The Bass issue

[gerryv]

As someone that watched Bass from day one let me explain. When he first became a Hornet he had some problems grasping what his role should be. He saw himself as a scorer and the staff wanted him to develop and focus on his rebounding.

Yes it was a question of his adapting to the system of "when and where he need to be " or how to get from spot A to spot B.he wasn't aware at the time of how to " finish plays" and sosme other little factors.

Of course a staff has to face the question of " do we adapt our style for a young player?" or do we stick to what we do for the sake of the others ?
Bass hadn't earned his bones yet for the staff to make that concesson.

Bass goes to Dallas and realizes his role is that of a " hustle type banger"
he learns how to play ( he matures) and accepts the fact of hwere his value is and what style to play ( again he matures)

Byron Scott has recently said he would now change a few things to adpat to what Bass does well. Bass has put in more time enchancing his skills as a player. ( players at times don't see their limitations when they first arrive into the NBA).

His knowledge of the game has improved as has his knowledge of himself as a player. THats called experience.

So it was a combinaton of a few things...experience....knowledge of how to play...accepting limitations and recognizing strengths and skill development.

Sometimes players need to hear it from " another voice". Another voice telling you what needs to be done. You can't compare Bass the present to Bass the past and say there weren't any changes.

He has improved in certain areas ( and yes rebounding needs to still become more of a constant ).......Scott would use him differently now vs the past . he admits that....But of course Bass isn't the same player.

Plus the JR Smith example isnt a fair one cause when Smith was a Hornet he was way to immature and lacked pounds of focus on how a pro is supposed to prepare. Yes the argument can be made of you draft a player that young you have to assume some baggage comes with the choice.

Thats what makes developing and putting a roster together the most difficult thing in sports...

Yes they shot at getting him back

gv

[Harvey]

Thanks for the scoop V. When Bass was on the floor in Dallas did they run their usual stuff or did they simplify things for Bass?

When you say Bass is different, it's not just the maturing either in my opinion. He's obviously in better shape. When Bass was here his conditioning wasn't up to standard.

I'm glad to see he has matured. From where I see it, Scott's willingness/desire to bring Bass back is proof that BS is a fair head caoch. He's not holding the past against the player nor should he in this case.

[iedmunds]

Interesting read V-Man. Thanks.

[gerryv]

Dallas told him what they wanted as some of the things he didnt do in New Orleans emerged. Bass was told he " isnt the scorer" he thought himself to be and Dallas simply showed him and told him where and how he could make a living in the NBA. LIke I stated earlier sometimes it takes another "voice" repeating what was said at a players first stop.

" maybe they are right ?" is how a player may respond. So he begins to set solid screens...rebound....shoot from only certain spots on the floor....get stronger.....play smarter ( accept his role )..also confidence plays a role.

When he arrived from LSU he thought he could do the samethings in the NBA.
Wrong ! Dallas limited what he was allowed to do and this let him focus on a frew things....now he could " just play vs thinking before moving" he became more of an instinctive player thus making him quicker.

He was told the samethings in New Orleans but sometimes youth turns the deaf ear. When they hear it again they finally see the truth.

Credit Scott for saying what Harvey mentioned in his post.

Gaining experience can be painful at times. Thats why others benifit from early msitakes players make. Reality sets in and the player has to loook it in the eye.

Like they say..." its all in the timing" you learn ( hopefully from the past)

GV

[Big Fan]

I don't buy the storyline that Bass figured out in Dallas that Byron was right all along and he needed to focus on rebounding and defense. Bass still shoots an awful lot of guarded 15 foot jumpers for a backup 4 without great range. He's still below the 1 reb/4 minute rate you look for from an NBA 4, so he's not a monster rebounder. He got to play in Dallas because he is athletic, stong and tough -- and nobody has enough guys like that off the bench. Plus, even with his "scorers mentality" he shot 49.5%

I would like to bring him back because the Hornets need those qualities, AND they need another 15 bench points per night. Bass can get them 10 of those if he's allowed to shoot. I fear that Scott buys the GerryV story line and, if the Hornets are lucky enough to get him back, Scott buries Bass on the bench as soon as he takes a few shots.

Sad to say, but if I'm Bass, I'm looking to go to Orlando. Really, anywhere but New Orleans.

[killah]

I think the fact that Bass sounds like he is eager to come back shows that he may have lacked maturity as a player when he came into the league but he does have character. I have noticed that when you add character with talent to a player in the NBA, chances are you have found a productive player for your club provided they stay healthy.

