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Thread: NBA finalizing flopping procedures/Fine system has been announced

  1. #1
    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    NBA NBA finalizing flopping procedures/Fine system has been announced

    ELIZABETH, N.J. -- The NBA is about to act in hopes of stopping the floppers.

    Spokesman Tim Frank said Thursday the league is finalizing procedures to deal with flopping, the art of falling down when little or no contact was made in an effort to trick referees into calling a foul.

    Frank said the competition committee met two weeks ago and discussed plans that would go in place this season. Commissioner David Stern believes too many players are deceiving referees by flopping and has been seeking a way to properly penalize them.

    The procedures will likely involve a postgame review of the play by the league office, rather than an official calling an infraction during the game, Frank said. Players would likely be fined if the league determined they flopped.

    The proposed plan mirrors a "postgame analysis" option Stern discussed after the competition committee met in June. The league already retroactively reviews flagrant fouls to determine if they need to be upgraded or downgraded.
    http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/84...ayers-flopping

  2. #2
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    BG and CP wallets about to lighten.

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    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    Their wallets may lighten but flopping will still cost teams games. If the officials decide to call a foul on a flopping play sending said flopper to the free throw line, that could decide a game. I'll be happy they got fined for it because they may decide to stop doing it once their wallets are hit a few times but it won't help my team any once they've already lost the game.

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    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    Hey, I created a thread called stop the flop. I wish the flopping penalties were more severe, which is my argument. I think they should get suspended after 3 flops due to diminishing the integrity of the game.

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    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    Hey, I created a thread called stop the flop. I wish the flopping penalties were more severe, which is my argument. I think they should get suspended after 3 flops due to diminishing the integrity of the game.
    They're still deciding the punishment so who knows how severe they will actually be. Actually I think suspensions as you've suggested may stop the flop more than fines will.

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    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    Quote Originally Posted by HunnyB View Post
    They're still deciding the punishment so who knows how severe they will actually be. Actually I think suspensions as you've suggested may stop the flop more than fines will.
    Yeah, and mainly for the playoffs. Let it carry over like techs and if you've got two to start the playoffs well you'd better be careful. Maybe 5 but regardless.

  7. #7
    My stance has always been the refs should call what they see not what they presume. If they did that floppers wouldn't be rewarded.

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    The Voice of Reason Contributor RaisingTheBar's Avatar
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    It is about time they did something. Some of those plays are too judgmental to be called right then and there on the floor. It is nice that the NBA will have all angle to review these.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by da ThRONe View Post
    My stance has always been the refs should call what they see not what they presume. If they did that floppers wouldn't be rewarded.
    That's the difficult part. The good floppers know how to position themselves in order to deceive the refs. They know where the refs are and what they can see.

    I won't believe anything about flop punishment until I actually see it called in a game.

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    For...ev...er... The JNR's Avatar
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    Yeah, unless they're being fined an entire paycheck, flopping is going to continue. I can't really see a way for the floppers to be called for it in game, like Kibner said. It's hard for the ref to see everything in full motion.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    That's the difficult part. The good floppers know how to position themselves in order to deceive the refs. They know where the refs are and what they can see.

    I won't believe anything about flop punishment until I actually see it called in a game.

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    If your a good flopper so be it, but the majority of the flopping we see is pretty obvious and it's obvious live. It happens because the refs officiate to often on assumption. The league should be looking to add another ref to help cover more of the court.

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    The Franchise goat gorilla's Avatar
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    I applaud this. It will protect integrity of game a tad. I imagine they will treat them in the same manner as technical fouls. Once you accumulate so many a suspension will be given.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by da ThRONe View Post
    If your a good flopper so be it, but the majority of the flopping we see is pretty obvious and it's obvious live. It happens because the refs officiate to often on assumption. The league should be looking to add another ref to help cover more of the court.
    I agree about adding an extra official. But just keep in mind that what is obvious from many angles is not obvious from all. Game moves real fast and refs have to watch many things. They have room for improvement, certainly, but probably not as much as you think.

