar for every fallacy that was committed on this forum I would drop out of college and never be employed another day in my life. I might explain this one later tonight if Michael doesn't explain it first.
You're welcome!
Last edited by ItIsRynosTime; 05-01-2014 at 11:20 AM.
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If by starts you mean is on the floor when the ball is tipped sure. Gets less than 20mpg. Butler a better 3pt than Lamb but IMO he doesn't take mins away, Lamb is a 2, Butler 3. Everyone has their opinions on what a coach should do. But don't forget where Brooks brought that team from where they used to be. Having the 2nd best player helps, but very soon we'll have a top 5 player of our own here.
So few coaches "get it done"
Really, how many coaches won a title in the last 35 years? Like 8-10 (if that)
Were all the other coaches terrible? This is my thing (an I am not a Monty fan) - OKC fans hate their coach, Pacers might fire Vogel and Warriors might fire Jackson. Last year, Lionel Hollins and George Karl got canned despite great seasons.
I just find it funny that only 6-8 fan bases like their coach. The other 22 want an upgrade, and where does this upgrade come from? Either unproven guys or guys who were "terrible" according to their prior teams' fanbases. We all pine for the Van Gundy's or Karl. Their fan bases called them overrated and wanted them gone too.
Go ahead and Fire Monty. Sooner or later, everyone will be screaming how the next guy is terrible too in all likelihood.
Stiemsma also got less than 20mpg. Rivers is more of a 2 than a 1, but people here are still mad when Roberts gets time at point over him. We also haven't given Monty the same time and opportunity Brooks has had to improve the team to their current level.
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This is my point. Saying that if a coach hasn't won a title he's trash is illogical. Doc Rivers was not looked upon as a good coach in Orlando now he's considered one of the better coaches in the league.
Same with Vogel. Wasnt he top 5 in that ESPN poll of top coaches just a few months ago? Now he is all of a sudden terrible and doesnt deserve a job?
Oh how fickle people can be.
My point wasn't that D'antoni is trash.
My point is that top defenses have trumped top offenses. The last few teams that have made it to recent WCF/ECFs were sound offensively but much more so defensively.
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