For me, I still would not take JR Smith back because although he has matured as a basketball player, he still lacks character on and off the court. Although Smith is really talented, his talent doesn't make up for his lack of character.

I have never met much less know these two players but I feel I have seen them play enough to justify making these statements as a fan. So for me I think there is a big difference between maturity and character.

[hornetsjuice]

Don't buy all that either, Dallas does what most NBA teams do and that is to use the talent you have the best way you can. Scott did not play Bass any legit minutes to do anything. One minute hear or there and you yank him will rattle any player. You put players in situations where they CAN succeed and help your team win some games. A coach who wants to can do this. BS does not know how to do that and that is not his philosophy. He has said in the past that he has no time to teach a player and that he is all about winning at the moment, so with that you get little development on the court from your young guys and that is what has hurt this team, the window closed on the talented older guys and they got too old and they could not to do it for 82 games. Hopefully they change this philosophy this year. I would love to have Bass back, we need some help on this roster.

[FlyGirl]

So why would Bass even consider returning to the Hornets since the "storyline" isn't true? Is he only returning in hopes that Scott will be gone after next season so he's willing to gut it out with him as his coach for a season?

Is he yanking the Hornets' chain and really intends to snub them by signing elsewhere just so he can tell the Hornets "Back then they didn't want me, now I'm hot they all on me"?

[Defuz]

V-man!! Thanks for your insight on Bass. I'd like to see him come back, but I fear his price may be too steep unless we can reduce costs elsewhere. That's a big 'if'.

killah, you're bang on with JR. Spend any time watching him celebrate every basket as if each one will ensure his induction into the Hall of Fame and you will realize, that to him, it's all about him. He brings great energy and instant offense, but I see him make bone head plays every game, dumb fouls, no defense etc. Every now and then he suddenly sparkles, but on the whole, he's an immature kid who needs a very short leash.

hornetsjuice and big fan........I'm speechless.....wow.

[JKM]

Perhaps Scott was not as good from a coaching standpoint to convey the message, so as the pupil listens and learns. I understand your point, but Scott gets no blame for being a sorry teacher?

[UNO Gracias]

I would like to sign him before we deal TC. If we can send tc to detroit for Brown and Maxiell, my goodness. We would have more depth at the 4 and 5 than we could dream. Bass/West/Maxiell/ Brown.

Not to thread jack, but I guess what I'm trying to say is, if I can change, and you can change, everybody can change.

[FlyGirl]

Why do people want Kwame Brown? I'm assuming it's for salary purposes only right?

[Defuz]

Perhaps Scott was not as good from a coaching standpoint to convey the message, so as the pupil listens and learns. I understand your point, but Scott gets no blame for being a sorry teacher?

Oh, there are certainly some issues there, but I was floored with two peeps and their, "I don't buy that..." openings. Floored.

[thefuture]

Why do people want Kwame Brown? I'm assuming it's for salary purposes only right?

Correct

[Spaniard]

I don't doubt anything you are saying V, or at least I don't want to. My only problem I guess is the fact that I watched Brandon grow up, all the way through playing at LSU. He was the SEC player of the year, but because of his height as a four, he dropped in the draft.

He basically never stepped on the floor with the Hornets. I get that coach may want him to earn some things, but how were we to truly know what he could do when he never played. And then he went to Dallas, and I didn't see a different more refined Brandon. I saw the exact same player I saw playing at LSU.

Now I give Byron credit for a few things. JR Smith said flat out everything that happened here was JR's fault. And Byron admitted flat out that he should have given Brandon the opportunity and it was his fault. I don't have a problem with Coach's decision since he's really already admitted it was a mistake. The true bad coaching is not realizing mistakes.

No one should be surprised Brandon wants to come back, he's from here, he has friends on the team, all he ever wanted to do was play for the Hornets. And fortunetly, coach has made it known that if given a second chance, Brandon will get that opportunity. Now we just have to see how it plays out.

[UNO Gracias]

Kwame has that contract that people want. Between Kwame and AD next year, and Peja the following. If the hornets do things right they could really peddle bad players for solid product.

[Spaniard]

Oh, there are certainly some issues there, but I was floored with two peeps and their, "I don't buy that..." openings. Floored.

PS- don't take my post above as calling BS in anyway. Simply friendly discussion and I admit, I was not around Hornets practices everyday to know diddly squat.