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    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    Some will like the league's answer to flopping, and others will say it's not enough. And while I recognize the benefit of taking it out of the referees' hands, the new approach -- if adopted -- could open up a whole new can of worms in a sports environment that clearly does not tolerate officiating incompetence. Suppose LeBron James drives to the basket on the final possession of a playoff game, with the Miami Heat trailing by a point. He misses the shot, but dupes the official into calling a shooting foul by flopping. James sinks both free throws, the Heat win the game and advance to the next round. But what happens when the league fines James $25,000 the next morning for flopping on the play? What the league would be saying, essentially, is that James shouldn't have been awarded free throws and the Heat shouldn't have won. Chaos, would ensue, as it often does with these controversies -- be it a disputed Hail Mary in the end zone or a superstar call late in an NBA game.
    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/2...further-review

    This almost sounds like the argument I'm trying to make. A post game fine won't help us after our team has lost a game due to a flop sending a player to the free throw line. I'd really like to see how they're going to do this.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    I agree about adding an extra official. But just keep in mind that what is obvious from many angles is not obvious from all. Game moves real fast and refs have to watch many things. They have room for improvement, certainly, but probably not as much as you think.

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    I'm fine with a little flopping. However I cannot believe every flop called is the result of the refs eyes being fooled like these guys are some great magicians. Clearly most times it them assuming because of a guys body language there must have been a foul and calls a foul instead of only calling with they've seen and know for sure. I can live with there being less calls. Honestly I think the game would benefit without a lot of the unnecessary stoppage.
    Last edited by da ThRONe; 09-28-2012 at 03:57 PM.

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    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    Referees actually stopped play to review this Greivis Vasquez flagrant foul on Reggie Evans last year. In real time they called a Flagrant 2 on Vasquez, which is about as serious as these things get. Vasquez would have been ejected, fined, yelled at by fans, tut-tutted by the media and maybe even victimized by a snarky David Stern comment or two.

    But on review, Vasquez did something that wouldn't have even stopped play in practice. Yes, he made contact with his elbow, but in professional sports that's a love tap -- and nothing compared to the legal but hard contact that Evans laid on Vasquez to start the interaction.

    What was egregious, however, was Evans' hilarious reaction: After taking an instant to gather himself, he wound up and threw his body backward, as if attempting a gymnastics move I'm pretty sure is called back walkover.

    How dreadful it must have been to have been one of those three referees huddling around the replay monitor. They knew they were had. They knew everyone at home, and in the audience knew the exact same thing. Oh, for shame. That is the moment when referees have the toughest, most embarrassing job in the world -- pride melting into a stinky puddle, like crayons on simmer -- before a global TV audience.

    Shame shift: From Vasquez, to the officials.

    But don't forget this key point! The shame lived rightly with Evans. And even once what really happened was clear Evans still got free throws for his team.

    Chalk it up to veteran trickery, gamesmanship, or anything else. Well played, Reggie.
    http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...-with-flopping

    I know most of us remember that Vasquez/Evans deal.

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    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    Quote Originally Posted by da ThRONe View Post
    I'm fine with a little flopping. However I cannot believe every flop called is the result of refs eyes where fooled like these guys are some great magicians. Clearly most times it them assuming because a guys body language there must have been a foul and calls a foul instead of only calling with they've seen and know for sure. I can live with there being less calls. Honestly I think the game would benefit without a lot of the unnecessary stoppage.
    These guys yelling bloody murder every time they shoot cheapens the game enough. Then you have all the CP3 BG, and some Lebron flops that were outrageous last year.I'm cool with guys falling down a little early on a charge; but some of it just makes me want to turn the game off and one of the biggest complaints I ALWAYS here from people who dislike the NBA. It's driving people away.

