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Thread: The Historically Great Hornets

  1. #1
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    The Hornets: The Greatest EVER?
    Bill Plaschke
    L.A. Times


    As the season winds down, we have seen what seems to be a race for all other teams to play for second place. In the NBA when we talk about series, usually the better team comes out ahead. With this knowledge, no one on the right side of dementia can possibly think any other team will win the 2005 NBA Championship besides the Hornets. I was recently having a beer with a few friends when this topic came up. It was quickly dismissed, but once we dug deeper there was a lot to it. It is my opinion that this Hornets team is the most dominant NBA team to ever play basketball. Please buckle your seat belts as i explain how I came to this conclusion by looking at the stats.

    Shooting:

    Shots per game : 89.4
    Rank: 2
    oShots per game: 84.5
    Rank: 16
    Summary: It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the Hornets play at a fast pace. We will use this number below in FG% to make our point.

    FG%: 47.9
    Rank 1
    Summary: Hornets will shoot more than 5 shot more than you a game AND make a higher percentage than you. You're not winning.

    3 Pointers Per game Attempted: 16.9
    Rank: 2
    o3 AttemptedPointers Per Game Attempted : 10.7
    3 Point %: .405
    Rank: 2
    o3 Point %: .334
    Summary. The hornets make on average 3.2 3 pointers more per game than their opponents. Now, having a Center who can shoot the 3, along with 6 players all shooting over 40% from 3 will do this to you. Point? Don't play the 3 point game versus the Hornets, you'll lose, and by a lot.

    Tunrovers

    Turnovers Per Game: 11.3
    Rank: 1
    oTunrovers Per game: 13.3
    Rank: 20
    Summary: Wow the hornets aren't that good at SOMETHING. I'm kidding. Let's look at the FACTS. What really matters is Turnover margin here. Let's face it, if you're forcing your opponent into a ton of turnovers but just giving the ball away left and right, it doesn't really matter does it. Hornets are top 3 in Turnover Margin. Starting to feel like your team has no shot? Good because it'll only go South from here.

    Top 5 Turnover Margin:

    Warriors 3
    Wizards 2.2
    Hornets 2
    Bucks 1.9
    Trail Blazers 1.6

    Points:
    PPG: 114.6
    Rank: 1 (By 10 PPG)
    oPPG: 97.9
    Margin:
    Summary: The hornets historically better than any other team in the real NBA EVER, by A LOT.
    Regular Season - margin of victory
    Let's take a look at the ALL TIME largest margin for victory throughout a season:

    '05 Hornets- 16.7
    '72 Lakers - 15.9
    '96 Bulls - 15.0
    ’87 Lakers --14
    ’64 Celtics – 13.3
    '67 Sixers - 13.2
    '86 Celtics - 13.0

    Top 5 in Sim league Points Margin (If you weren't ready to hand the Hornets the title, you will be after this):
    Hornets 16.7
    Bucks 7.2
    76ers 5.8
    Knicks 5.4
    Celtics 5.3
    I'd also like to file a missing person's report to any team out West in the category.

    Rebounds
    Rebounds Per Game: 54.2
    Rank: 1
    oRebounds Per game:47.8
    Rank 4
    Summary: This is obvious. The Hornets are an elite rebounding team. Now some would say, the Hornets have a faster pace than most so there's more rebounds to be had. Well, to that I answer, the Hornets don't really miss shots. I'm kidding. This is why I looked at rebounding margin, to account for pace. They have the Highest margin in the entire league. So not are you going to take less shots, and make those shots on a lesser rate. The Hornets won't allow you to get offensive rebounds.
    Top 5 rebounding Margin:
    Hornets 6.4
    Celtics 5.5
    76ers 5.3
    Nets 4.5
    Knicks 3.8

    Passing:
    Assist per game: 27.6
    Rank: 1
    oAssist per game : 22.2
    Rank 4
    Summary: Not only are the Hornets the best passing team in the league, they do it with the fewest turnovers in the league, and you know what? they're one of the best at stopping you from passing. Anyone want to guess who has the best margin? Hornets, again by a lot.