[Kramer26]

Bass didn't get hardly any playing time with the Hornets so I don't know how people can compare "present" and "past" Brandon Bass. Does anyone here want to think that he may be the same guy but Dallas just decided to play him more and he stepped up and showed everyone what he could do with extended playing time.

[durun]

When Bass played here he was always looking over his shoulder. He was playing like he was afraid of making a mistake. Scott simply never gave Bass the opportunity.
Bass will not sign with the Hornets as long as B.S. is the coach. He has been around Kidd too long comparing horror stories.

[Harvey]

Whats funny is the BS people will believe.....versus the facts they wont. I'll take Gerry's position on this over anyone else here. His tenure in the league, work in other sports like the NFL, past basketball coaching experience, time with these very players and coaches, NBA and pro sports colleague networks etc. are something no one here can come close to matching.

I don't think Byron is a bad teacher, but he's certainly had some bad students.

V puts the Bass situation in words I've struggle to come up with....but it's true. After hearing it from a different voice, Bass finally came to the conclusion it was him. When he started doing what the Mav's asked of him, his game prorgressed in other areas as well. First and foremost, Bass needs to be a banger...which sets everything else up. Why is it that you guys want him...for his shot? It's the physical presence that we all want.

Killah, great point about the combination of character, talent and maturity. No one here ever doubted Bass' character or talent...but people are quick to use the "hater" term without drilling it down piece by piece.

The issue was immaturity and it complicated his ability to be coachable, get in great shape, etc. Bass isn't the first young guy not to listen and won't be the last. Ever wonder why talented players who can't put it together often start to click after bouncing around once or twice? The league or coaches they've struggled with in the past don't change, they do. Every wonder why college stars fizzle in the NBA, NFL, etc.? It's because they think they arleady know it all and don't have to get physically stronger, mentally prepared, etc. at a higher level.

[hornetsjuice]

When Bass played here he was always looking over his shoulder. He was playing like he was afraid of making a mistake. Scott simply never gave Bass the opportunity.
Bass will not sign with the Hornets as long as B.S. is the coach. He has been around Kidd too long comparing horror stories.

You my friend must have been actually seeing what went down too. It is funny how you can watch a player play almost every game in college and people want to then tell you what kind of kid he is, then he goes to another team and does exactly what you thought he could do in the NBA.

[Harvey]

Back to the Hr.com Lounge for me!

/I should have known better

[Big Fan]

Does anyone here want to think that he may be the same guy but Dallas just decided to play him more and he stepped up and showed everyone what he could do with extended playing time.

I do.

So does John Hollinger:

"After languishing at the end of the Hornets' bench for two years, Dallas liberated Bass and allowed him to showcase a surprising array of offensive moves -- Bass averaged 16.8 points per 40 minutes, shot 49.9 percent with a relatively high free-throw rate, and was also a pleasant surprise at the stripe (82.2 percent).

From a statistical perspective, this was a major surprise, as Bass had done nothing in his two seasons in New Orleans and put up paltry numbers in the few chances he got to play (It was also a bit ironic -- the Hornets are desperate for frontcourt depth)."

So I still disagree with the argument that Bass figured out he needed to rebound and defend instead of shoot. He was and is the same player. He just got a chance to play -- including at the offensive end.

Either the Hornets realize they made a mistake and they are trying to make it right, or they are still fooling themselves thinking that Bass will come in and rebound and defend without taking most of the 15 footers that present themselves.

Either way, I can't see why Bass would willingly go back to that same situation. I think he's playing the Hornets to get a bigger deal from another team.

Again, I would love to have him. I just dont buy the whole, we let a draft pick walk away for nothing two years ago, but now that he's changed his 'tude we want him back desperately. Can anyone think of a similar situation in the NBA?

Management makes good moves, management makes bad moves. GerryV & Harvey, willing to discuss any bad moves by Hornets management?

[Harvey]

Management makes good moves, management makes bad moves. GerryV & Harvey, willing to discuss any bad moves by Hornets management?

I've you've been around here any length of time and have read my posts, you know I'll drop the gloves at the drop of a dime....but only when it's warranted. Nonetheless, I think I'll go back to the sabatical I was enjoying away from this forum. I really don't care who agrees or disagrees....and don't have the desire to really discuss it.

/hr.com lounge bound for good

[thefuture]

In the next episode we shall argue that the world is indeed flat