  18. #18
    CP3 has deceitful eyes ohnosono's Avatar
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    NBA refs already have far too much impact in a game. I think flopping says more about the rules than the ones who flop.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by BallSoHard View Post
    These guys yelling bloody murder every time they shoot cheapens the game enough. Then you have all the CP3 BG, and some Lebron flops that were outrageous last year.I'm cool with guys falling down a little early on a charge; but some of it just makes me want to turn the game off and one of the biggest complaints I ALWAYS here from people who dislike the NBA. It's driving people away.
    ee

    I guarantee if the refs only call for sure fouls these guys would stop behaving like they are made of feathers.

  20. #20
    Stoppages on this beautiful game kill me, so i'm all for fewer calls. I just think the refs have too much to look out for and that I'd what causes them to mis-call the obvious flops; they were too busy looking for one of the other hundred possible violations that could happen at that moment. So they use intuition and other things they picked up through the years that enables them to usually make the correct call.

    They have the hardest reffing job in sports, but still need to get better. The league could help them out by adding an additional ref out simplifying some of the rules. There may be other ways that haven't thought of that could help the refs to ensure the game remains fun to watch while enforcing fair play.

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  21. #21
    The Mad Titan    Contributor   
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kibner View Post
    Stoppages on this beautiful game kill me, so i'm all for fewer calls. I just think the refs have too much to look out for and that I'd what causes them to mis-call the obvious flops; they were too busy looking for one of the other hundred possible violations that could happen at that moment. So they use intuition and other things they picked up through the years that enables them to usually make the correct call.

    They have the hardest reffing job in sports, but still need to get better. The league could help them out by adding an additional ref out simplifying some of the rules. There may be other ways that haven't thought of that could help the refs to ensure the game remains fun to watch while enforcing fair play.

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    I agree but I like the idea of the league reviewing things on the back end after games and just handing out suspensions after said number of violations.

  22. #22
    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    On Heat Index, Tom Haberstroh digs into the NBA's new, as-yet unclear anti-flopping policy.

    Erik Spoelstra and LeBron James are all for it, hoping it will cut down on, essentially, players taking slight contact from James and then hurtling to the floor as if shot.

    But Heat forward Shane Battier is not on board. Battier has done his fair share of flopping -- he's aggressive and at times inventive in taking the charge. To some, hearing Battier opposes the new rule is a sign it's a good one.

    Read what he has to say, though, and it's a tale of a culture of flopping that runs deeper than we had suspected -- all the way to the referees. Battier says, emphatically, that referees tell players to flop. I'm not kidding!

    Here's Battier:
    "The unfortunate thing about the block/charge (distinction) is that I’ve had many, many times where a ref told me that you have to go to the floor to get the call. By the letter of the law, I’ve taken a hit, but I’ve stood on my feet. Even though I’ve gotten nailed, the ref calls it a no-call. I say, ‘Ref, what’s wrong with that (charge)?’ He says, ‘You have to go down to get the call.’

    "Inherently, there’s something wrong with that.”

    Yes, yes there is.

    Now, you might wonder why a referee would do something like that. Here's my best guess: Credibility matters a lot in their jobs. They need to be seen as making good calls. Call a charge on a guy who knocked somebody down, and you're seen as sensible. Call a charge after some contact on a drive which didn't send a body flying, and we all know what happens next: commentators, fans, everybody is screaming to "let them play."

    Make a lot of calls that look funny on television, and it quickly becomes very tough to earn a reputation as a great referee.
    http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...f-made-me-flop

  23. #23
    This has been my point. The refs aren't doing their jobs. They are too busy worried about how things "look" and not what really happened.

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    All World Contributor FlyGirl's Avatar
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    The league makes a statement refuting this claim in 5, 4, 3, ......

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by HunnyB View Post
    The league makes a statement refuting this claim in 5, 4, 3, ......
    LOL I was thinking the samething. I can't imagine David "Pimp Daddy" Stern will let this kind of inside info circulate.

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