    Top 5 Assist Margin:
    Hornets 5.4
    Lakers 3.8
    Wizards 3.5
    Celtics 3.1
    Grizzlies 2.8



    What does that mean? The team you root for has no shot at beating the Hornets in a 7 game series. In summary, the Hornets beat every team in almost every phase of the game. Their defense really only has to be average to destroy teams because their offense is just other-worldly great. Not only do they take a ton of shots, but they make more shots than teams who take their time to find the best shots. Not only that, but they rebound better than anyone else in the league (some due to pace) but don't allow you to get second shots. They also don't turn the ball over at all and give you opportunities. Anyone who think they're going to beat them is just fooling themselves. They're 1 loss behind the greatest team that's ever played '96 Bulls. NBA you're on notice, you're all just playing for second place.
    Last edited by BallSoHard; 03-16-2013 at 01:01 PM.

  2. #2
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!!    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    Good analysis. Guess we're all just playing for last pla...I mean...second place.



  3. #3
    Jimeert Freedet 4 Prez    Contributor   
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    I saw my team's name up there a couple times! Woohoo!

    But seriously, I think the first time I beat him was a fluke... last game against him BOTH Marc Jackson AND Rasheed Wallace fouled out at 19mpg. No bueno when my #1 and #3 options down low foul out against the best rebounding team in the league.
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  4. #4
    All World Pelicans78's Avatar
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    A team needs enough firepower just to keep up. Not from the starting lineup but from the bench as well. A strong defensive but average offense won't have have a chance. Also, a team needs to shoot the 3's really well which will help keep the game closer.

    Emeka Okafor - Joe Smith - Carmelo Anthony - Manu Ginobili - Jason Williams

    Al Jefferson - James Posey - Aaron McKie - Shaun Livingston

  5. #5
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    I may write a piece on what i think it takes to beat them once the playoffs Start. I haven't done any numbers on that so hard to say right now. I think a huge piece is getting to the free throw stripe.

  6. #6
    No White Flags Soundwave's Avatar
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    You have to be able to block shots. I think the Hornets can be slowed down and forced to play in the half court. You will need a beast of a Center to get it done. The Nuggets have swept them this year.
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  7. #7
    Fire Monty!! Contributor AD23forMVP's Avatar
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  8. #8
    All World Pelicans78's Avatar
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    The Hornets are a great half court. They slice n dice in the half court. Good ball handlers, great shooters, really good defenders.

  9. #9
    I guess I'm dreaming here since you cant look up previous years stats. But I'd love to see analysis of what's changed the first few years they werent very good last year they were great now they are unstoppable.

    Well you can't look at the stats as a team ranking but I guess you could come up with something by looking at individual stats for those years...how bored are ya balls?
    Last edited by Conroy; 03-16-2013 at 03:55 PM.
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  10. #10
    Fire Monty!! Contributor AD23forMVP's Avatar
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    I think BSH said it well.

    My starting 5. Barkley, Peterson, Turkoglu, Garnett, and Okur. Which one of those guys aren't a threat to go for 20 on any night? I'd even say 3 of those guys are 20+ ppg scorers on other teams. And then what do I surround my franchise with? SHOOTERS. Everyone on my team can shoot, even my bigs.

  11. #11
    All World Pelicans78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AD23forMVP View Post
    I think BSH said it well.

    My starting 5. Barkley, Peterson, Turkoglu, Garnett, and Okur. Which one of those guys aren't a threat to go for 20 on any night? I'd even say 3 of those guys are 20+ ppg scorers on other teams. And then what do I surround my franchise with? SHOOTERS. Everyone on my team can shoot, even my bigs.
    It seemed like you're team made a big jump when you changed your focus to outside (after starting Okur) and went from a faster pace to a slower normal pace. How much did your team improve with those changes?

  12. #12
    Fire Monty!! Contributor AD23forMVP's Avatar
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    A lot, I was hovering around .500 before I changed. Ever since then my win percentage is probably out of this world.

  13. #13
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicans78 View Post
    It seemed like you're team made a big jump when you changed your focus to outside (after starting Okur) and went from a faster pace to a slower normal pace. How much did your team improve with those changes?
    He shoots the second most shot in the game. His pace is probably fast I'd guess .

  14. #14
    All World Pelicans78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    He shoots the second most shot in the game. His pace is probably fast I'd guess .
    I don't think it is. I remember it was slow last year and normal this year. I think he gets alot of shots because of rebounding.

  15. #15
    Fire Monty!! Contributor AD23forMVP's Avatar
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    I'm a mix of normal and fast pace this year. I was slow last season though.

  16. #16
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    I think being able to play with the Hornets comes down to a few things:
    -Making him as inefficient as he can be. That means having defenders in all 5 spots.
    -Win the Turnover battle. you lose this, you're toast. They're not going to do you any favors and turn it over. They shoot better than anyone in the league. More Turnovers= More Shots. More shots at the highest shooting %= More points. More points= Loss. Although last sim it seems like he moved from a Fast to a Normal pace which is working well. Out of their 11 losses... 9 came when they lost the TO battle 1 when they tied the turnover battle. 1 loss came when they won the turnover battle.
    -Have to have an insider scorer.

  17. #17
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    I think being able to play with the Hornets comes down to a few things:
    -Making him as inefficient as he can be. That means having defenders in all 5 spots.
    -Win the Turnover battle. you lose this, you're toast. They're not going to do you any favors and turn it over. They shoot better than anyone in the league. More Turnovers= More Shots. More shots at the highest shooting %= More points. More points= Loss. Although last sim it seems like he moved from a Fast to a Normal pace which is working well. Out of their 11 losses... 9 came when they lost the TO battle 1 when they tied the turnover battle. 1 loss came when they won the turnover battle.
    -Have to have an insider scorer.

  18. #18
    No White Flags Soundwave's Avatar
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    So since we are talking strategy here, what is the best gameplan to create turnovers.

    My team actually created the most when I played slow and never trapped or pressed. That was also when I gave up the fewest. I'm sure it differs for every team, but I have run multiple variations this season to get a reading on how my team plays in each and that was the best set for turnover ratio.

  19. #19
    All World Pelicans78's Avatar
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    It depends on the players. Some players create turnovers well. I'm top 5 in the league in steals and creating turnovers and I've used normal/sometimes and often/normal this season. I've gone down some since Manu was injured since he's great at getting steals. I think alot of trapping/pressing has to do with whether a team can defend in the halfcourt. Teams that defend well man to man shouldn't have to press or trap as much compared to teams that don't defend well.

  20. #20
    I know its just one game but my last tj me out vs them I lost by 20 but I'd say I have an elite defense (2nd in terms of points allowed) elite rebounding team (2nd highest margin that balls pointed out) dominating inside scorer in Webber in my last game vs hornets I tied the to battle got to the line 30 (THIRTY!!!) more times than them but got outrebounded by 14 and out shot by 35. KG fouled out early the only thing I can remotely think of is they are absolute monsters on offensive glass which is something we have no way to track. All of his players can go for 20 on a night because they get the amount of shots necessary. Me for example Webber is getting 20 then either BD jones Childress or Ostertag might depending on who gets enough shots but never do 2 or 3 of them.

  21. #21
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    What's your pace hornetsfan

  22. #22
    Normal

  23. #23
    Pistol Pete Would Be Proud!! LoCo89's Avatar
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    Welp this was mildly depressing
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  24. #24
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    The way I understand it is slower pace will put the ball in the hands if your scoring options more. The less scorers, the slower the pace needs to be and the more shots the scoring options will take , but the team as an overall will take less because they're trying to get the best shot overall (which is defined by you having scoring options).

    Meanwhile, if you have a ton of guys that can score, you want more shots to be hoisted up. You'll get more shots more evenly distributed when they get them earlier in the shot clock. I think very fast gets up like 105-110 shots, normal is 83-87ish and slow is like mid 70s. The faster your pace is the more shots other teams will get. The slower the less shots they get respective if their pace.

  25. #25
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    The Historically Great Hornets

    Quote Originally Posted by LoCo89 View Post
    Welp this was mildly depressing
    I was trying to get my mind right for the playoffs when I lose lol.

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